Looking for the best BIG television
- Thread starter CUPID
- Start date
frank, HDMI is simply the name for one of the digital video connection standard ( DVI , for example , being the other )frankcastle said:
As mentioned, you'd still need HD signal/source material and a true HD mon/TV to view HD in it's full glory.
Here is a link if you want to dig deeper on the topic.
http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/specsformats/HDMIinterfaceguide.php
No, I'm concerned about image accuracy. IE, the TV should be able to reproduce IRE 0 and calibrated to a flat 6500 K.tboy said:
There is blacker-than-black (black is IRE 7.5, blacker than black is IRE 0), if the TV can't reproduce blacker than black properly, it will result in what's called as "black crush" where the details of black will be lost OR if you boost the brightness and contrast so you can see the details, the black will be off-black.tboy said:
Maybe in a lighted viewing room. My viewing room is lit based on ISF and THX standard, I was trained by them too. I have yet to see a plasma or LCD monitor that produces real IRE 0. Of course, I'm talking about sub-$20k plasmas and LCDstboy said:
hdmi - high definition multimedia interface (carries BOTH video and sound in one cable)...slightly better than HD in terms of video.frankcastle said:
as for Plasma, i like the idea of them, but, just something about it, i wouldn't go with them yet.
the pixel issues are the problem, every manufacturer has different rules for pixel blowouts, and even then, they're very vague.
ie -
one companies rules for pixels may be...
6 pixels within 3 inches inside the border of the screen.
3 have to be white, 2 black, 1 green, etc, etc...
they all vary.
Try calling different manufacturers on different days, speak to different reps, ask the same question.
"what's the warranty issue about pixel blow outs on your LCDs and Plasmas?"
Guaranteed you'll get a "uhhh, uhhh, (then some answer)".
Call a different day, and you'll again, get a different answer.
Or "it's a case by case discretion" thing.
So if you have one pixel that's out or mis-coloured, and it's sitting dead centre of the screen, you're SOL, for a repair or warranty.
NO thanks, not for the kind of money I'm spending. Don't need/want that hassle.
I'd rather deal with a bulb going bust. (projection TV's).
Okay, time for a quick glossary for those who aren't yet as familiar with some of the terms which have been used. It's not a formal set of definitions, but more of an introduction. For more details, there are reference websites cited above. Most of the people posting will already know all of this; it's intended to help others keep up.
Note that most movies are shot and displayed at 24 full movie frames per second.
480i: 480 lines of image, interlaced in two "fields" of 240 lines each. 29.97 frames per second (i.e. about 60 fields per second). Standard Definition (SDTV) in North America (using the NTSC standard). Motion shows "artifacts" as interleaved fields show pieces in slightly different locations.
Note that when a movie is converted from 24fps to 29.97fps, one of a number of techniques must be used to "stretch" the content.
525i: like 480i, but inludes a count of the "off-screen" lines.
480p: 480 lines, progressive scan.
720p: some call this "High Definition", although generally falling into less use.
1080i, 1080p: this is typically what people mean today when they refer to HiDef (HDTV). Most sources promise that 1080p is "coming soon" while 1080i is available now.
4:3 (1.333:1) or 16:9 refers to the width:height ratio. 4:3 is standard; 16:9 is a widescreen ratio (although some other ratios are also used for widescreen).
Composite Video: a commonly used video signal with "all" the video information in one ("RCA-style") connector.
S-Video: a commonly used video signal / connector format, with various information separated into different wires (e.g. sync info separated from Red/Green/Blue information).
VGA: might refer to a 640x480 (WxH) pixel image resolution, or to the connector used for such a signal ("DB-15", shaped something like a "D", with 15 pins).
XVGA, WXGA (etc): refers to particular pixel image resolutions, roughly corresponding with HiDef and Widescreen HiDef images.
HDMI: in an attempt to limit opportunities for piracy, a new connector, called HDMI, is used for High Definition signals. Components are able to validate each other, and ensure that copyrights are respected. Many sources will only output their "full" High-Def signal using HDMI. Some will also output the full signal using Composite, or S-Video, although image quality will suffer slightly with the sync and colour information combined onto one wire.
Blu-ray and HD-TV are two competing formats for "next-generation DVDs". Blu-ray has higher theoretical capacity with multiple layers of information, but early products have been judged as less easily used than comparable HD-TV products. (Blu-ray would seem to have made a tactical error in the encoding format used, which keeps movies under 25Gig for now (the capacity of one layer), but uses a compression level which is noticable when played). Few movies are available in either format at this time, although more are coming available every week. Some have been "upconverted" from Standard Definition; a few are available in "native" high-def resolutions.
