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Climate Change

JohnLarue

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2005
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Spoke too soon.

Your link says there are different reports for global temp, from surface to troposphere.
What you link doesn't say is that they are the same and you can compare them as if they were the same.
Gee
how much is a change of 1 degree C at the surface ? 1 degree C
how much is a change of 1 degree C in the troposphere ? 1 degree C
how much is a change of 1 degree C in the sea surface ? 1 degree C

can we compare these three equal observations of temperature change?
hmmm..... better ask Frankfooter first
grow up

Temperatures are obtained from surface and offshore weather stations or inferred from meteorological satellite data. Temperature anomalies can be calculated based on datasets of near-surface and upper-air atmospheric temperatures or sea surface temperatures.

One other question, larue.
Why does the satellite temperature in your chart stop in 2012 or so?
Why doesn't your chart use the last 10 years of satellite data?
that's is when this version was created by Dr Christy
the model predictions had already been used to create the scary climate propaganda

are you claiming the glaring fundamental flaws in 79 models have since been fixed and somehow still produce the same results, the same scary climate propaganda?

All this has now been addressed you say ?

The failed climate models are an attempt to predict future data via an attempt to code physics theory into a computer program.
Predictions which cant replicate the past -- fail
Predictions which do not agree with other models -- fail. There is no way these bozos got the physics theory right when the distribution of Predictions is such a mess
Predictions which do not agree with other confirmed satellite/ weather balloon observations-- fail.
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Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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Gee
how much is a change of 1 degree C at the surface ? 1 degree C
how much is a change of 1 degree C in the troposphere ? 1 degree C
how much is a change of 1 degree C in the sea surface ? 1 degree C
Is the temperature on the surface the same as it is in the clouds, larue?
Is surface temperature the same temperature as troposphere temperatures?
 

JohnLarue

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2005
17,395
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Is the temperature on the surface the same as it is in the clouds, larue?
Is surface temperature the same temperature as troposphere temperatures?
are you really that stupid ?

of course the absolute temperatures are not the same values.
That is why scientists use temperature anomalies (temperature changes), in order to compare, study, evaluate

how much is a change of 1 degree C at the surface ? 1 degree C
how much is a change of 1 degree C in the troposphere ? 1 degree C
how much is a change of 1 degree C in the sea surface ? 1 degree C

1 degree C change is 1 degree C change at the surface or in the troposphere or at the sea surface

your dropping out of high school was a really bad decision

explain how an Atmospheric Gas CO2 manages to heat up the surface faster than the Atmosphere ?
be sure to explain how your morons theory obeys the laws of Thermodynamics , the Stephan Law and conservation of energy

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Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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are you really that stupid ?

of course the absolute temperatures are not the same values.
Great, so we have now established that you agree that the surface temperatures are different than temperatures in the troposphere.
Now, do you think the temperatures in the clouds change as much or more than surface temperatures?
Do you think that change is exactly the same and that therefore the anomaly in the clouds will be exactly the same as the anomaly on the surface?

And why doesn't your chart include satellite data past 2012, is there something wrong with it?
Are you cherry picking or are you relying on only really old data again?
 

JohnLarue

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2005
17,395
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Great, so we have now established that you agree that the surface temperatures are different than temperatures in the troposphere.
actually all you have established is the answer" yes' to the question:
are you really that stupid ?

1 degree C change is 1 degree C change at the surface or in the troposphere or at the sea surface


explain how an Atmospheric Gas CO2 manages to heat up the surface faster than the Atmosphere ?
be sure to explain how your morons theory obeys the laws of Thermodynamics , the Stephan Law and conservation of energy

1715526042732.png
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
91,806
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actually all you have established is the answer" yes' to the question:
are you really that stupid ?

1 degree C change is 1 degree C change at the surface or in the troposphere or at the sea surface


explain how an Atmospheric Gas CO2 manages to heat up the surface faster than the Atmosphere ?
be sure to explain how your morons theory obeys the laws of Thermodynamics , the Stephan Law and conservation of energy

1715526042732.png
Wow, you don't give up when you are wrong.

  • The surface temperature is around 15°C (59°F), while the temperature of the troposphere decreases with altitude.
  • The rate of temperature decrease is around 7°C/km (3.9°F/1,000 ft) in the wet condition.
  • The global average temperature at the top of the troposphere is around -63°C (-82°F).
  • The difference in temperature between the surface and the troposphere is due to the way heat is transferred from the Earth’s surface to the atmosphere.
  • The surface temperature can vary greatly depending on the location, while the temperature in the troposphere is more uniform.
Using a chart that plots apples vs oranges in surface vs troposphere temperatures when the anomaly is expected to be different is stupid.
Using a chart that intentionally stops at 2012 is intentionally dishonest.

