Trump/Zelensky deal turns into Jerry Springer episode

[WyattEarp]

Paint me a picture of what a successful outcome in Ukraine looks like to you.

I'm not sure anyone here can.

There is modern precedence for proxy wars being fought to standoffs and the U.S. pursuing containment with nuclear powers. The group that seeks a total victory for the Ukraine is either naive or supporting further conflict for the sake of opposing Trump. I would hope for their own conscience it's the former.

The Biden Administration should have ended this war when it became clear that the Ukraine was fighting in a grinding stalemate.

 

[mellowjello]

There's sentiment and then there's pocket book.

I agree, that's the only chance Poilievre has, to firmly tie Carney's policies to Trudeau's as per Oracle's post.
If Carney can distance himself enough, Poilievre's done.
IMO, Poilievre is not a bad guy but I don't think he's that likeable and his main appeal was the total disdain for Trudeau.
With Trudeau gone it's back to square one and with Trump and Ford securely in place, it may not even be that.

I think Poilievre has to swing for the fences and try to sell a bolder economic/industrial vision for the country, as well as
showing a willingness to ween off U.S. dependency.
Trudeau bashing and character assassination of whoever won't cut it anymore I don't think.
People have seen enough of that and understand that won't guarantee anything better.

 

[mandrill]

Z could use Taras Bulba now.

Nah. Bulba would have gone straight for the wine cellar and looted that first.

 

[stinkynuts]

JD Vance continously demanding that Ukraine thank them is sickening. Imagine what kind of husband and father this prick is.

Fact check: Zelensky thanked Trump and the USA 33 times.

https://www.cnn.com/2025/02/28/politics/volodymyr-zelensky-thankful-us-fact-check/index.html

 

[mandrill]

I'm not sure anyone here can.

There is modern precedence for proxy wars being fought to standoffs and the U.S. pursuing containment with nuclear powers. The group that seeks a total victory for the Ukraine is either naive or supporting further conflict for the sake of opposing Trump. I would hope for their own conscience it's the former.

The Biden Administration should have ended this war when it became clear that the Ukraine was fighting in a grinding stalemate.

Grinding stalemate.... sort of like the Eastern Front in 1917. What happened next, Earp?

 

[Butler1000]

I will ask you again,



I know you cannot answer my questions honestly because you would be admitting for the last 4 years you fucked up.

It's a strawman, narrowed question. The real question is, would she have been a better president. And that depends on your idea of what's better.

To many in the USA, who don't want to fund wars, Trump is right. I'm a Canadian. I don't get a say in USA tax dollars.

Absolutely he is shitty on Canada, and Europe, and basically the world. And again. It's what USA voters chose. I don't get a say.

My posts were observations on how the Democratic party was out of step with American Opinion, chose a shitty leader, haven't had a real primary since Obama, were hypocrites and had lost their base due to been ineffective.

I was right. That is what you don't like. I predicted the outcome. That doesn't mean support.

 

[WyattEarp]

Grinding stalemate.... sort of like the Eastern Front in 1917. What happened next, Earp?

One side or the other collapses.

If you are seeking a collapse of Putin's regime, perhaps you want Trump to commit U.S. doughboys to the lines.

PS- I don't think you could have possibly thought the history through.

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

This is about Global Security. Having Russia expand, especially into Europe is not in the best interest of America

Making peace with Russia is the best global security you can have

 

[SchlongConery]

Making peace with Russia is the best global security you can have

With due respect to some other times when you are right. But you cannot make a deal with the devil. Especially if you realize that the "peace" you and Trump are promoting really means that Russia is rewarded for invading Russia by the retention of the occupied lands.

 

[mandrill]

One side or the other collapses.

If you are seeking a collapse of Putin's regime, perhaps you want Trump to commit U.S. doughboys to the lines.

PS- I don't think you could have possibly thought the history through.

I think I know about 100 times more European history than you, Earp.

Why would US troops be needed in the frontlines if Putin collapses?

And btw, Czarist Russia collapsed several months before the first Doughboy went over to Europe.