Note that most movies are shot and displayed at 24 full movie frames per second.
480i: 480 lines of image, interlaced in two "fields" of 240 lines each. 29.97 frames per second (i.e. about 60 fields per second). Standard Definition (SDTV) in North America (using the NTSC standard). Motion shows "artifacts" as interleaved fields show pieces in slightly different locations.
Note that when a movie is converted from 24fps to 29.97fps, one of a number of techniques must be used to "stretch" the content.
525i: like 480i, but inludes a count of the "off-screen" lines.
480p: 480 lines, progressive scan.
720p: some call this "High Definition", although generally falling into less use.
1080i, 1080p: this is typically what people mean today when they refer to HiDef (HDTV). Most sources promise that 1080p is "coming soon" while 1080i is available now.
4:3 (1.333:1) or 16:9 refers to the width:height ratio. 4:3 is standard; 16:9 is a widescreen ratio (although some other ratios are also used for widescreen).
Composite Video: a commonly used video signal with "all" the video information in one ("RCA-style") connector.
S-Video: a commonly used video signal / connector format, with various information separated into different wires (e.g. sync info separated from Red/Green/Blue information).
VGA: might refer to a 640x480 (WxH) pixel image resolution, or to the connector used for such a signal ("DB-15", shaped something like a "D", with 15 pins).
XVGA, WXGA (etc): refers to particular pixel image resolutions, roughly corresponding with HiDef and Widescreen HiDef images.
HDMI: in an attempt to limit opportunities for piracy, a new connector, called HDMI, is used for High Definition signals. Components are able to validate each other, and ensure that copyrights are respected. Many sources will only output their "full" High-Def signal using HDMI. Some will also output the full signal using Composite, or S-Video, although image quality will suffer slightly with the sync and colour information combined onto one wire.
Blu-ray and HD-TV are two competing formats for "next-generation DVDs". Blu-ray has higher theoretical capacity with multiple layers of information, but early products have been judged as less easily used than comparable HD-TV products. (Blu-ray would seem to have made a tactical error in the encoding format used, which keeps movies under 25Gig for now (the capacity of one layer), but uses a compression level which is noticable when played). Few movies are available in either format at this time, although more are coming available every week. Some have been "upconverted" from Standard Definition; a few are available in "native" high-def resolutions.
Yep, DVI was the technology in between, component video and HDMI.
DVI came out after component, but since things were moving so fast, HDMI was out (created).
But some manufacturers didn't want to push HDMI so fast, because they wanted to make some $ on their DVI ready units.
I don't think it's THAT noticeable in difference.
My TV has DVI only. I use component cables on my DVD, no complaints from me.
You REALLY gotta be a hardcore video-file to notice the differences in DVI/HDMI quality (even between component and DVI).
I mean anyone going from a regular CRT(tube TV) to any projection style TV with component cables is gonna love the quality period.
Just think about how much Plasma's cost 2 years ago and how much they are today...
I think the manufacturers just want to push on you, to get the hottest latest technologies and it works. My 2¢...
ps - Don't ever buy Monster Cables, over-priced GREAT LOOKING cables with nice packaging, that's it.
Acoustic Research cables will do the same job as Monster at almost half the price.
DVI came out after component, but since things were moving so fast, HDMI was out (created).
But some manufacturers didn't want to push HDMI so fast, because they wanted to make some $ on their DVI ready units.
I don't think it's THAT noticeable in difference.
My TV has DVI only. I use component cables on my DVD, no complaints from me.
You REALLY gotta be a hardcore video-file to notice the differences in DVI/HDMI quality (even between component and DVI).
I mean anyone going from a regular CRT(tube TV) to any projection style TV with component cables is gonna love the quality period.
Just think about how much Plasma's cost 2 years ago and how much they are today...
I think the manufacturers just want to push on you, to get the hottest latest technologies and it works. My 2¢...
ps - Don't ever buy Monster Cables, over-priced GREAT LOOKING cables with nice packaging, that's it.
Acoustic Research cables will do the same job as Monster at almost half the price.
Especially when AR cables are manufactured at the same plant with the same specs as the Monster counterpartCobster said:
quick addition:
there are 2 types of DVI
Regular DVI and DVI with HDCP.
DVI with HDCP is equivalent to HDMI 1.0 just with different connector and MINUS the sound-passing capability (HDMI passes video and audio, DVI is video only).