Your argument is managing to be both stupid and dishonest at the same time.
 

JohnLarue

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2005
17,395
3,061
113
Wow, you don't give up when you are wrong.

  • The surface temperature is around 15°C (59°F), while the temperature of the troposphere decreases with altitude.
  • The rate of temperature decrease is around 7°C/km (3.9°F/1,000 ft) in the wet condition.
  • The global average temperature at the top of the troposphere is around -63°C (-82°F).
  • The difference in temperature between the surface and the troposphere is due to the way heat is transferred from the Earth’s surface to the atmosphere.
  • The surface temperature can vary greatly depending on the location, while the temperature in the troposphere is more uniform.
Using a chart that plots apples vs oranges in surface vs troposphere temperatures when the anomaly is expected to be different is stupid.
Using a chart that intentionally stops at 2012 is intentionally dishonest.

Your argument is managing to be both stupid and dishonest at the same time.
1 degree C change is 1 degree C change at the surface or in the troposphere or at the sea surface


explain how an Atmospheric Gas CO2 manages to heat up the surface faster than the Atmosphere ?
be sure to explain how your morons theory obeys the laws of Thermodynamics , the Stephan Law and conservation of energy

1715526042732.png
 

JohnLarue

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2005
17,395
3,061
113
  • The surface temperature can vary greatly depending on the location, while the temperature in the troposphere is more uniform.
another reason not to rely on the surface temperature data set.
As you say "the surface temperature (data set) can vary greatly depending on the location" and the planetary coverage is grossly inadequate , while "the temperature in the data set for the troposphere is more uniform" and provides complete coverage

-why can you not understand what grade 10 students can ?
1 degree C change is 1 degree C change at the surface or in the troposphere or at the sea surface
oh yeah, you dropped out of school before grade 10 science class, that's why


explain how an Atmospheric Gas CO2 manages to heat up the surface faster than the Atmosphere ?
be sure to explain how your morons theory obeys the laws of Thermodynamics , the Stephan Law and conservation of energy

1715547294396.png
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
91,806
22,230
113
1 degree C change is 1 degree C change at the surface or in the troposphere or at the sea surface
Wrong answer, larue.

Will the change in temperature be the same at the surface, 1km and 10km?
Why does your chart stop in 2012?

You're pushing bullshit and you know it.
Surface temperature is not the same as the temp in the troposphere, you wouldn't expect the same anomaly.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
91,806
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another reason not to rely on the surface temperature data set.
Irrelevant.

The IPCC issues projections for the surface temperature.
Those projections are measured by taking the global surface temperature.

Not the temperature in the clouds.
 

Skoob

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2022
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The righties were making that propaganda about more people dying from the vaccines etc. The vaccines have those microchips that are going to track your every movement by the Deep State. So what is your point?

When we are seeing the scale of the unprecedented fires, floods, tornadoes, hurricanes etc., you guys come up with statements like it is just a cycle and not a big deal. The forest fires were deliberately started etc. etc........ Enough said!!
But the majority of forest fires were started by people. That has been proven and statistically factual.
So who are the climate conspiracy theorists and alarmists here?
 

JohnLarue

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2005
17,395
3,061
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Irrelevant.

The IPCC issues projections for the surface temperature.
Those projections are measured by taking the global surface temperature.
and look at the mess of the projections by IPCC models

The failed climate models are an attempt to predict future data via an attempt to code physics theory into a computer program.
Predictions which cant replicate the past -- fail
Predictions which do not agree with other models -- fail. There is no way these bozos got the physics theory right when the distribution of Predictions is such a mess
Predictions which do not agree with other confirmed satellite/ weather balloon observations-- fail.

overall grade: fail

and it is these failed climate models, which are the basis for all the catastrophic propaganda
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bver_hunter

Well-known member
Nov 5, 2005
29,333
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But the majority of forest fires were started by people. That has been proven and statistically factual.
So who are the climate conspiracy theorists and alarmists here?
You still cannot understand the simple fact is that in the past when forest fires were deliberately started, then they were brought under control in a more concise manner.
With the present Climate Change factored in, now just look at the various forest fires in Provinces like BC, Alberta and other Prairie Provinces and this early in the year:


Are there any proof that all these forest fires were "deliberately started"?

