Munk Debate on Zionism

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Leimonis

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Feb 28, 2020
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southpaw said:
What is there to explain? That Israel has a minority called "Israeli Arabs" who are Israeli citizens?

Why not extend the same courtesy to all the Palestinians? Because then, they'd lose their Jewish majority, and they'd lose their Jewish state.
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Maybe it’s because arabs can live in a Jewish state while Jews for some reason cannot live in Arab states. Syria, Iraq, Iran, Lebanon…something is wrong with their hospitality, isn’t it?
Country or territory1948 Jewish
population		1972 Jewish
population		Recent estimates
Morocco250000[76]–265000[77]31000[267]2,100 (2019)
Algeria140000[76][77]1000[267]50–200 (2021)[268][269]
Tunisia50000[76]–105000[77]8000[267]1000 (2019)[270]
Libya35000[76]–38000[77]50[267]0 (2014)[271]
North Africa Total~500000~40000~3000
Iraq135000[77]–140000[76]500[267]5–7 (2014)[271]
Egypt75000[77]–80000[76]500[267]100 (2019)[271]
Yemen and Aden53,000[76]–63,000[77]500[267]50 (2016)[272]
Syria15000[76]–30000[77]4000[267]100 (2019)[271]
Lebanon5000[77]–200002000[267]100 (2012)[273]
Bahrain550–60036 (2007)[274]
Sudan350[261]≈0
Middle East (excluding Palestine/Israel) Total~300000~7,500~400
Afghanistan5000500[267]0 (2021)[254]
BangladeshUnknown75–100 (2012)[275]
Iran65,232 (1956)[276]62,258 (1976)[276][277] - 80000[267]9000–20000(2022)[278]
Pakistan2000–2500[279]250[267]>900 (2017)[280]
Turkey80000[281]30000[267]12000–16000 (2022)[282]
Non-Arab Muslim Countries Total~150000~100000~24000
 
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L

Leimonis

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southpaw said:
And? Do you see me arguing to send billions in aid to any of those Arab states? Show me a single post where I've said the West should help the Arabs, including the Palestinians.

I'm advocating to stop supporting one ethnostate. Not to start supporting others.
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So you are okay with Jews being ethnically cleansed from israel like they have been from all the other Arab countries?
 
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basketcase

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Frankfooter said:
Yes, when you use partial quotes it is lying.
The UN ceasefire calls for both sides to stop.
...
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And hamas rejected it, instead sending a new list of demands.

And Hamas refused to release their hostages as the UN, ICC, and ICJ demanded. It's amazing that you keep pretending to endorse those groups while completely rejecting what they say.
 
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Leimonis

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southpaw said:
No I am not. ……. But I also know it's not our place to interfere in foreign conflicts.
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So you are not okay with it but also you are okay with it. Gotcha.
 
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shack

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Oct 2, 2001
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Frankfooter said:
Do you really want to compare that to either Orthodox Jews or Evangelical Christians?
Is that a reason to support genocide, in your thinking?
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So you have no evidence to invalidate the fact that Israel bestows many rights upon Arab CITIZENS that Arab nations do not bestow upon Jews.

Without directly addressing this example and just answering with a question (which you've said you never do, what a joke AKA lie) you are admitting that Israel is not an apartheid state. That is why the UN has never passed a resolution declaring Israel as such, as they did with S. Africa in 1963. Would an apartheid state allow things like that Arab-Israeli boy did? Allowing a Jewish member of Hamas to swear on a Torah?

All of your BS claims fall like dominoes, one after the other when placed under scrutiny.
 
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shack

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Oct 2, 2001
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southpaw said:
What is there to explain? That Israel has a minority called "Israeli Arabs" who are Israeli citizens?

Why not extend the same courtesy to all the Palestinians? Because then, they'd lose their Jewish majority, and they'd lose their Jewish state.
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You answered your own question. All Palestinians are not citizens and every single sovereign state on the face of the earth has the absolute right to bestow or deny citizenship to whomever they want. End of story.
 
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shack

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Frankfooter said:
You know what's even more stupid?
Thinking you can destroy a resistance through genocide.
There are now about 100,000 orphans in Gaza, who do you think they are going to hate as they grow up?
Do you think they will be justified to hate zionists?



https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1807169042924367917
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Interestingly Geno, despite all your claims of Israeli genocide and intentionally killing/targeting children, you have no images of the soldier killing that boy. The soldier had him dead to rights. According to you, that soldier should be sent to jail for disobeying commands.