The current version of HDMI is HDMI 1.3
Visit HDMI.org for further info.
there are 2 types of DVI
Regular DVI and DVI with HDCP.
DVI with HDCP is equivalent to HDMI 1.0 just with different connector and MINUS the sound-passing capability (HDMI passes video and audio, DVI is video only).
The current version of HDMI is HDMI 1.3
Visit HDMI.org for further info.
lol yep, probably.monkeychan said:
We tore up some AR cables and had some torn up Monster ones.
IDENTICAL inside. (same cable types, same shieldings, same everything, just the outside on Monster looked more purrrdy).
Monster's products are all about packaging, and don't get me wrong, they're really nice looking cables. But they're BEHIND all your products, so who cares.
Best place to buy from - 1) Bay Bloor Radio for service; 2) Best buy or Future Shop for $$, but little service.
Best brand to get - Sony, Pioneer for plasma
Best models - Sony 60" SXRD
What should I look for? - Real HD screens. This means that the screen must have a "native display" of 1080 horizontal lines. Don't be fooled by TV's that say "supported resolution" or "can display" 1080.
We are talking about the actual number of physical pixels on the screen here. The Sony SXRD display is 1920x1080 pixels. Don't buy any screen that is 720, as it will need to downgrade a true HD picture (1080) in order to display it. Everytime you resize a picture to fit the screen , you lose picture quality.
You will see 1080i and 1080p screens. 1080p screens are just coming out and the most expensive. (p=progressive; i-interlaced) These terms refer to how the picture is drawn on the display, with progressive being the highest quality (if you have a DVD , and DVD player that supports 1080p.
Best brand to get - Sony, Pioneer for plasma
Best models - Sony 60" SXRD
What should I look for? - Real HD screens. This means that the screen must have a "native display" of 1080 horizontal lines. Don't be fooled by TV's that say "supported resolution" or "can display" 1080.
We are talking about the actual number of physical pixels on the screen here. The Sony SXRD display is 1920x1080 pixels. Don't buy any screen that is 720, as it will need to downgrade a true HD picture (1080) in order to display it. Everytime you resize a picture to fit the screen , you lose picture quality.
You will see 1080i and 1080p screens. 1080p screens are just coming out and the most expensive. (p=progressive; i-interlaced) These terms refer to how the picture is drawn on the display, with progressive being the highest quality (if you have a DVD , and DVD player that supports 1080p.
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Okay, I think I opened up a can of worms here. I am suddenly being attacked by jargon I don't understand and am feeling a little confused by all of these different options.
Now it would appear as though Cobster and MonkeyChan have a good idea of what they are speaking of and both agree on this model...
http://www.hitachi.ca/Apps/hitachic...sion/details/60V525.html&path=jsp/hcl/hcl/en/
Is there anything more I should know about this type of TV before going ahead with it?
Jillian
Now it would appear as though Cobster and MonkeyChan have a good idea of what they are speaking of and both agree on this model...
http://www.hitachi.ca/Apps/hitachic...sion/details/60V525.html&path=jsp/hcl/hcl/en/
Is there anything more I should know about this type of TV before going ahead with it?
Jillian
Cobster,
there is one thing that confuses me about the Hitachi TV:
on the site it says "720p HD Format LCD Display"
but at the same time it says "1080p Processing"
From that I can only assume that all signal will be upsampled to 1080p then downsampled to be displayed at 720p (due to its maximum resolution).
IF (a big IF) that's the case, wouldn't Cupid be better off with a Sony SXRD LCD RPTV that is natively 1080p? (such as this http://www.sonystyle.ca/commerce/se...roductId=1001969&navigationPath=n32050n100187 ).
The other good thing about Sony SXRD series TV, it uses 3-separate LCDs (as opposed to Hitachi's or Sony's non-SXRD 3-layer LCD).
(not that the Hitachi is bad at all, I've seen it in action and it's pretty astonishing, but if the budget permits, my preference will go to Sony SXRD series. Even watching regular DVD looks like you're watching Hi-Def signal)
there is one thing that confuses me about the Hitachi TV:
on the site it says "720p HD Format LCD Display"
but at the same time it says "1080p Processing"
From that I can only assume that all signal will be upsampled to 1080p then downsampled to be displayed at 720p (due to its maximum resolution).
IF (a big IF) that's the case, wouldn't Cupid be better off with a Sony SXRD LCD RPTV that is natively 1080p? (such as this http://www.sonystyle.ca/commerce/se...roductId=1001969&navigationPath=n32050n100187 ).
The other good thing about Sony SXRD series TV, it uses 3-separate LCDs (as opposed to Hitachi's or Sony's non-SXRD 3-layer LCD).
