teach said:
Unions are not the perfect tool for obtaining fairness in the workplace. Until something better comes along I'm stickin with them.
Unions...
- Thread starter Joey Jeremiah
- Start date
Unions are not the perfect tool for obtaining fairness in the workplace. Until something better comes along I'm stickin with them.
train said:Actually there is .....oh nevermind . I 'm going outside to beat my head against the wall .
Not too hard because you might see a "BUZZ"
auto doctor said:
Autodoctor.....I would like to call you an idiot but that would be insulting to the idiots.
I think you should stop talking about things you don't know about.
I knew you were going to say that more people are hurt at home than in auto plants......that is such a stupid argument. Of course there are more actual absolute cases. Because 100% of the population (excluding homeless) live in a home but 100% of the population does not work at an auto plant.
Next you are going to tell me that eating ice cream is more dangerous than nuclear weapons because more people die each year from eating ice cream than are killed by nuclear bombs.
You can't compare absolute numbers when you are talking about group samples unless the sample sizes are the same you moron.
As for charity. Were you aware that Magna corporation HAS to donate 2% of its pre-tax profits to charities in its communities in addition to a further 10% of pre-tax profits which must be distributed to its employees? It is contained within the corporate constiution and therefore if it fails to do so it runs afoul of the OSC, SEC and its board of directors.
This amount is in excess to what employees choose to contribute through various charitable drives that take place at each plant for various charities.
And as for calling me Magna Tory blue......are you not aware that Frank Stronach ran for the leadership of the proviincial LIBERAL party in 1991?
Now go and sit down before you hurt yourself.
Yoo hJ
LMFAO.........You still do not now jack shit about unions. I have been in the IBEW for five years and now with the CAW for 16 years.
Do you know that in this century not the last century Frank Stronach raised a family member Miss blond tory Stronach. She tried to lead the tories recently. LMFAO...try to keep up with me.
I'm shure Magna 2% and 10% charity guidelines are right inline with the tax bracket refund they can use to offset thier taxes paid....LMFAO. That is so big of them.
Well maybe your plant has a bad safety using "absolute numbers" Talk to your pee-ons and they all most likely have a story of getting hurt at home. Or is it the other way round at your place. All your pee-ons have stories of getting hurt at work.....LMFAO
P.S. Do you work at the new warehoure in St. Catharines maybe I'll come by say hello..LMFAO
LMFAO.........You still do not now jack shit about unions. I have been in the IBEW for five years and now with the CAW for 16 years.
Do you know that in this century not the last century Frank Stronach raised a family member Miss blond tory Stronach. She tried to lead the tories recently. LMFAO...try to keep up with me.
I'm shure Magna 2% and 10% charity guidelines are right inline with the tax bracket refund they can use to offset thier taxes paid....LMFAO. That is so big of them.
Well maybe your plant has a bad safety using "absolute numbers" Talk to your pee-ons and they all most likely have a story of getting hurt at home. Or is it the other way round at your place. All your pee-ons have stories of getting hurt at work.....LMFAO
P.S. Do you work at the new warehoure in St. Catharines maybe I'll come by say hello..LMFAO
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Your killing me...
Autodoc....
Your ineptitude and lack of intelligence is killing me....you and 2Fast need to get together.....
Once again.....uneducated workers thinking they know more than management.
If we are so dumb how is that you have a company to work for that apparently makes enough money to give you a paycheque, because according to you profitability has nothing to do with the Unions.
Frank Stronach ran for the liberal party.....Belinda ran for the conservatives......why the difference......its called OPPORTUNITY...each ran when they were ready to run for the party with the opportunity.
As for the home vs. factory accident.......you still don't get it.....of course there are more accidents at home simply becuase there are more homes than plants and more people are in homes but not everyone in the world works in an automotive plant. For the record the last two Magna plants I was at had 0 lost time accidents, which helped give us a higher profit rate than whatever company is dumb enough to employ you.
But if I follow your logic you must agree that ice cream is far more dangerous than nuclear bombs since ice cream has caused more deaths than nuclear bombs.