But maybe you right wingers are in hook, line and sink with these sort of guys:

A climate conspiracy theorist said the government deliberately lit wildfires. He just pleaded guilty to starting 14 himself


A Canadian man who posted conspiracy theories on social media claiming the government was deliberately starting wildfires has pleaded guilty to starting 14 blazes that forced hundreds of people from their homes.
Brian Paré, appearing in a Quebec court Monday, admitted to 13 counts of arson, and one count of arson with a disregard for human life, relating to events between May and September last year.
Prosecutor Marie-Philippe Charron said one of the fires Paré set forced the evacuation of around 400 people in the town of Chapais, Quebec. The largest fire Paré admitted to starting destroyed more than 870 hectares.


“Mr. Pare does not remember all of the fires he could have started, so we have currently 14 fires, we have 14 counts,” Charron told CNN. “It’s possible there are more but we do not have evidence of that,” she added.
Charron said police and first responders grew suspicious when a number of fires happened over a short period of time without a discernible cause.
Police officers became interested in Paré after he was spotted in the areas of several fires. They also found multiple social media posts by Paré accusing the Canadian government of purposefully igniting fires to persuade people to believe in climate change.
“According to police evidence, the accused posted a lot of conspiracy theories about the fires and the government’s involvement in possibly setting those fires,” Charron said.
After getting permission to attach a tracking device to his vehicle, police were able to trace it to the location of other fires.
He admitted to starting some of the fires when he was arrested in September.
Canada’s 2023 wildfire season was record-shattering, scorching around 18.4 million hectares (45.5 million acres) — an area roughly the size of North Dakota and more than double the previous record.
Weather that drove eastern Canada’s devastating wildfires made twice as likely by climate change
Smoke from the fires poured southward, choking cities in the United States and even making it as far east as Europe.
Wildfires have long been a focus for conspiracy theorists, with claims that they are started by governments, climate activists or even by laser beams from space.
Canada’s unprecedented fires triggered a wave of disinformation, according to a 2023 report by the global coalition Climate Action Against Disinformation. This included false claims the wildfires were set intentionally to scare people into supporting climate action.
High-profile figures helped fuel these conspiracy theories. In June, Maxime Bernier, a former Canadian foreign minister, claimed in a post on X that a “good portion” of fires were likely started by “green terrorists who want to give their climate change campaign a little boost.”
Alberta Premier Danielle Smith was also criticized for remarks on the fires. During a June conversation with talk show host Ryan Jespersen, she refused to respond directly to questions about the impact climate change had on the fires, instead focusing on the role of arsonists.
Human activity does play a role in starting wildfires, either deliberately or through accidental actions such as discarding a lit cigarette, but natural factors are also involved.
Lightning strikes played a huge role in last year’s fires, according to Quebec’s Forest Fire Protection Agency. “Nearly 53% of fires were caused by lightning causing more than 99% of the area burned this year,” a spokesperson for the fire agency told CNN.
Focusing on a single cause can also obscure the role of human-caused global warming, which is fueling the very hot and dry conditions that help fires spread faster, and burn longer and more intensely.
“Widespread drought combined with a devastating lightning line are responsible for this historic season,” Quebec’s fire agency spokesperson said.
A recent analysis by scientists from the World Weather Attribution initiative — which calculates the role of climate change in extreme weather events — found that climate change made the hot, dry and windy weather that drove last year’s fires in Quebec at least twice as likely and up to 50% more intense.
Kira Hoffman, a fire ecologist at the University of British Columbia and the Bulkley Valley Research Centre, said there are many factors that contribute to extreme wildfire seasons, including logging and abandoning Indigenous fire stewardship techniques.
But all these factors interact with the climate crisis, Hoffman told CNN last year. “A rapidly changing climate is creating longer, drier and hotter wildfire seasons across Canada.”
Paré remains in custody. A pre-sentencing report was requested by his defense lawyer, and it is expected to be released in April.

A Canadian man who posted conspiracy theories on social media claiming the government was deliberately starting wildfires has pleaded guilty to starting 14 blazes that forced hundreds of people from their homes.
Brian Paré, appearing in a Quebec court Monday, admitted to 13 counts of arson, and one count of arson with a disregard for human life, relating to events between May and September last year.
Prosecutor Marie-Philippe Charron said one of the fires Paré set forced the evacuation of around 400 people in the town of Chapais, Quebec. The largest fire Paré admitted to starting destroyed more than 870 hectares.

 
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JohnLarue

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2005
17,395
3,061
113
You still cannot understand the simple fact is that in the past when forest fires were deliberately started, then they were brought under control in a more concise manner.
previously you argued the opposite, that forest fire fighting techniques have improved


if you are going to lecture others on the past best you understand the reality of the past
threats from forest fires have decreased, not increased


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