Sexless relationship of 3 years - tips?

[Jami77]

I think your are wrong to discount jealousy. I think its the key.

IMO the opposite of jealous is boredom. Like when you are jealous of all those people who have the dream car that you want and then you finally buy one and 2 months later you are bored of it. Cant remember the term but its a psychological fact that humans do that. For men and women if there is no spark of possibility of losing the other partner then boredom sets in.

For a man or woman to keep their partner interested they have to believe that its still possible to lose there partner to another. If I get fat and sit on the couch all day the wife will get bored. If I stay fit and have lots of social contact with other women then theres a shred of jealousy which keeps the spark alive. And it works both ways. If my wife was fit and hanging with guys at the gym do you think I'd be sitting on the couch expecting her to come home and cook for me? - no - cos thats how I would lose her.

So jealousy is a key player in all of this. Like it or not thats the chemical spark that exists when you start dating - always the questions of do you like me?, where is this going? are we exclsuive? Is there anyone else? Its human nature to be jealous. Its in our DNA.

So if anyone is in a sexless marriage they need to look at themselves and think - what have I done to kill the spark? And if that person starts going to the gym, wearing nicer clothes, developing hobbies with lots of social activities with the opposite sex... then along comes the jealousy.... and the spark.... and hopefully the sex.

 

[bggolfingmaniac]

I was in your shoes only older and we just separated last fall. My only regret thus far is not doing it much sooner, I feel like half of the tension in my body has left the building... I let my guilt keep me in a dying marriage I estimate at a few years of the 20 we were married and my advice? YMMV but I'd consider ending your marriage, if sex matters that much to you. In my case it was only a part of the problem, but it was always the one that pissed me off the most and wound up causing me to visit companions.

Oddly enough our split had been amicable too.

Happy to take offline if you want to bounce something off me.

 

[jeff2]

Women are creators. They want to create something new whether it’s a partnership and or a child. They want maslow.
advising to make a woman jealous is how to create a toxic relationship and creating or worsening attachment issues and degrades and exhausts the relationship.
relationships need Constant attention and communication and realigning goals (yes they can change and evolve.). A cadence is necessary. Both parties aren’t mind readers. Women want to feel desired just as much. Women don’t want to beg for sex. Women don’t want tofeel needy. Men will tell women they are being needy and too much or too sensitive. Men are telling women not to be women.

Creators? More like shit disturbers. They can't stand to see a guy satisfied..

 

[Jami77]

Creators? More like shit disturbers. They can't stand to see a guy satisfied..

Ha ha ha - thanks for cheering me up - ha ha ha - actually laughing my head off right now.... and so very true....

although maybe its true - my wife is definitely a creator - she always seems to create something out of nothing...... still laughing....

 

[Muchadoaboutnothing]

I never advised to make a woman jealous. I said that she should know that you will wander if you are not happy. Doesn't mean that you will, but it's essence of that feeling that will keep her focused on your needs.
"re-aligning goals" sounds too clinical and I have never met a couple who had sex issues and resolved them by talking about them at length. In theory it should work. But in practice, it rarely does because usually it's one person who needs to make concessions and "take one for the team" once in a while. The result is not genuine and not driven by passion.

In any relationship that has dissolved among people I know, it's rarely mutual. It's usually that one person has checked out long before it's officially over and has no further interest in staying. Mentally they have moved on before the other person was actually aware of issues. The other person is usually more invested and is typically the one who is hurt more afterwards often feeling blindsided or betrayed on some level.

And that’s still a toxic thing to do. Threatening to wander.… what next? Coercive control?
if couples communicated clearly and regularly theres no need for the boy who cries wolf and otherwise. This is petty.
if a woman said this to a man ….
when I hear people I’ve never met as an argument for what’s normal it makes me take the argument less serious. When have you been in a situation where you would open up to this level for a good survey? With all of your male friends or is it when drinking ? is it in public or somewhere at someone’s home? Do you ask with your friends and their wives present ? So much is dependent on these questions of context and more. By talking out loud for however long is needed by the two specific individuals is what will bring some sort of way forward. Otherwise someone is becoming resentful and a way to evolve the relationship seems more difficult.