As for tax breaks and credits.....Do you understand how the tax system in this country works?
If I give $100 to a charity and get a tax credit or income deduction (I don't want to explain the differences in case I confuse you) at 29%, that means I get $29 back in my taxes. BUT I STILL DONATED A NET AMOUNT OF $71 OUT OF MY POCKET.
Had myself/Magna chose not to donate money but instead be taxed on the money I would pay a federal marginal rate of 26% and therefore I WOULD STILL HAVE $74 IN MY POCKET and the government, not charity would have the rest.
So you see, you idiot, that donating to charity actually COSTS MAGNA MONEY.
Nobody gets back dollar for dollar what you spend or donate. Tax credit only lessen the net effect of the contribution/expenditure. TAX DECUCTIONS/CREDITS DO NOT MAKE ANYONE MONEY as you are only getting back the tax rate not 100% of the money you spent or donated.
This is the same process/benefit your precious CAW enjoys when fighting for animal rights and banning nuclear weapons, etc.
PLEASE, FOR YOUR OWN SAFETY, GO AND SIT DOWN BEFORE YOU HURT YOURSELF.
Autodoc....
Your ineptitude and lack of intelligence is killing me....you and 2Fast need to get together.....
Once again.....uneducated workers thinking they know more than management.
If we are so dumb how is that you have a company to work for that apparently makes enough money to give you a paycheque, because according to you profitability has nothing to do with the Unions.
Frank Stronach ran for the liberal party.....Belinda ran for the conservatives......why the difference......its called OPPORTUNITY...each ran when they were ready to run for the party with the opportunity.
As for the home vs. factory accident.......you still don't get it.....of course there are more accidents at home simply becuase there are more homes than plants and more people are in homes but not everyone in the world works in an automotive plant. For the record the last two Magna plants I was at had 0 lost time accidents, which helped give us a higher profit rate than whatever company is dumb enough to employ you.
But if I follow your logic you must agree that ice cream is far more dangerous than nuclear bombs since ice cream has caused more deaths than nuclear bombs.
As for tax breaks and credits.....Do you understand how the tax system in this country works?
If I give $100 to a charity and get a tax credit or income deduction (I don't want to explain the differences in case I confuse you) at 29%, that means I get $29 back in my taxes. BUT I STILL DONATED A NET AMOUNT OF $71 OUT OF MY POCKET.
Had myself/Magna chose not to donate money but instead be taxed on the money I would pay a federal marginal rate of 26% and therefore I WOULD STILL HAVE $74 IN MY POCKET and the government, not charity would have the rest.
So you see, you idiot, that donating to charity actually COSTS MAGNA MONEY.
Nobody gets back dollar for dollar what you spend or donate. Tax credit only lessen the net effect of the contribution/expenditure. TAX DECUCTIONS/CREDITS DO NOT MAKE ANYONE MONEY as you are only getting back the tax rate not 100% of the money you spent or donated.
This is the same process/benefit your precious CAW enjoys when fighting for animal rights and banning nuclear weapons, etc.
PLEASE, FOR YOUR OWN SAFETY, GO AND SIT DOWN BEFORE YOU HURT YOURSELF.
Hugh Jorgan said:
Your Honor.....I rest my case... **LMFHO**
His head will never come out of his ass.
Hugh Jorgan said:
Get off your high horse and go fuck yourself Hugh. You seem to like unsults so that should be right up your alley.
You're fucking clueless. You have no idea what anyone's level of education is. You've made it quite clear that you're incapable of having any kind of meaningfull conversation without insults and namecalling. At every corner where your facts were challenged, you changed the subject.
I've worked in my CAW job over the years with many people like you, it's quite entertaining for those of us who actually make the products that keep the plant running when your type leaves his little office and shows up on the floor without a clue how things are done. Go back to sitting in front of your computer screen spouting your Magna propaganda.
Thankfully, my seniority has grown enough now that i'll not be laid off again, and have to work for Magna to be treated like a second class piece of shit. And next time there's a union drive, i'll be first in line outside the guardshack handing out info to help the temps recieve the respect they deserve.