 

[WyattEarp]

I agree, that's the only chance Poilievre has, to firmly tie Carney's policies to Trudeau's as per Oracle's post.
If Carney can distance himself enough, Poilievre's done.
IMO, Poilievre is not a bad guy but I don't think he's that likeable and his main appeal was the total disdain for Trudeau.
With Trudeau gone it's back to square one and with Trump and Ford securely in place, it may not even be that.

I think Poilievre has to swing for the fences and try to sell a bolder economic/industrial vision for the country, as well as
showing a willingness to ween off U.S. dependency.
Trudeau bashing and character assassination of whoever won't cut it anymore I don't think.
People have seen enough of that and understand that won't guarantee anything better.

Very good post even if I don't share all your views on economic matters.
Tying Carney to Trudeau's policies is normal party politics. Carney will have to differentiate himself from Trudeau.
I don't see a Canadian economy that isn't tied to the U.S. a great deal, but a bolder plan for economic development would be good for Canada.

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

With due respect to some other times when you are right. But you cannot make a deal with the devil. Especially if you realize that the "peace" you and Trump are promoting really means that Russia is rewarded for invading Russia by the retention of the occupied lands

But on the flipside, if you keep this war going, there's a good chance Putin conquers all of Ukraine.
Then you're in an even bigger shitboat

 

[nottyboi]

Russia kicked out. Putin dead. Russia paying reparations to Ukraine and Europe.

And what will need to happen to bring that about? Just broad strokes. How many will have to die? Will it go nuclear?

 

[WyattEarp]

With due respect to some other times when you are right. But you cannot make a deal with the devil. Especially if you realize that the "peace" you and Trump are promoting really means that Russia is rewarded for invading Russia by the retention of the occupied lands.

What do you think happened when the Soviet Union liberated/invaded Eastern Europe? Do you subscribe to the idea that Eastern Europeans voluntarily wanted to align with the Soviet Russians?

PS- Generally, I don't care about typos but you do want to change that last reference to Russia to Ukraine.

 

[mellowjello]

I don't see a Canadian economy that isn't tied to the U.S. a great deal, but a bolder plan for economic development would be good for Canada.

Agreed.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

The deal was a vague letter of intent, and what he gets in return is the on going billions and billions. As well as assistance in negotiating a peace agreement.

He'd still want to bring up conditional terms.
Nothing unusual about it and of course the first thing he'd ask is security guarantees.

 

[The Oracle]

When was the last time we saw any Western leader act like this? No idea.

US politics I think has hit a new historic low. The Democratic Party has effectively collapsed as nothing more than controlled opposition and the GOP has no solid policy, or direction. It's literally a day to day, what the hell will happen next shitshow.

My prediction it will get worse before it gets better is coming true. The hubris of the Oligarchs is coming to the fore. Especially the Tech ones. Amazing how only a few years ago they were woke Democrats and now they see a clear opening and are taking it.

I'm really glad right now I reordered things in my life to secure things up. Rough times are clearly coming. Europe has a very tough choice to make. We shall see whether they will step up now. Because barring a complete capitulation by Zelensky(unless this is a ploy to try to get the Ukrainian parliament to remove him for some reason) Ukraine will not survive.

Thoughts on Saagar's interpretation of today's event?

 

[nottyboi]

With due respect to some other times when you are right. But you cannot make a deal with the devil. Especially if you realize that the "peace" you and Trump are promoting really means that Russia is rewarded for invading Russia by the retention of the occupied lands.

After all the illegal western invasions and wars, you call Russia the devil? What will it take to eject Russia from those lands. Are you willing to contribute half your personal net worth and an arm to that cause?

 

[mandrill]

And what will need to happen to bring that about? Just broad strokes. How many will have to die? Will it go nuclear?

Just play shit through, Notty.

Wait for the Russian economy to crumble a little more and a few more military fiascos. Just like 1917. Or any other regime collapse.

 

[the general]

At least Trump tells it like it is, in front of the press!! Totally, unlike Biden!!

Biden would say anything, and the big reason he was rarely in front of the press, or had pre-determined questions.