Israel at war

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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Absurd . it has that meaning only to people who are trying to camouflage and sanitize its tru meaning. Why don’t you ask Hamas what it means. I ll give you a hint. No Jews in Israel/Palestine. Not no zionists. No Jews.
Why is it ok that the same phrase is in the Likud charter and Netanyahu has used it to wipe Palestine off the maps?
Why does that make it ok to try to wipe Palestinians off the planet?

 

toguy5252

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2009
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I dont care about Hamas and dont have to ask them. This is not a slogan used by Hamas.

This is a slogan used in the west by pro-Palestinian supporters who care about Palestinian civilians. As do I. So it only refers to Palestinians living in freedom and equality with the Israelis.
Get real. It is a call to rid Israel of Jews. Plain and simple.
 

versitile1

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2013
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So IDF estimated they killed about 20k of Hamas terrorists...they didn't say palestinians...
Everyone here already knows you see all Palestinians, even children and babies, as hamas. You think little babies deserve to be bombed and buried under rubble, just because of where they were born.
 
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Butler1000

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What do you care? You want them all ethnically cleansed and collectively punished. You must have a nice spot picked out in the West Bank, or is it in Gaza?
You Can't answer be because there isn't one. And there won't be. So now the next question is would the Palestinians accept an international force coming and ruling the Gaza until peace deal can be achieved?
 

Butler1000

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Oct 31, 2011
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Assasinated by Israel or in an Israeli prison. Any new or emerging leadership will be targeted for death or imprisonment.

Israel is terrified of effective Palestinian leadership.
Im listening. Names? Who are they?
 

versitile1

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2013
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You Can't answer be because there isn't one. And there won't be. So now the next question is would the Palestinians accept an international force coming and ruling the Gaza until peace deal can be achieved?
Why would I bother? All you do is paint all Palestinians and Muslims with the same brush, blame the majority for the actions of a few, mention unrelated conflicts, and bring up the Tamil Tigers. Those are literally all your talking points.
 
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Butler1000

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Why would I bother? All you do is paint all Palestinians and Muslims with the same brush, blame the majority for the actions of a few, mention unrelated conflicts, and bring up the Tamil Tigers.
No, I'm stating that in the 40 years I've looked at this, read books on it by scholars, watched the news, back to the original Camp David Accords, I haven't seen a way forward on peace due to Muslims derailing the process. That corruption is rife, internal fighting is fire, religious extremism is rife, interference from foreign Muslim nations is rife. And quite simply refusal to compromise and get past old grievances, and swallow pride is endemic.

But that if what you say is true then a real charismatic leader could over come it. Could rally all of the peaceful Palestinians to the cause. Stifle the extremism and gain real traction in the international community and within Israel to get it done.

And in 40 years none have come forward. Or been killed by their own people. Dismissing my question is proof you have given up as well. You are resigned to winner take all. Just like me.

Either actually show proof of hope, or admit I'm right.
 
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Klatuu

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Dec 31, 2022
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Hamas releases 2 female hostages as ceasefire extends to a 7th day: Full coverage of Israel-Hamas war (yahoo.com)

It appears that the ceasefire pause has been extended. Hopefully it will keep being extended with more and more hostage/prisoners being exchanged.

This despite the killing of 3 innocent Israelis at a bus stop in Jerusalem yesterday, which Hamas has admitted was carried out by members of their military wing.

Thankfully Israel chose to not let that act of murderous and vile Hamas aggression scuttle the deal.

Anyways here we are closing in on 10,000 posts in this thread. How high can we go?
Delusional
 

Klatuu

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2022
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No, I'm stating that in the 40 years I've looked at this, read books on it by scholars, watched the news, back to the original Camp David Accords, I haven't seen a way forward on peace due to Muslims derailing the process. That corruption is rife, internal fighting is fire, religious extremism is rife, interference from foreign Muslim nations is rife. And quite simply refusal to compromise and get past old grievances, and swallow pride is endemic.

But that if what you say is true then a real charismatic leader could over come it. Could rally all of the peaceful Palestinians to the cause. Stifle the extremism and gain real traction in the international community and within Israel to get it done.

And in 40 years none have come forward. Or been killed by their own people. Dismissing my question is proof you have given up as well. You are resigned to winner take all. Just like me.

Either actually show proof of hope, or admit I'm right.
Give us the name of the books you’ve read by “scholars “.
 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
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Toronto
Which war zone is that?
The one created by IDF occupying Palestinian territories? Imposing embargos, cutting off electricity, water, medicine, bombing hospitals, medical vehicles, murdering journalists, that war zone?
Right. The war zone that came into being immediately after Oct. 7. The one created by Hamas.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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Right. The war zone that came into being immediately after Oct. 7. The one created by Hamas.
Basketcase said they were at war before Oct.
Was he lying?

ISRAEL AND OCCUPIED PALESTINIAN TERRITORIES 2022
Israel’s continuing oppressive and discriminatory system of governing Palestinians in Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territories (OPT) constituted a system of apartheid, and Israeli officials committed the crime of apartheid under international law. Israeli forces launched a three-day offensive on the occupied Gaza Strip in August during which they committed apparent war crimes. This compounded the impact of a 15-year ongoing Israeli blockade that amounts to illegal collective punishment and further fragments Palestinian territory. Israel escalated its crackdown on Palestinians’ freedom of association. It also imposed arbitrary restrictions on freedom of movement and closures that amounted to collective punishment, mainly in the northern West Bank, ostensibly in response to armed attacks by Palestinians on Israeli soldiers and settlers. The year saw a rise in the number of Palestinians unlawfully killed and seriously injured by Israeli forces during raids in the West Bank. Administrative detentions of Palestinians hit a 14-year high, and torture and other ill-treatment continued. Israeli forces demolished al-Araqib village in the Negev/Naqab for the 211th time. A further 35 Palestinian-Bedouin towns in Israel were still denied formal recognition and residents faced possible forcible transfer. Authorities failed to process asylum claims for thousands of asylum seekers, and imposed restrictions on their right to work.

