New 2019-20 Maple Leafs thread
- Thread starter gcostanza
- Start date
Generous man of the decade.....Lou Lamoriello.
Kyle Dubas had to trade Nikita Zaitsev and Patrick Marleau heading into this season, due to massive errors in judgment by the GM of the year.
But, yeah, LouLam is a wizard.
The problem is Dubas gave it to them. Lou never would have ans Nylander would be playing for somebody else.
Marner didnt get 1 because it would have cost Montreal 5 1st rd picks. Not many players are worth that.
Zaitsev and Marleau both formally requested to be traded at the end of last season.
Dubas subsequently honoured their requests.
The trades did have the effect of clearing cap space for Marner's new contract - otherwise Marner would have had to settle for a lot less money, in the same range as his RFA peer group.
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To the best of my recollection, these were the circumstances surrounding the signing of Zaitsev and Marleau:
Zaitsev - he was signed based on the European scouting reports. He was very good the first year and was signed to an extension. The next year he was good until a blind sided hit by Ovechkin and he was never the same after. Dubas traded him to Ottawa for Ceci and Harpur.
Marleau : he was signed based on recommendations (demands) of Babcock. The story I heard was that Marleau and Babcock had a very good relationship back when they were in the Olympics. Babcock wanted a trustworthy veteran to guide the young kids. Marleau had a very productive first year scoring something like 29 goals. He slowed down the next year but was still a good utility player and was a father figure to Matthews and Marner.
Dubas was in a panic mode. He badly needed the cap space because of his generosity in handing out fat contracts to Taraves/Nylander/Marner/Matthews. As I said before the domino effect was created when he totally caved in to the Nylander holdout demand. A wiser move would have been trading Nylander to create the needed cap room and improvement on the defence.
"Sebastian Aho was tendered a five-year, $42.27 million offer sheet by the Montreal Canadiens on Monday. The offer has an average annual value of $8.454 million.
The Carolina Hurricanes have seven days to match or they will receive a first-round pick, second-round pick and third-round pick in the NHL Draft as compensation from the Canadiens."
Only Dubas would offer Marner $11mm. -
Which means no GM would trade for Marner either? Dubas will not give him away, even as a salary dump.
I wasn't going to post but here I am.
Contrary to what some people think I agree with what a lot of people post.
Some people with very good sense of humour as well.
I find a lot of what people post very interesting.
I like reading posts from people that enlighten me.
Dart on the other gets me shaking my head every single time.
We're under a different climate.
We know now that there'll be a cap freeze for the next several years due to covid and lost revenue.
When Marner signed this was pre covid.
The horizon was for revenue's to go up along with salary cap.
If Marner were to sign today he would not get the same value due strictly to covid affect of cap freeze.
Again Dart is off his rocker ... for a 75 year old
Contrary to what some people think I agree with what a lot of people post.
Some people with very good sense of humour as well.
I find a lot of what people post very interesting.
I like reading posts from people that enlighten me.
Dart on the other gets me shaking my head every single time.
We're under a different climate.
We know now that there'll be a cap freeze for the next several years due to covid and lost revenue.
When Marner signed this was pre covid.
The horizon was for revenue's to go up along with salary cap.
If Marner were to sign today he would not get the same value due strictly to covid affect of cap freeze.
Again Dart is off his rocker ... for a 75 year old
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Even you must realize by now that you have no credibility with the well respected and knowledgeable members of the Board.
I would take Sebastian Aho at $8.454mm and Matthew Tkachuk at $7mm and several other young NHL stars over Marner at $11mm (or actually $10,893,000 for the benefit of Costanza).
Maybe you think you know more about hockey because as opposed to basketball, in hockey more of the players look like you.
shack at it again, put a ring on Dartsy's finger already.
Imagine this, the Pastry Chefs haven't been to the Stanley Cup Final since they last won it. Harold Ballard died in 1990 but his spirit endures. Taking probability into account, the Pastry Chefs could easily surpass the Chicago Cubs record of futility of 108 years.
Next year they might not even make the playoffs.
Imagine this, the Pastry Chefs haven't been to the Stanley Cup Final since they last won it. Harold Ballard died in 1990 but his spirit endures. Taking probability into account, the Pastry Chefs could easily surpass the Chicago Cubs record of futility of 108 years.
Next year they might not even make the playoffs.
