The guy is definitely a huge question mark (possibly the biggest on the team), at least at the plate. He's a major defensive upgrade from last year (Patterson and Davis). I was less than impressed with his hitting last season. He's still a relatively young and hopefully malleable work in progress so there is still a chance he can get closer to his potential.
Blue Jays 2012
- Thread starter Perry Mason
- Start date
No cherry picking done, I took all available data for all years that the Blue Jays have won the World Series and presented it in a very straightfoward manner.Two spring training records in years the Jays won it all is no evidence of anything. What happens when you really look at the data, and don't just cherry-pick to prove your point? It shows that spring training records are very weakly correlated to regular season winning percentage. ... And it's still better to win than lose.
Does it make some feel all warm and fuzzy that the Jays have a winning record?
For the casual fan, yes.
For people who know & understand baseball, it means nothing.
OK but I'd still rather be on a winning streak than a losing streak.Doesn't matter, as long as the players get their work in, and are prepared for the regular season.
If only for confidence.
Pat Gillick:So, for people who actually know what they're talking about, it doesn't mean nothing.
“Believe nothing you see in September (when your team is out of it) or in spring training.”
Artie, when you've got Pat's pedigree (or 1/100,000th of his baseball knowledge) I'll consider your opinion to be more than mere drivel, because that's all it is right now.
we already know he can do that...if his issue is hitting big league pitching then they should keep him here instead of some of those going nowhere guys they seem to keep around.. The caveat is, he's got to hit, and hit for power, in Vegas.
It's always better to keep a pitcher around than a fourth outfielder in the lumber business that could be getting at bats in AAAwe already know he can do that...if his issue is hitting big league pitching then they should keep him here instead of some of those going nowhere guys they seem to keep around.
I have a feeling Snider will be traded out of the organization in the next year.
Scouts have written the book on him. He has trouble with curve balls and sliders. He is always in front of change ups and he can't hit fast balls that are too fast, although overall, he's a good fastball hitter. He does strike out a lot. See if he can figure a few things out this year.
Cecil will likely be out of the organization by this time next year too. He is likely to get beaten out of a job in the next year by the wave that includes Drew Hutchison, Kyle Drabek, Deck McGuire and Chad Jenkins. It's very important that the Jays develop very strong pitching out of the 4 and 5 slots just because they play in the AL East.
Scouts have written the book on him. He has trouble with curve balls and sliders. He is always in front of change ups and he can't hit fast balls that are too fast, although overall, he's a good fastball hitter. He does strike out a lot. See if he can figure a few things out this year.
Cecil will likely be out of the organization by this time next year too. He is likely to get beaten out of a job in the next year by the wave that includes Drew Hutchison, Kyle Drabek, Deck McGuire and Chad Jenkins. It's very important that the Jays develop very strong pitching out of the 4 and 5 slots just because they play in the AL East.
I am going to stick out my neck and say that this Spring Training record does mean something, even though conventional wisdom says it does not. It's not only the number of wins, but it seems that lots of pieces are clicking well together.
And I am also going to predict that Rasmus (.186 and 10 total bases in 43 at bats this Spring) is not going to be around too long: if he does not show something truly positive in April, we are likely to see Gose in center field sooner rather than later... maybe LaRussa (for all his faults!) does/did know something, after all -- though I hope I am wrong because it would be great to see an All Star playing in center field for the Jays and give us an outfield reminiscent of Bell, Moseby and Barfield.
And since my neck is out there already, I will say that Cecil will surprise once the season gets going.
Perry
And I am also going to predict that Rasmus (.186 and 10 total bases in 43 at bats this Spring) is not going to be around too long: if he does not show something truly positive in April, we are likely to see Gose in center field sooner rather than later... maybe LaRussa (for all his faults!) does/did know something, after all -- though I hope I am wrong because it would be great to see an All Star playing in center field for the Jays and give us an outfield reminiscent of Bell, Moseby and Barfield.
And since my neck is out there already, I will say that Cecil will surprise once the season gets going.
Perry
Ga-damn I hope you are correct.I am going to stick out my neck and say that this Spring Training record does mean something, even though conventional wisdom says it does not. It's not only the number of wins, but it seems that lots of pieces are clicking well together.