 

[Muchadoaboutnothing]

Creators? More like shit disturbers. They can't stand to see a guy satisfied..

Whatever, rolling stone

 

[Muchadoaboutnothing]

I think your are wrong to discount jealousy. I think its the key.

IMO the opposite of jealous is boredom. Like when you are jealous of all those people who have the dream car that you want and then you finally buy one and 2 months later you are bored of it. Cant remember the term but its a psychological fact that humans do that. For men and women if there is no spark of possibility of losing the other partner then boredom sets in.

For a man or woman to keep their partner interested they have to believe that its still possible to lose there partner to another. If I get fat and sit on the couch all day the wife will get bored. If I stay fit and have lots of social contact with other women then theres a shred of jealousy which keeps the spark alive. And it works both ways. If my wife was fit and hanging with guys at the gym do you think I'd be sitting on the couch expecting her to come home and cook for me? - no - cos thats how I would lose her.

So jealousy is a key player in all of this. Like it or not thats the chemical spark that exists when you start dating - always the questions of do you like me?, where is this going? are we exclsuive? Is there anyone else? Its human nature to be jealous. Its in our DNA.

So if anyone is in a sexless marriage they need to look at themselves and think - what have I done to kill the spark? And if that person starts going to the gym, wearing nicer clothes, developing hobbies with lots of social activities with the opposite sex... then along comes the jealousy.... and the spark.... and hopefully the sex.

This is ridiculous. And toxic. So you’re the man who is getting a woman pregnant and having children for her to take of AND you want to make her jealous. And you expect her to quickly focus on her looks and body instead of nurturing a family to make you concerned she’s going to have sex with her physical trainer?
it’s not about jealousy. Super negative connotation.
the better way to look at is is both parties need to show gratitude to one another and both be reminded of what it could have been like or could be if they don’t continually stay on the same team. This can even be done by attending events together or dinner parties and then openly discussing thoughts and opinions and point out explicit examples that are able
to be recalled then as a comparison to ehh your relationship feels successful and what you wouldn’t like to happen between you two.

the questions about where the relationship is going and such is to assess if they will partner together to stay safe and secure and be each other person. If they align on what they each value and prioritize and if they can align on communication if they have goals or
an interest in setting them together. It’s about planning timelines near and distant.

 

[Jami77]

This is ridiculous. And toxic. So you’re the man who is getting a woman pregnant and having children for her to take of AND you want to make her jealous. And you expect her to quickly focus on her looks and body instead of nurturing a family to make you concerned she’s going to have sex with her physical trainer?
it’s not about jealousy. Super negative connotation.
the better way to look at is is both parties need to show gratitude to one another and both be reminded of what it could have been like or could be if they don’t continually stay on the same team. This can even be done by attending events together or dinner parties and then openly discussing thoughts and opinions and point out explicit examples that are able
to be recalled then as a comparison to ehh your relationship feels successful and what you wouldn’t like to happen between you two.

the questions about where the relationship is going and such is to assess if they will partner together to stay safe and secure and be each other person. If they align on what they each value and prioritize and if they can align on communication if they have goals or
an interest in setting them together. It’s about planning timelines near and distant.

Its not a toxic opinion. Its based on a lot of science and research. If you read any book on human biology and mating (Red Queen, The Selfish Gene, Sperm Wars, Why Women Have Sex, Mating in Captivity) you will see that originally sex and mating is all about allowing your DNA to continue. Thats it - very basic. And the psychology around that leads to our behaviours, and many of the problems we have these days are from moulding those basic behaviours to modern society. Note that most of those books are written by female scientists - not that it really matters.

The problem is when people suggest that understanding any of those behaviours is ridiculous and toxic. When you think that about a concept such as this you close off your mind and are unable to see what is real only what you want to be real.

Also note in my post I did not blame male or female but suggested it could be either party at fault. I also did not say anything about getting a woman pregnant AND making her jealous. I suggested that the opposite of jealousy was boredom and it could be male or female that is bored.

