Leafs '22/'23 Thread

[superstar_88]

Let's talk about the goaltending. In the Matthews era and we could even include the 7 game series when Reimer was in net, at no time did the Leafs have the better goaltending other than this year's round 1 against TB when Vasilevsky was terrible for the most part.
The one and only time the Leafs had the better goaltending was the one and only time they won the series.
In every series they lost Leafs goaltending was either clearly inferior or definitely not better.

 

[tml]

Let's talk about the goaltending. In the Matthews era and we could even include the 7 game series when Reimer was in net, at no time did the Leafs have the better goaltending other than this year's round 1 against TB when Vasilevsky was terrible for the most part.
The one and only time the Leafs had the better goaltending was the one and only time they won the series.
In every series they lost Leafs goaltending was either clearly inferior or definitely not better.

I think you could say that about any team in any playoffs.
I think the Leafs tandem next year will have to be Woll and Murray. UFA Samsonov did well to raise his value this year and should get a good contract offer from someone, one that the Leafs would have difficulty matching. Even if he came back he is not assured the number 1 position. Unfortunately, they are stuck with Murray due to his contract.

 

[superstar_88]

I think you could say that about any team in any playoffs.
I think the Leafs tandem next year will have to be Woll and Murray. UFA Samsonov did well to raise his value this year and should get a good contract offer from someone, one that the Leafs would have difficulty matching. Even if he came back he is not assured the number 1 position. Unfortunately, they are stuck with Murray due to his contract.

Yes you could but that's precisely my point. If Leafs had the better goaltending they would have won some of those but they didn't.
We're talking about Holtby (in his prime), Rask, Korpisalo (who was fantasic in 2020 playoffs), Price, Bobrovsky, and Vasilevsky.
Dubas banked on Murray being that guy this year so I can see Murray Woll being the tandem next year.
I don't think Samsonov is the guy regardless. I think Woll is better than Samsonov but he's young and inexperienced.

 

[tml]

Yes you could but that's precisely my point. If Leafs had the superior goaltending they would have won some of those but they didn't.
We're talking about Holtby (in his prime), Rask, Korpisalo (who was fantasic in 2020 playoffs), Price, Bobrovsky, and Vasilevsky.
Dubas banked on Murray being that guy this year so I can see Murray Woll being the tandem next year.
I don't think Samsonov is the guy regardless. I think Woll is better than Samsonov but he's young and inexerienced.

Right on!!! If we go back even further, ironically Murray was once that guy.

 

[superstar_88]

Right on!!! If we go back even further, ironically Murray was once that guy.

Murray was the starter in the playoffs as a rookie when his team won the Stanley Cup. He was only 21 at the time.
That year he played more playoff games than regular season games. Woll is still a rookie next year.

 

[saxon]

Dubas is done. Will not be back.

 

[torboy]

and they are keeping Shanahan ? Why ? to hire a new GM and keep going around in circles ? like a revolving door

 

[saxon]

I also hear the Marlies cleaned house as well, head coach and his two assistants have been let go.

 

[K Douglas]

Take a guess at how many teams have won the Cup with a player making over $10 million/year in the cap era. You need depth to win in the playoffs. Every year there's some third line player who lights the world on fire. The Leafs have nobody like that. On a related(?) note, three of the four remaining teams come from states with no income tax - coincidence?

In fairness, there aren't a lot of players who make that kind of money. For example here are the players that currently make $10 million or over per season

Connor McDavid $12,500,000
Artemi Panarin $11,642,857
Auston Matthews $11,640,250
John Tavares $11,000,000
Mitchell Marner $10,903,000
Aleksander Barkov $10,000,000

In 2023-24 Nathan MacKinnon will become the new highest paid player in the league with an AAV of $12,600,000. He was making $6,300,000 per season when they won the Cup.

Tampa Bay has 3 players that make $9,500,000 per season - Nikita Kucherov, Brayden Point and Andrei Vasilevskiy. Two others make $8,500,000 - Steven Stamkos and Mikhail Sergachev. That's $45,500,000 tied up in 5 players.

 

[superstar_88]

Sounds like they had every intention to bring back Dubas but Dubas tried to pull a negotiating ploy the core 4 used on him by asking for more money and it was only then that Shanny told him to take a hike.

 

[Darts]

What does an Assistant GM actually do? Is he/she/they a GM in waiting?

 

[maurice93]

Sounds like they had every intention to bring back Dubas but Dubas tried to pull a negotiating ploy the core 4 used on him by asking for more money and it was only then that Shanny told him to take a hike.