That goes 100% contrary to what you say is Israeli policy. More BS and lies from you PROVEN.
 
S

shack

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southpaw said:
They attack Israel now, don't they? Israel will be attacked regardless of whether the Palestinians have a state, or not.

The difference is, Israel could stop being an apartheid state. I suspect it will always be an ethnostate.
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The difference is that Hamas could stop being terrorists and attacking Israeli citizens like they did on Oct.7. Another example of where actions have consequences.

I hope that Pali leadership stop always being terrorists.
 
S

shack

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Oct 2, 2001
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southpaw said:
Or whatever other conflict is currently going on. But I also know it's not our place to interfere in foreign conflicts.
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Does that mean that all of the pro-Palestinian protestors are wrong because they are trying to interfere in a foreign conflict? Just asking.

Let's clear the occupation at UofT.
 
F

Frankfooter

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basketcase said:
I know. How dare I quote the UN Ceasefire motion when you oppose a ceasefire.
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Its Israel that is opposed to a ceasefire.
apnews.com

Netanyahu says he won't agree to a deal that ends the war in Gaza, testing the latest truce proposal

His latest comments come at a sensitive time and could represent another setback for mediators trying to end the war.
apnews.com apnews.com

You know it and still do the hasbara troll thing of posting bullshit you and I both know is bullshit.
That's what makes you a shitty hasbara troll.

Every time you mention the UN, you get this.
Recognition that you have declared that Israel is committing genocide by your choice, the UN.
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1807299909684494740
 
F

Frankfooter

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Apr 10, 2015
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shack said:
So you have no evidence to invalidate the fact that Israel bestows many rights upon Arab CITIZENS that Arab nations do not bestow upon Jews.

Without directly addressing this example and just answering with a question (which you've said you never do, what a joke AKA lie) you are admitting that Israel is not an apartheid state. That is why the UN has never passed a resolution declaring Israel as such, as they did with S. Africa in 1963. Would an apartheid state allow things like that Arab-Israeli boy did? Allowing a Jewish member of Hamas to swear on a Torah?

All of your BS claims fall like dominoes, one after the other when placed under scrutiny.
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Shazi, there are reports detailing the legal framework of Israeli apartheid out by:
The UN
Amnesty
B'tselem
HRW

Those documents are at the ICC and ICJ.

Answering the incredibly stupid arguments of some Shazi is a waste of time.
Israel is apartheid and the legal arguments are in the courts and the UN.

That argument sailed long ago.
Israel is apartheid.
 
F

Frankfooter

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shack said:
You answered your own question. All Palestinians are not citizens and every single sovereign state on the face of the earth has the absolute right to bestow or deny citizenship to whomever they want. End of story.
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Israel chose to be apartheid and now must deal with the ramifications.
End of story.

Deal with it Shazi.
 
F

Frankfooter

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shack said:
Interestingly Geno, despite all your claims of Israeli genocide and intentionally killing/targeting children, you have no images of the soldier killing that boy. The soldier had him dead to rights. According to you, that soldier should be sent to jail for disobeying commands.

That goes 100% contrary to what you say is Israeli policy. More BS and lies from you PROVEN.
Click to expand...
You mean you admit that Netanyahu's war hasn't killed every single Hamas militant after 9 months of dropping 2000 lb bombs on civilians?

What next Shazi, are you going to realize that killing people's families won't end the resistance but only fire up another generation?
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1805668531339673719
 
F

Frankfooter

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shack said:
The difference is that Hamas could stop being terrorists and attacking Israeli citizens like they did on Oct.7. Another example of where actions have consequences.

I hope that Pali leadership stop always being terrorists.
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Zionists have always been terrorists, Shazi.
Irgun were terrorists before there were Palestinian terrorists.
And today, Shazi, Israel drops 2000 lb bombs on refugees in tents, tortures children, rapes prisoners to death with hot metal rods and is starving 1 million children to death.

Zionists have become the terrorists, Shazi.
From settler terrorist attacks to the IDF.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1778865881952534618

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1779104343771263063

 
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