Hope to see you there!!!
Chivas Regal said:
All this discussion re temps is way off topic , it really doesn't address the real issue are unions good or bad it is only discussing one specific issue temps. To those who think unions are good I think it's time to realize that we live in a worls economy and for a large part must compete against non unionized countries. In toronto there are thousands of small businesses that do millions of business collectively. These companies would fold if forced to unionize. unions think people who sweep floors should make $ 16 per hr , small companies can't afford this
And so...
Yes, I think I'll just return to my ivory tower, count all the money I make, give you a share and continue making the wise business decisions that help to keep you employed and TELLING YOU WHAT PRODUCT TO MAKE AND HOW YOU WILL MAKE IT.
But to get everyting back on target........No unions = good.....unions = bad
And for autodoctor.....I'm assuming you have chose to rest your case becuase you don't comprehend the remedial tax and finance lesson I gave you.....but that's okay...you just go back to sweeping the floor and let the smart people make the business decisions.
Yes, I think I'll just return to my ivory tower, count all the money I make, give you a share and continue making the wise business decisions that help to keep you employed and TELLING YOU WHAT PRODUCT TO MAKE AND HOW YOU WILL MAKE IT.
But to get everyting back on target........No unions = good.....unions = bad
And for autodoctor.....I'm assuming you have chose to rest your case becuase you don't comprehend the remedial tax and finance lesson I gave you.....but that's okay...you just go back to sweeping the floor and let the smart people make the business decisions.
agreed
yes....I will agree....the problem becomes when either side has too much power/influence and uses it to the detriment of the other.
yes....I will agree....the problem becomes when either side has too much power/influence and uses it to the detriment of the other.
Forcing the choice of unions = good/bad is a waste of time. The true answer is it depends. But then that doesn't satisfy the bizarre need of today's society to have everything be black and white with crystal clear delineations. Such answers are totally useless and only serve to increase ignorance, rather then reduce it.
The phrase "A company gets the union it deserves" is the best, most concise way to describe whether unions are good or bad. If a company is good to it's employees (and I mean good in a monolithic sense, rather than what management thinks of itself - which is quite often wrong), then chances are it won't have a union. If it's bad to employees, then chances are it will.
Once a union's in place, the relationship between management and the union dictates the effect that each will have on the other. Just b/c a union is present doesn't mean the relationship will be negative.
There are no simple answers. But it's better to understand the subject and not have a definitive answer than to have a definitive answer and not understand the subject.
IMHO.
The phrase "A company gets the union it deserves" is the best, most concise way to describe whether unions are good or bad. If a company is good to it's employees (and I mean good in a monolithic sense, rather than what management thinks of itself - which is quite often wrong), then chances are it won't have a union. If it's bad to employees, then chances are it will.
Once a union's in place, the relationship between management and the union dictates the effect that each will have on the other. Just b/c a union is present doesn't mean the relationship will be negative.
There are no simple answers. But it's better to understand the subject and not have a definitive answer than to have a definitive answer and not understand the subject.
IMHO.
The thing I don't like about unions is there senior qualified policy on job vacancies. It doesn't really matter how much education you have or how qualified you are, the person with more seniority who barely meets the minium qualifications gets the job. And these qualifications are usually no more than a high school education. This is a big problem since the company eventually ends up consisting of unqualified people who don't care about upgrading there education or skills.
backflush said:
Not true
If you are in a field that is constantly expanding. A tech has to learn on the fly and produce results.
Hugh Jorgan said:
LMFAO.... No I did not give much of a response because what you said showed how much of a ding dong dork you are without me stating that. Why don't you take your foot out of your mouth and put the other one in. No even better put both in.
Yeah...go back to your entry level management job and finish counting the widgets that your temp staff has polished. If your one of Magna's up coming management stars....don't mind me if I keep laughing. Your doing a great job.
**I feel sorry for these guys... I keep telling myself they have family to feed as well**
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