So how do you get rid of the boredom? By doing everything that is the opposite of boredom which, by making the other person jealous might relight the spark. If my wife decides on her own volition to go to the gym and get herself a sexy body then its going to force me to up my game also or I risk losing her. I'm not telling her to go to the gym - but if she did - maybe she if thinking of divorcing my lazy ass - then I'm going to pay attention.

Its human nature for me to do so. Its the jealousy concept.

However I do find women are very quick to label any man who is interested in this concept, and who may promote these ideas as "Toxic". If you really think its toxic and ridiculous I would love to hear your opinions on any of the books I mentioned. These are not my ideas. I cant take credit for them. And its often women writing about and promoting these ideas. Would you call any of these female authors toxic and ridiculous?

Also whilst I 100% agree with your statement "the better way to look at is is both parties need to show gratitude to one another and both be reminded of what it could have been like or could be if they don’t continually stay on the same team. " the problem, as I mentioned, is when one side gets lazy and wont do this - then the other person has to find a solution. If one cant talk to the other then one commonly suggested way to bring them back into the fold to continue the conversation is to relate to human nature and make them jealous. Then when they wake up to their partner, the pair of them can talk and go out and continue the relationship.

Both sexes can go off sex with their partner and I think its fair for the other to fight for sex as well as the relationship. Women would not think twice about a divorce if their man lost his libido - this was actually just reported in the UK times - Times - women obsessed with sex but not with their partners.

At the end of the day this post its all about helping two people maintain a functional relationship that is satisfying to both. That was the original question asked.

What part of any of this is toxic?

 

[Jami77]

Heres another article that follows a similar thread - Times - My Partner is Overweight in which a woman is complaining about her husband being overweight and how to help him lose it.

In the article she says " I remember a relationship expert saying in these pages that his wife would tell him, “That belly is not sexy.” The guy didn’t take it personally; he stopped snacking and got to the gym."

and another woman says to her husband- “What about my desire?You wouldn’t find me attractive if I got really big.”

So, an article written by a woman talking about women telling the guys to get fit so as to increase their attraction to keep the relationship alive.

Is that toxic? Or ridiculous? What if the article was written by a man and he told his wife that her belly wasnt sexy?

The main difference in my original post is that instead of telling your partner to lose weight/get fit etc you just do what all the biologists suggest and lose the weight yourself - get yourself super sexy and hopefully you will spark the interest and encourage the other half to follow suit.

So which is correct - telling the partner to lose the weight like the women in the article suggest - or just doing it yourself like I originally suggested? Id suggest the less controlling option is to work on yourself and hope the other follows along. However if my wife were to tell me to lose some weight - actually she did recently - then I'm not gonna sulk and be all violated I'm actually just gonna do it.

 

[Skoob]

And that’s still a toxic thing to do. Threatening to wander.… what next? Coercive control?
if couples communicated clearly and regularly theres no need for the boy who cries wolf and otherwise. This is petty.
if a woman said this to a man ….
when I hear people I’ve never met as an argument for what’s normal it makes me take the argument less serious. When have you been in a situation where you would open up to this level for a good survey? With all of your male friends or is it when drinking ? is it in public or somewhere at someone’s home? Do you ask with your friends and their wives present ? So much is dependent on these questions of context and more. By talking out loud for however long is needed by the two specific individuals is what will bring some sort of way forward. Otherwise someone is becoming resentful and a way to evolve the relationship seems more difficult.

It's called opinion and personal experience. You can take it as serious as you like, doesn't matter to me.
Candid conversations with people I know really well. No one was drunk or high.

Why does location matter? I'm not writing a novel here.

 

[xix]

Maybe here are some clues...

Menopause and Divorce

What do you think? Drop a comment below to share. Want to learn more about Dr. Haver and her work in the field of menopause? Check out our website: https://t...

www.youtube.com

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Dr.+Mary+Claire+Haver%2C+MD+-+Menopause+and+Divorce

 

[james t kirk]

I would say open communication is key to understand the root cause of lack of sex. Troubles at work with her combined medical condition can explain there maybe lack of energy to do anything including sex. More casual contact like hugging or hold hands might overcome these road blocks.