There is two potential scenarios here, that are both quite plausible. (#2 was where my mind went too as I was hearing the presser, but I can see #1 as just as likely)

1) Dubas overplayed his hand (your perspective) - As you mentioned, and as I saw in a tweet fiom Seravelli, Dubas overplayed his hand using the press conference as a bargaining chip.

or

2) Dubas showed weakness in the presser and Shanahan didn't like it. Dubas' presser was not a bargaining chip, just a made who was being honest, tired out and needed time to think. Shanahan was concerned about that weakness moving forward, and whether Dubas came back a few days later as committed became irrelevant.

 

[roadhog]

Sounds like they had every intention to bring back Dubas but Dubas tried to pull a negotiating ploy the core 4 used on him by asking for more money and it was only then that Shanny told him to take a hike.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1659620253322842112

 

[maurice93]

In fairness, there aren't a lot of players who make that kind of money. For example here are the players that currently make $10 million or over per season

Connor McDavid $12,500,000
Artemi Panarin $11,642,857
Auston Matthews $11,640,250
John Tavares $11,000,000
Mitchell Marner $10,903,000
Aleksander Barkov $10,000,000

In 2023-24 Nathan MacKinnon will become the new highest paid player in the league with an AAV of $12,600,000. He was making $6,300,000 per season when they won the Cup.

Tampa Bay has 3 players that make $9,500,000 per season - Nikita Kucherov, Brayden Point and Andrei Vasilevskiy. Two others make $8,500,000 - Steven Stamkos and Mikhail Sergachev. That's $45,500,000 tied up in 5 players.

I think the $10m number is a bit arbitrary, and the theory has worked out of more randomness (in part due to lack of players as you state). A .number of teams heavily commit to the core - the uniqueness of the Leafs is the lack of diversity positionally amongst that core.

Regarding the Leafs.
Nylander's contract is fine.
Matthews $amount is fine -- the awful part was the term that Dubas gave him.... just terrible negotiation on that by Dubas.
Marner is a very good winger -- but as a winger he is overpaid by a $1-2m

The big issue was Tavares contract. Tavares is a good player, but you can spend it more wisely on diverse players. Leafs could have been stronger team with using the Tavares cap space another way, and would have been able to win with a $10m player.

 

[chrispalen]

Glad to hear Kyle Dubas is not returning to the Leafs. Wondering who will take his place. Hopefully not his $3million a year Special Assistant Spezza.

CP

 

[tml]

TSN(Pierre Lebrun) reporting Spezza resigned before Shanahan's press conference.

 

[superstar_88]

TSN(Pierre Lebrun) reporting Spezza resigned before Shanahan's press conference.

It was probably just a make a job for taking the low salary during his last few years as a player.

 

[superstar_88]

I think the $10m number is a bit arbitrary, and the theory has worked out of more randomness (in part due to lack of players as you state). A .number of teams heavily commit to the core - the uniqueness of the Leafs is the lack of diversity positionally amongst that core.

Regarding the Leafs.
Nylander's contract is fine.
Matthews $amount is fine -- the awful part was the term that Dubas gave him.... just terrible negotiation on that by Dubas.
Marner is a very good winger -- but as a winger he is overpaid by a $1-2m

The big issue was Tavares contract. Tavares is a good player, but you can spend it more wisely on diverse players. Leafs could have been stronger team with using the Tavares cap space another way, and would have been able to win with a $10m player.

Concur on MNM assessment. It was unfortunate they turfed Kadri after back to back playoff suspensions. He could easily have performed well enough as second line center with money left over. Kadri also has grit, edge, and nastiness. Precisely what Florida has in Bennett, Gudas, and Tkatchuk.

 

[HumbleJoe]

In fairness, there aren't a lot of players who make that kind of money. For example here are the players that currently make $10 million or over per season

Connor McDavid $12,500,000
Artemi Panarin $11,642,857
Auston Matthews $11,640,250
John Tavares $11,000,000
Mitchell Marner $10,903,000
Aleksander Barkov $10,000,000

In 2023-24 Nathan MacKinnon will become the new highest paid player in the league with an AAV of $12,600,000. He was making $6,300,000 per season when they won the Cup.

Tampa Bay has 3 players that make $9,500,000 per season - Nikita Kucherov, Brayden Point and Andrei Vasilevskiy. Two others make $8,500,000 - Steven Stamkos and Mikhail Sergachev. That's $45,500,000 tied up in 5 players.

Too lazy to look, but you're missing some players. Doughty - $11MM, Price - $10.5MM, Kopitar - $10MM just off the top of my head.
Regardless, point I was trying to make is that top-heavy teams have a tough time in the playoffs.

 

[glamphotographer]

It was about money.