(not that the Hitachi is bad at all, I've seen it in action and it's pretty astonishing, but if the budget permits, my preference will go to Sony SXRD series. Even watching regular DVD looks like you're watching Hi-Def signal)
monkeychan said:
standard coaxial cable = 480i interlaced
1080p means, Hitachi's TV will take interlaced signals at 1080i...and process (up convert) them as if they were 1080p looking.
1080p isn't available anywhere, not even in Hollywood (filming).
1080i would equate to a high def box from Rogers or Hell (bell). Some signals are also true 720p.
It's expensive and manufacturers would have to hang a hefty tag on it.
But for something that's not readily available in terms of films/tv-signals, it's sort of selling a feature that has minimal market.
Like I said, marketers try to sell you on things you won't use or don't need (yet).
Miss Cupid, the link above for the TV listed I noticed is for 2005's lineup.
It only has one HDMI input (the newest input connection).
The 2006 lineup has 2 HDMIs and a USB input (for computer or other electronics).
2006 = VG
2005 = VF
So its up to you, in my opinion, get the 2005 lineup, save more on the TV and get a better surround sound system, home theatre setup.
Or if you want something slightly better, splurge go for the 2006.
When the 2006 lineups come out, the 2005 will drop in price.
Something to think about.
Mr. Monkeychan, the Hitachi has a 3 panel setup as well, for red/green/blue, they call it the "HD LCD 3 Panel Light Engine".
So it's the same, Sony is quite expensive (not saying they suck, but it is overly priced IMHO. For what you're getting that's VERY comparable.
Sony, you're getting 50", silver borders for $4499, suggested retail price.
Hitachi (projection innovators), half the price, black border and still a great product.
I'd still go with Hitachi and get a nice killer surround sound system.
I don't use AR so I won't comment on it.
But I had the chance of comparing my Monster 200 bucks component cables to a relative's 70 bucks component cables. Same monitor, similar DVD player , and I could not tell the difference even with cailbration, looping a few scenes from a few fav dvd's.
The difference between my monsters and the standard component wires that came with was visibale, but not at all with the cheaper monsters ... LOL.
Would I spend over 200 loons for component or digital a/v wires in future ? I highly doubt that , without first auditioning and comparing.
Then there are those with big systems who swear by Monsters, and taralabs ( sp ? )
Better cables do improve the media. As long as I have the palette for the difference, I don't mind payable more , budget permitting.
Hmmm this is so frustrating! It seems each type of TV has its downfalls.
I thought all this info would help but now I feel overwhlemed.
Perhaps we can approach this another way.
What model best suits these criteria
a) 40 some odd in widescreen HD TV
b) compatible with PS/vid games
c) meant for a modest sized living room with windows (i.e. not dark room)
d) watching the TV from an angle is not an issue (it be awful if people came over to watch say the Superbowl and were treated to a blackish screen because they weren't sitting in the prime seats)
e) a TV that will last a long time and not need upgrades to use current available tech (e.g. blue ray or HD DVD)
f) price ideally between 2 and 3 K but being realistic it looks like 3 K +.
I thought all this info would help but now I feel overwhlemed.
Perhaps we can approach this another way.
What model best suits these criteria
a) 40 some odd in widescreen HD TV
b) compatible with PS/vid games
c) meant for a modest sized living room with windows (i.e. not dark room)
d) watching the TV from an angle is not an issue (it be awful if people came over to watch say the Superbowl and were treated to a blackish screen because they weren't sitting in the prime seats)
e) a TV that will last a long time and not need upgrades to use current available tech (e.g. blue ray or HD DVD)
f) price ideally between 2 and 3 K but being realistic it looks like 3 K +.
It's in what you quoted already. I'll work it this way anyhow :
HDMI is just an interface standard. To simplify it, it's just the name for the plug that gets your digital signals into your TV/Mon.
To to able to view HD content in true HD def, your TV/Mon would first need to be HD capable.
Having HDMI on your tv does not mean it is a HD ready TV, do a search on any EDTV, say by Samsung, they sure come with HDMI BUT are not HDTV by any specs, because they are not designed to view in HD resolution.
So, first you must have a TV that is HD ready ( not EDTV ), and a HD content source, in order to view anything in HD.
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Around 2 k +, you can check out this one:
http://www.tigerdirect.ca/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1516411&Tab=0&NoMapp=0
42 LCD flat, 720p HDTV, ok contrast. Go see it at their locations, it's not mainstream brand yet, but it may suit your needs.