I think the number one reason is quite simple. A lot of women just aren't that horny /sexual. They just aren't into it, even if you were George Clooney with an 8 inch cock.

The number 2 reason is motherhood. Motherhood and sex drive are often contained on one toggle switch. Turn the mothering switch on and the sex switch clicks to off.

 

[Jami77]

I think the number one reason is quite simple. A lot of women just aren't that horny /sexual. They just aren't into it, even if you were George Clooney with an 8 inch cock.

The number 2 reason is motherhood. Motherhood and sex drive are often contained on one toggle switch. Turn the mothering switch on and the sex switch clicks to off.

I agree. I find that there are a lot of authors who say women like sex the same or more than men. Maybe people who write these books are drawn to the field because thet are highly sexual.

But my personal experience would say otherwise. So either the authors are wrong - and women really aren't that horny/sexual or I am meeting the wrong women?

Motherhood does indeed involve a lot of stress on the woman so its no surprise that shes too tired for sex.

 

[jeff2]

I agree. I find that there are a lot of authors who say women like sex the same or more than men. Maybe people who write these books are drawn to the field because thet are highly sexual.

But my personal experience would say otherwise. So either the authors are wrong - and women really aren't that horny/sexual or I am meeting the wrong women?

Motherhood does indeed involve a lot of stress on the woman so its no surprise that shes too tired for sex.

Yeah. It is not the same. Women are more practical. Men are more about extremes(more bums and CEOs). Men come up with a lot of fantasies.

 

[chrispalen]

I agree. I find that there are a lot of authors who say women like sex the same or more than men. Maybe people who write these books are drawn to the field because thet are highly sexual.

But my personal experience would say otherwise. So either the authors are wrong - and women really aren't that horny/sexual or I am meeting the wrong women?

Motherhood does indeed involve a lot of stress on the woman so its no surprise that shes too tired for sex.

In general, for most married men, they mostly after honey moon is over, have less and less intimate sex with their wife, mostly because the wife is pre-occupied with other things such as taking care of most of the house work,
babies, some have a job outside of home. In general, the excitement of hooking up with an eligible man is over. That is why married men tend to hobby.

CP

 

[Muchadoaboutnothing]

Maybe here are some clues...

Menopause and Divorce

What do you think? Drop a comment below to share. Want to learn more about Dr. Haver and her work in the field of menopause? Check out our website: https://t...

www.youtube.com

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Dr.+Mary+Claire+Haver%2C+MD+-+Menopause+and+Divorce

The same can be said for when women go off of birth control

 

[Muchadoaboutnothing]

I agree. I find that there are a lot of authors who say women like sex the same or more than men. Maybe people who write these books are drawn to the field because thet are highly sexual.

But my personal experience would say otherwise. So either the authors are wrong - and women really aren't that horny/sexual or I am meeting the wrong women?

Motherhood does indeed involve a lot of stress on the woman so its no surprise that shes too tired for sex.

Well they say that men marry virtue. So there’s conflicting messaging being aimed at women and men individually and collectively. Which again is why communication is so paramount

 

[xix]

I agree. I find that there are a lot of authors who say women like sex the same or more than men. Maybe people who write these books are drawn to the field because thet are highly sexual.

But my personal experience would say otherwise. So either the authors are wrong - and women really aren't that horny/sexual or I am meeting the wrong women?

Motherhood does indeed involve a lot of stress on the woman so its no surprise that shes too tired for sex.

Karma.
In my teens only one unbalanced chic chased me, I am glad I said no.
Now at work I see the divorcees have their FWB or one night stand. And they always try to hint or hit on me. I say no.
I have moral values.

 

[Jami77]

If you look at a lot of the biology and anthoplogy science mentioned before, a lot of it boils down to the fact that humans were never meant to be monogomous in the first place. We originally lived in small tribes and when the child is just a few years old he leaves the care of his mother and is cared for by the village. The man then goes off and is able to couple up with other women. Theyve studied modern day tribes in the jungle - and they can be thousands of miles from each other but all tribes seem to naturally work this way.