And I am also going to predict that Rasmus (.186 and 10 total bases in 43 at bats this Spring) is not going to be around too long: if he does not show something truly positive in April, we are likely to see Gose in center field sooner rather than later... maybe LaRussa (for all his faults!) does/did know something, after all -- though I hope I am wrong because it would be great to see an All Star playing in center field for the Jays and give us an outfield reminiscent of Bell, Moseby and Barfield.
And since my neck is out there already, I will say that Cecil will surprise once the season gets going.
Perry
IMHO, the other side of the coin when a player with the tools and talents that Rasmus has flounders, it's time for him to check out a shrink...
As in "90% of this game is half-mental."
To me, when I look at his eyes and face -- especially last year -- he looks disoriented or lost.
Perry
As in "90% of this game is half-mental."
To me, when I look at his eyes and face -- especially last year -- he looks disoriented or lost.
Perry
Mathematician Professor Bruce Bukiet of the New Jersey institute of Technology who, in both 2010 and 2011, accurately predicted the top teams in baseball and beat all the experts, has the Blue Jays in 4th place this year (80-82)... :Cry:
Perry
Perry
Yeah but that's what Toronto sports fans do.People really need to give Rasmus a chance. Not many players in history have been as good as he was at his age and flopped. Give him the year, and see what he does with it. There's ABSOLUTELY NO NEED to rush Gose.
If a player can't produce at all star level all the time then get rid of them.
It's the Leaf mentality.
If all Toronto sports fans are so stupid why do you waste your time in this forum aside from the non-stop insults?Yeah but that's what Toronto sports fans do.
Yes, but Larry King has predicted the Blue Jays win the AL East in an upset and we all know that celebrities are better predictors of the future than math professors.Mathematician Professor Bruce Bukiet of the New Jersey institute of Technology who, in both 2010 and 2011, accurately predicted the top teams in baseball and beat all the experts, has the Blue Jays in 4th place this year (80-82)... :Cry:
Perry
https://twitter.com/#!/kingsthings/status/186456938672951296
Surely you're not including the resident experts of TERB.The more you read, the more you've seen, the more you realize - nobody knows anything.
Correct, but it is how we get into the spirit of the coming season ... well for me it is.Making predictions about the coming season is a fun game, but that's all it is. Fun. The more you read, the more you've seen, the more you realize - nobody knows anything.
Actually I would get fully into the MLB season, until a team wins the Stanley Cup.
Shi Davidi is reporting that Brett Cecil has been optioned to New Hampshire and Joel Carreno has been recalled.
Carreno will pitch game 3 in Cleveland, Alvarez Game 4 against Boston and Drabek game 5 against Boston.
I was hoping they'd recall Carreno to replace Cecil.
Cecil may never pitch in an MLB game again for Toronto. A lot of people think he just doesn't have the stuff to be a major league #5 starter.
http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/2012/04/03/blue_jays_brett_cecil_demoted_double_a/
Carreno will pitch game 3 in Cleveland, Alvarez Game 4 against Boston and Drabek game 5 against Boston.
I was hoping they'd recall Carreno to replace Cecil.
Cecil may never pitch in an MLB game again for Toronto. A lot of people think he just doesn't have the stuff to be a major league #5 starter.
http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/2012/04/03/blue_jays_brett_cecil_demoted_double_a/
Don't count me as one of them. He looked good in his first 3 spring outings but got hit hard in last 2. I think he has a good enough makeup to be a #4 or #5.Shi Davidi is reporting that Brett Cecil has been optioned to New Hampshire and Joel Carreno has been recalled.
Carreno will pitch game 3 in Cleveland, Alvarez Game 4 against Boston and Drabek game 5 against Boston.
I was hoping they'd recall Carreno to replace Cecil.
Cecil may never pitch in an MLB game again for Toronto. A lot of people think he just doesn't have the stuff to be a major league #5 starter.
http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/2012/04/03/blue_jays_brett_cecil_demoted_double_a/
Maybe that's when he was facing better hitters as most of the minor leaguers had been sent down earlier.but got hit hard in last 2.