No one is denying Leafs are soft but it's a fallacy to think that Matthews, Nylander, and Marner need to start banging bodies for Leafs to succeed. TB didn't gut the core of their skilled soft players when they got swept by Columbus. Kuchervo and Point looked like very frustrated players last year. They also have Tyler Johnson, another small skilled soft player. They beefed up outside the core and Kucherov and Point look like totally different players. Focused solely on skill and making plays.
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I'm not necessarily saying Leafs stars aren't overpaid either. Particularly now when they signed just before the onset of covid and the start of cap freezes for several years. Using contracts that were signed years ago or with different terms doesn't paint the whole picture. I know Dart likes to pick and choose to make his points, which he seldem if ever has one.
Marner is small so he sucks.
Marner only scored 16 goals so he sucks.
Marner makes 11 million so he sucks. (Dart likes to round up as well).
We get it Dart, Marner sucks.
Marner is small so he sucks.
Marner only scored 16 goals so he sucks.
Marner makes 11 million so he sucks. (Dart likes to round up as well).
We get it Dart, Marner sucks.
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If Leafs sign good players to term contracts and now have to trade them after 1 year into their contracts just to dump their salary then they might as well just start the rebuild again and find another line of work.
Here's my take.
Leafs wanted Stamkos. They would have paid him royally. Still he declined.
Leafs wanted Tavares. They couldn't get him cheaper than at 11 mill. Cost them nothing in assets so they took the offer.
Matthews is a much better player than Tavaras. Hard to say his is an overpay. If it is it's not outrageously so.
Nylander is not an outrageous overpay at the time he signed if at all an overpay.
Comparing his contract to those signed years earlier just shows ignorance.
So now we come to Marner. From a points per game perspective relative to Matthews they are pretty much on par. Matthews being the goal scorer so certainly more value. Marner also kills penalties.
In my opinion I think it's unfortunate that Tavares wasn't a comparable top pairing RHD at the time.
They certainly would have kept Kadri if it was so to be 2nd line center and on the first PP unit.
He may have excelled as a shut down guy as well. A role given to Tavares.
Leafs wanted Stamkos. They would have paid him royally. Still he declined.
Leafs wanted Tavares. They couldn't get him cheaper than at 11 mill. Cost them nothing in assets so they took the offer.
Matthews is a much better player than Tavaras. Hard to say his is an overpay. If it is it's not outrageously so.
Nylander is not an outrageous overpay at the time he signed if at all an overpay.
Comparing his contract to those signed years earlier just shows ignorance.
So now we come to Marner. From a points per game perspective relative to Matthews they are pretty much on par. Matthews being the goal scorer so certainly more value. Marner also kills penalties.
In my opinion I think it's unfortunate that Tavares wasn't a comparable top pairing RHD at the time.
They certainly would have kept Kadri if it was so to be 2nd line center and on the first PP unit.
He may have excelled as a shut down guy as well. A role given to Tavares.
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I agree that Matthews, Marner and Nylander should have the freedom to play their game, but Dubas traded away grit player for French patisserie.
He trade away Kadri for a cream puff and a defenseman who can't hold the blue line. Andres Borgman may have been deficient in parts but he was willing to hit. He got traded away for chicken fat. Not sure why Shanahan thought Dubas was so special, he should have listened to Dennis Green and kept Mark Hunter. The Leafs are what other NHL teams think they are, they're not making the playoffs next year. I'm calling it.
He trade away Kadri for a cream puff and a defenseman who can't hold the blue line. Andres Borgman may have been deficient in parts but he was willing to hit. He got traded away for chicken fat. Not sure why Shanahan thought Dubas was so special, he should have listened to Dennis Green and kept Mark Hunter. The Leafs are what other NHL teams think they are, they're not making the playoffs next year. I'm calling it.
Actually, Shack and 88 make a perfect couple. They have so much in common, including being poor judges of hockey talent and what dollars they are worth. BTW: Why would anyone call himself "superstar"?
Never said Marner sucks, just that he is not as good as 88 thinks.
Shanahan had expectations players would take home town discounts. He even eluded to it during the Nylander negotiations and he showed frustration when it wasn't happening. Afterwards he just fell silent.
The overwhelm the opposition with skill plan only works in the AHL where their is no cap. The team was stacked. A player like Bracco couldn't even get into the lineup. That formula doesn't work in the NHL with a cap. It's who can build the best team with the same amount of money.
The overwhelm the opposition with skill plan only works in the AHL where their is no cap. The team was stacked. A player like Bracco couldn't even get into the lineup. That formula doesn't work in the NHL with a cap. It's who can build the best team with the same amount of money.