In those tribes its our genes and instincts that run the whole thing. And male and female genes basically are wired differently - women lose their sex drive after baby is born so they have time and energy to nurture the baby, but men are naturally wired to keep on keeping on. They instinctively know its time to move on. Ever hear how woman are super horny during pregnancy? And they dont know why... Its their genes doing everything to keep the man around long enough to keep the woman safe throughout the pregnancy.

In all these tribes long term marriage is totally unatural. So for a modern man and woman to be married they are going against their natures. And its way harder for a man.

A woman is wired to stay at home and be a nurturer - so after baby is born its simple to follow these instincts. But a man is wired to spread his seed - so for him to stay home and be committed to one person takes unbelievable self control.

They say that for a woman to give 100% of herself to a marriage is actually easy since she is wired that way. But for a man to give even 80 or 90% is a massive amount of commitment and energy to fight his nature. A lot of women dont realise what a man has to give up to be in a committed relationship. We dont get enough credit for that.

There's an interesting history behind marriage too and why it came into being. Back in the middle ages in the UK and many other European countries the tradition was to do whats known as a handfasting, where man and woman were tied together in a ceremony. That handfasting was an early form of marriage - but it was only supposed to last a year - if they wanted to stay together after the year that was fine and if they wanted to split that was fine too. Everyone was pretty chill about it. In that year a woman would get pregnant and she would be assisted by her family - aunts, parents, sisters, and the father and brothers would feed her and look after her safety etc.

Then the romans and catholics took over and it all turned to crap (as it often does when the church gets involved) - Long story short the commoners continued their way of life and the lords of the land (with the backing of the church) would steal all the women to live in the castle in harems for the kings and knights and noblemen. (Braveheart and Robin Hood all based on true stories). It got to a point where the common folk started to riot and rebel against the church, state and nobel men so they could get some action too (only the hags were left for the common folk) so at the lass second to avoid carnage, mass riots and kings being beheaded it was decreed that one man should only have one woman - and the modern idea of being married to one woman for life was born. Some kings didnt like this - and one in particular started his own church so he could divorce his wives. You might have heard of the story.

Preetty much all of British history is based on who is shagging who and who can sow his wild oats more than everyone else (note back in the day oats was considered an athrodisiac hence the phrase).

So there you have it - humans were never meant to be monogomous, or married for life. Our modern society has messed everything up for both sexes and we spend the rest of our lives trying to sort out this fucked up situation.

Yeah communication works - but only to the degree that both partners will do it. And there has to be some leeway - if the woman isnt having sex with her man then she has to expect that its an unnatural situation for the man to be in.... and as one scientist once said "nature will always find a way."

Edit: Fuck that was a long post. But shit its true. I dare anyone to argue with me and the (female) scientists that wrote the books but I missed a bit out.... Its the thing that keeps modern marriages working... so anyway interlude over.... and...

From the bible: Shenanigans 3:12 "And God said this "one man one woman malarky" is an unholy abomination and so the lord said s let their be asian massage parlours and so there was and he was not done yet when he said and let there be women of the night who men shall worship for a certain sum and man was happy and woman at home was blessed with a husband who shared his happiness by going out into the night and visiting the superstore and coming home hence with bags full of goodness... and so everyone was happy and he said let their be light in the brothel at the end of the street and man walked towards the light and paid his house fee and went in for just a massage and came out happy as was and life was grand..."

And man was happy. And we hail all our praises on the woman at home and the woman at the end of the street.

Men love women. All women (well most not the psychos) Were just not allowed to worship them all at the same time. One at a time and as discreet as you can manage.

Praise to the sex professional for she saves the modern marriage.

 

[Jami77]

This article out of the UK about how many times people have sex -
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/how-often-have-sex-month-week-katherine-ryan-78tx2d2c5

Basically says that the comedian Katherine Ryan admitted to having sex twice a month and most parents consider that a lot. Read the article - one woman even says "I dont see my husband like that any more"!!

I would say that it would put me off having kids!!!

Also says 1 in 4 men have sex but only 1 in 10 women have sex. So are the 4 men having sex with the same woman? I never understand how that stastic works...

And I like how they always say "are sexually active" - so does that count all the women who just lie there. I've known a few who are definitely not very active during sex.