Background
In March, the UN Special Rapporteur on the human rights situation in the OPT determined that the “political system of entrenched rule” in the occupied West Bank and Gaza Strip “satisfies the prevailing evidentiary standard for the existence of apartheid”. In November, the UN Special Rapporteur on the right to adequate housing reached the same conclusion in relation to Israel’s policies of home demolitions. Some states, including South Africa, condemned Israeli apartheid, echoing statements by Palestinian, Israeli and international human rights organizations. Despite this growing recognition, Israel continued to enjoy impunity thanks to the support of its key allies.

In October, the United Nations Independent International Commission of Inquiry on the Occupied Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem, and in Israel, concluded that the occupation of the OPT is unlawful due to its permanence and Israel’s measures to annex Palestinian land in law and in practice. In 2022, such measures included retroactive authorization of settlement outposts, including by the Israeli Supreme Court.

In November, Israel held its fifth elections in three years after the collapse of an ideologically diverse coalition government, which continued to discriminate against Palestinians on both sides of the Green Line. The vote was polarized between those supporting and opposing former prime minister Benjamin Netanyahu, while consensus on maintaining Israel’s occupation of Palestinian and Syrian territories remained. The right-wing bloc, led by Benjamin Netanyahu and a religious-nationalist coalition, secured a majority of seats and formed a government in December.

Apartheid
In February, Amnesty International released a 280-page report showing how Israel was imposing an institutionalized regime of oppression and domination against the Palestinian people wherever it exercised control over their rights, fragmenting and segregating Palestinian citizens of Israel, residents of the OPT and Palestinian refugees denied the right of return. Through massive seizures of land and property, unlawful killings, infliction of serious injuries, forcible transfers, arbitrary restrictions on freedom of movement, and denial of nationality, among other inhuman or inhumane acts, Israeli officials would be responsible for the crime against humanity of apartheid, which falls under the jurisdiction of the ICC.1

In March, Israeli authorities re-enacted the Citizenship and Entry into Israel Law (temporary order) that imposes sweeping restrictions on Palestinian family unification between Israeli citizens or residents and their spouses from the OPT to maintain a Jewish demographic majority.

In July, the Israeli Supreme Court upheld a law authorizing the interior minister to strip citizens of their citizenship if convicted of acts that amount to “breach of allegiance to the state”. Since its enactment in 2008, application of the law has only been considered against Palestinian citizens. On 20 September, the Israeli Appeals Tribunal approved the revocation of stay or temporary residency permits of 10 Palestinians – four children, three women and three men – living in Jerusalem because they are distant relatives of a Palestinian assailant. On 18 December, Israel deported French-Palestinian human rights defender Salah Hammouri following the revocation of his East Jerusalem residency.2

Unlawful attacks and killings
Armed conflict between Israel and Palestinian armed groups in Gaza
On 5 August, Israel launched an offensive on the Gaza Strip targeting the Palestinian Islamic Jihad and its armed wing, destroying or damaging some 1,700 Palestinian homes and displacing hundreds of civilians. The Israeli army and Palestinian armed groups committed apparent war crimes during the three days of fighting. (See State of Palestine entry.)3

According to the UN, 49 Palestinians were killed, including 31 civilians. Amnesty International established that Israeli forces killed 17 of the civilians, including eight children. Seven civilians, including four children, were killed by a rocket that misfired apparently launched by a Palestinian armed group. On 7 August, an Israeli missile, apparently fired by a drone, hit Al-Falluja cemetery in Jabalia refugee camp, killing five children and injuring one, in an apparent direct attack on civilians or indiscriminate attack.

West Bank
Israeli forces killed 151 Palestinians in the occupied West Bank, including East Jerusalem, and injured 9,875, according to OCHA-OPT, amid a surge of military incursions that involved excessive use of force, including unlawful killings and apparent extrajudicial executions.4 Defense for Children International-Palestine reported that Israeli forces or settlers killed 36 children across the West Bank and East Jerusalem.

On 11 May, Israeli soldiers killed Shirin Abu Akleh, a Palestinian-US Al Jazeera correspondent, and injured her colleague, while they were covering an Israeli army raid in Jenin Camp. In September, the Israeli authorities admitted that an Israeli soldier “likely” killed the journalist but concluded that no criminal offence had been committed.

 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
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Toronto
Thanks for this. As has been alleged, a lot of IDF propaganda is just bullshit and lies. Including the "tunnels" under al-shifa that they showed.
How classic. Everybody wants proof and once they are shown it the screams of "LIES". The classic move of someone who's lost the debate.

Tell us that the film was made by Steven Spielberg, the Jew.
 
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shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
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Toronto
Basketcase said they were at war before Oct.
Was he lying?
Show us the quote.

Maybe you're lying. Everybody is referring to this current war as having started immediately after Oct. 7.

That's the day that Netanyahu declared war on Hamas. That was the day all these new tactics and strategy were initiated by Israel. Only a fool or a liar would not recognize how things changed so much on that day.
 

Butler1000

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2011
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Give us the name of the books you’ve read by “scholars “.
Scars of War, Wounds of Peace. The Israeli-Arab Tragedy By Shlomo Ben-ami. Published 2005.

As an example. There were others loaned to me be teachers, friends, from the library when I was younger. But that one is especially good. I highly recommend it.

It encapsulates in my opinion the best information on the history of the region, and especially shows how Anwar Sadat was probably the last great hope for a greater peace treaty and stability in the region.
 
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