Trump/Zelensky deal turns into Jerry Springer episode

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

If you have any sense of history you would also understand why Odessa belongs with Russia. Maybe also Kiev. Ukraine is really Livov minus the Polish and Hungarian lands. That's the REAL Ukraine.(BTW I have have a few drinks at this point so I may disagree with myself tomorrow)

That is a load of made up bullshit history straight from Putin's personal journals lol.
From ChatGPT:
That statement is historically inaccurate and highly politically charged. Here’s why:

1. Odessa’s History – While Odessa was founded by the Russian Empire in 1794 and has a significant Russian-speaking population, it has been part of Ukraine since 1991. Historically, the region was inhabited by various peoples, including Tatars, Moldovans, and Ukrainians, before Russian colonization. Saying it "belongs with Russia" ignores Ukraine’s sovereignty and the historical complexities of national identity.
2. Kyiv (Kiev) and Ukrainian Identity – Kyiv is one of the most historically significant cities in Slavic history. It was the center of Kyivan Rus', the medieval state from which Ukraine, Belarus, and Russia trace their origins. The idea that Kyiv "belongs with Russia" dismisses Ukraine’s long history as a distinct nation.
3. Ukraine’s Borders and Identity – The claim that "Ukraine is really Lviv minus Polish and Hungarian lands" is misleading. Ukraine’s modern borders were shaped over centuries, including periods under the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, the Austro-Hungarian Empire, and the Russian Empire. However, Ukrainian identity and language developed independently, and Ukraine today consists of much more than just Lviv.

This statement reflects an imperial Russian perspective that disregards Ukrainian self-determination. While historical ties exist between Ukraine and Russia, Ukraine is an independent nation with its own history, language, and political identity.

 

[Valcazar]

A key part of the Trump-Zelensky many overlooked: Ukrainian bio labs have been sabotaged.

Oh wow.
Are there still people pushing the "biolabs" thing?

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

Well if it is not NATO it could be a different military arrangement.
Something that guarantees that Russia will face military consequences that they are guaranteed to lose.
And can you blame Ukraine after Putin occupied Crimea in 2014?
Putin invaded Ukraine for many reasons.
The chief one being that he does not see Ukraine as an independent sovereign nation, but as a part of Russia.
He sees Belarus the same way

He also sees it as NATO becoming too close to his borders.
Look at all the former USSR countries who are now part of NATO
(Lithuania, Poland, Latvia, Estonia and now almost Belarus and Ukraine)

 

[Bucktee]

There's this......

Great breakdown.

Putin did what anyone in his position would have done. He had no choice after years (decades) of NATO encroachment.

He's the least culpable in all the death and destruction we've witnessed in that region over the past 3 years.

The "evil Putin" portrayal is run-of-the-mill American propaganda.

Of course, the people that buy it are the same people on their 10th covid booster shot.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

Look at all the former USSR countries who are now part of NATO

Now, do you wonder why?
I used to play an online game and one of my team mates was from Estonia.
They absolutely HATED the Russians.
I presume this is the case with every former USSR state. It is very telling.

 

[oil&gas]

...............................
The free and civilized nations of the world should therefore stand with Ukraine and not with Russia.

Thanks to the support of a fraction of the free and civilized nations
of the world through free money and weapons donation it is doubtful if
Ukraine as it was before the war will still exist in a few years.

But civilized behaviour and Trump do not belong in the same sentence. So here we are.

Trump is a mega jerk and has many many flaws. But so be it if
it takes a jerk to end the war.

 

[SchlongConery]

View attachment 413208

And to realize we have so many of the 4% here!

Makes me feel dirtier than staying with an escortalligator bait and switch old chinese mamasan offering BB if I stay!

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

Now, do you wonder why?

If Canada, Mexico, and all the Caribbean islands joined a Russian military alliance, do you think the US would allow it and do nothing??

 

[Valcazar]

Well if it is not NATO it could be a different military arrangement.

There are lots of counterfactuals you can pursue for how a different security alignment could have happened post 1991.

And the same now.
Some kind of defensive alliance against Russia is still going to exist, no matter what the US does to NATO.

 

[mellowjello]

There's this......

All of this has been public record except for maybe the phone call.
People don't give a shit, they love the narrative that Putin is doing this for empire.
In the face of U.S./Ukraine turning down a deal for neutrality.

 

[SchlongConery]

There are mature human beings on Terb that believe this is a real photo? Oh my Lord please help us!

I feel the same about someone being so clueless and superior that they anyone would think that pic is anything but an AI generated fake for purposes of political satire… Thanks for your contribution Captain Obvious!

 

[TOraps23]

Its amazing that MAGA really didn't notice trump preferring Putin, Kim Jong Un, Bolsonaro and other despots in his first term.
Ukraine gets nothing while Israel just got another $3 billion for their genocide.

They were to busy worrying about the names on the Epstein list.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

If Canada, Mexico, and all the Caribbean islands joined a Russian military alliance, do you think the US would allow it and do nothing??

The US isn't invading or threatening to invade Canada, Mexico or the Caribbean islands. (Before Trump's 2nd term).

 

[mellowjello]

Trump is a mega jerk and has many many flaws. But so be it if
it takes a jerk to end the war.

It's not about ending the war, it's about extortion.

 

[K Douglas]

By admitting Ukraine into NATO or something similar that would have military consequences for Russia if they choose to invade in the future.

If they were to do that we'd no doubt be heading to a WW3. Could you imagine if China or Russia set up a military alliance with Mexico, you think the US would allow that?

 

[Valcazar]

If Canada, Mexico, and all the Caribbean islands joined a Russian military alliance, do you think the US would allow it and do nothing??

What would the US have to be doing that they all decided they needed to join an alliance that defends against the US?

You *do* realize that the largely friendly situation between US, Canada, and Mexico isn't some magical thing that happened because the gumdrop fairy showed up, right?
There was a lot of negotiation over the years, as well as conscious foreign policy on all sides, that resulted in it.
It doesn't have to stay that way.

 

[SchlongConery]

Amazing how everyone on Terb knows absolutely everything personal about everybody in the world. Truly amazing.

Trump isn’t “everybody” and the most tone deaf, emotionally unintelligent can listen to and compare his words and actions towards Putin, Kim et al vs Governor Trudeau, Dictator Zelenskyy et al.

 

[TauCeti]

I feel the same about someone being so clueless and superior that they anyone would think that pic is anything but an AI generated fake for purposes of political satire… Thanks for your contribution Captain Obvious!

Repeat: There are mature human beings on Terb that believe this is a real photo, not just someone as clueless and surperior as you Captain Obvious.

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

What would the US have to be doing that they all decided they needed to join an alliance that defends against the US?

You *do* realize that the largely friendly situation between US, Canada, and Mexico isn't some magical thing that happened because the gumdrop fairy showed up, right?
There was a lot of negotiation over the years, as well as conscious foreign policy on all sides, that resulted in it.
It doesn't have to stay that way

And now you know why Russia invaded Ukraine (and also set up a Belarus puppet regime)

 

[Valcazar]

If they were to do that we'd no doubt be heading to a WW3. Could you imagine if China or Russia set up a military alliance with Mexico, you think the US would allow that?

Well, if Russia set one up, Trump would welcome it, so that's clearly not a problem.
China maybe less so.

There is a slim chance Trump really thinks he is allowed to have the Western Hemisphere unimpeded if they carve things up.

But if the implication is that the US would invade Mexico, the US is already threatening unilateral military action in Mexico.

https://www.wsj.com/politics/policy/trump-mexico-drug-cartel-tariff-hegseth-military-action-5f507ab0?mod=hp_lead_pos1