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Israel at war

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squeezer

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Frankfooter said:
But Israel does not have the legal right to self defence against the people they occupy in the first place.
The occupation is illegal
The blockade is illegal
Every settlement is illegal
Apartheid is illegal

You can't then use the claim that there are human shields to kill civilians.
If shack held you at gunpoint as a human shield the cops in Toronto would not be justified in killing you both to get squeezer.
Same in Gaza, you can't kill 70% women and children and then claim you were only aiming at Hamas.
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Of course not, Israel should open the gates and welcome Hamas and its fighters in for some coffee and crumpets.

ps...Squeezer would never be in the open or among the civilian population. It's the brothels that would have to be deeeeeep underground for everyone's safety.
 
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mandrill

mandrill

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Klatuu said:
That’s just a nonsensical word salad.

Talk about the depopulation of the indigenous Palestinian population. There is ample scholarship and documentation available.
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You miss my point, which is that you have to deal with the current population mix - which is 73% Jewish - if you're going to realistically and pragmatically discuss the future and its alternative choices.

Can I make it any simpler for you? Or is even this still a "word salad"?
 
mandrill

mandrill

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mandrill

mandrill

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Frankfooter said:
But Israel does not have the legal right to self defence against the people they occupy in the first place.
The occupation is illegal
The blockade is illegal
Every settlement is illegal
Apartheid is illegal
Click to expand...
All that stuff is perfectly legal, except perhaps for the settlements, which are - unfortunately - winked at by the Israeli government.
Frankfooter said:
You can't then use the claim that there are human shields to kill civilians.
If shack held you at gunpoint as a human shield the cops in Toronto would not be justified in killing you both to get squeezer.
Same in Gaza, you can't kill 70% women and children and then claim you were only aiming at Hamas.
Click to expand...
But Shack wouldn't routinely go out to mass murder and rape and then surround himself with women and children and yell "Fuck you, war criminal!" at the police who try to arrest him.
 
mandrill

mandrill

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Kautilya said:
There is no requirement for "demographic balance" which is basically justifications for ethno-states. Can you imagine Trudeau saying that? Or Biden? Or anyone else in any other part of the world?

Just bring everyone under 1 government, give them equal rights and perhaps work toward a system where Israel becomes a full constitutional, secular democracy.

But the goal of the Israeli state is to take as much from the Palestinians as possible and push and squeeze them into as small a land area as possible. Which is the crime here.
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But that wouldn't work, would it?

Because the Palestinians hate the Jews and are influenced and dominated by extremist Islamic groups like HAMAS.

If shit like 7 October didn't take place, you might have an argument.

Look at the Muslim regimes in the Middle East and tell me if you love them:..... Iran - repressive, vicious, fundamentalist Islamic theocracy; Saudi - repressive, vicious, fundamentalist Islamic monarchy; Syria - repressive, vicious, dictatorship, riven with civil war; Lebanon - recovering from decades of sectarian strife; Turkey - repressive, vicious, fundamentalist Islamic pseudo democracy.

It's not as though Israel is right next to France and Belgium. peaceful, tolerant, democratic countries.

And all those Muslim countries hate Israel. How long would it take before Palestinians vote to drive out the Jews, if they had the vote in Israel?
 
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Leimonis

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mandrill said:
But that wouldn't work, would it?

Because the Palestinians hate the Jews and are influenced and dominated by extremist Islamic groups like HAMAS.

If shit like 7 October didn't take place, you might have an argument.

Look at the Muslim regimes in the Middle East and tell me if you love them:..... Iran - repressive, vicious, fundamentalist Islamic theocracy; Saudi - repressive, vicious, fundamentalist Islamic monarchy; Syria - repressive, vicious, dictatorship, riven with civil war; Lebanon - recovering from decades of sectarian strife; Turkey - repressive, vicious, fundamentalist Islamic pseudo democracy.

It's not as though Israel is right next to France and Belgium. peaceful, tolerant, democratic countries.

And all those Muslim countries hate Israel. How long would it take before Palestinians vote to drive out the Jews, if they had the vote in Israel?
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But why let reality stand in the way of virtue signaling?
 
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Klatuu

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mandrill said:
You miss my point, which is that you have to deal with the current population mix - which is 73% Jewish - if you're going to realistically and pragmatically discuss the future and its alternative choices.

Can I make it any simpler for you? Or is even this still a "word salad"?
Click to expand...
Still a word salad. Deal with the forced depopulation of the original Palestinian inhabitants and all that follows from it. Its real. It’s fully documented and resources are at your fingertips. It’s covered by international human rights law. It will explain why the percentage of Jews is 73%. It will explain why millions of Palestinians lost their homes and property.

There is nothing real or pragmatic about ignoring it. It’s racist and delusional.
 
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Paprika

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Klatuu said:
Still a word salad. Deal with the forced depopulation of the original Palestinian inhabitants and all that follows from it. Its real. It’s fully documented and resources are at your fingertips. It’s covered by international human rights law. It will explain why the percentage of Jews is 73%. It will explain why millions of Palestinians lost their homes and property.

There is nothing real or pragmatic about ignoring it. It’s racist and delusional.
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Many people lose their homes and property in every war, like those Syrians. No point arguing who is an "original inhabitant". If they had won in 1948, the jews would have lost their homes and property.

Would you fight for the human rights of those original inhabitants of Carthage after they got destroyed by Rome? Would you move back to Africa where your ancestor was an "original inhabitant".

Don't bring up "international human rights law" unless somebody could somehow enforce it.
 
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Leimonis

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Kautilya said:
There was no call to action for violence there. Intifada means "civil uprising". A civil uprising is not a call to action for violence and even more importantly it is not a call to action for violence, IN CANADA. So no laws were broken here.
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Civil uprising my fucking ass


The following is a partial list of civilian casualties in the Second Intifada.

According to the International Institute for Counter-Terrorism, 887 (78 percent) of the 1,137 Israelis killed in attacks from September 2000 – 2005 were civilians.[1] Another 8,341 Israelis were wounded during this period, including 5,676 civilians and 2,665 security forces personnel.[2] The majority of casualties were caused by suicide bombings, though Israelis have also been killed by planted bombs, shootings, stonings, stabbings, lynchings, rockets, and other methods of attack.[2]

According to B'Tselem, in the ten years from 2000–2010, of the 6371 Palestinians killed by Israeli forces, at least 2996 did not participate in hostilities when killed, and 1317 were minors. Out of 1083 Israelis killed, 741 were civilians (124 minors).[3]
 
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Klatuu

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Paprika said:
Many people lose their homes and property in every war, like those Syrians. No point arguing who is an "original inhabitant". If they had won in 1948, the jews would have lost their homes and property.

Would you fight for the human rights of those original inhabitants of Carthage after they got destroyed by Rome? Would you move back to Africa where your ancestor was an "original inhabitant".

Don't bring up "international human rights law" unless somebody could somehow enforce it.
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If you believe that, you just destroyed the zionist argument that this is their homeland and they are entitled to it.
 
B

Butler1000

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Kautilya said:
There is no requirement for "demographic balance" which is basically justifications for ethno-states. Can you imagine Trudeau saying that? Or Biden? Or anyone else in any other part of the world?

Just bring everyone under 1 government, give them equal rights and perhaps work toward a system where Israel becomes a full constitutional, secular democracy.

But the goal of the Israeli state is to take as much from the Palestinians as possible and push and squeeze them into as small a land area as possible. Which is the crime here.
Click to expand...
Muslims don't want that. Neither do Jews. So how do you propose to force it on both dides?
 
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