Will Israelis or Palestinians Win the PR War?

[basketcase]

How is it doable? How is Phillipines and Palestine the same? Israel controls, land, air and sea. Nothing can go in. Israel does not allow building materials like cement to go in. So how will they build anything? Not possible. Israel's goal is to ultimately pressure those people so much that they leave and Israel gets to take over the land. That is their end goal. But the Palestinians won't leave. Which is why this conflict is never ending.

You do realize that PA controlled West Bank has a stable economy right? It is only Hamas controlled Gaza that has limits. Also worth mentioning is the way Hamas used over $1B US of construction materials on their underground network instead of trying to help their people.

And sorry but except for the extremists, Israelis don't want to control Palestinian people and polling says far more people oppose annexation of the West Bank than support it.

 

[basketcase]

Very much so. Watch the Ask Project videos and several of them will tell you that. Its pretty much Israeli state policy - or atleast Bibi's.

And I'm sure you think Rick Mercer's "talking to Americans" proves how stupid Americans are.

 

[Robert Mugabe]

 

[Leimonis]

seems like IDF is doing a fine job

 

[basketcase]

I don't know what that is. But Israeli attitude towards Palestinians is without mincing words, positively racist. No two ways about it.

Mercer's Talking to Americans was a comedy bit where they asked Americans questions and edited them so that only the stupidest answers were included. The editing was explicitly done to promote a narrative.

There are racist Israelis, there are racist Palestinians, there are racist Canadians, and there are racist Indians. The fact that someone puts together a compilation focusing only on the racists in no way proves that they are representative of the entire society. Even Franky admits there are Israeli groups devoted to Palestinian rights and mainstream media with that tact. You're trying to lump all Israelis in to one group which is one of the main characteristics of racist mentalities.

 

[basketcase]

If you call that economy "stable" with everything being controlled by Israel. I would neither consider it stable, nor viable. ...

You obviously have no clue what you are talking about. Before the global recession, the West Bank was growing their GDP, mainly because the PA was interested in supporting economic growth instead of violence. The conditions in Gaza on the other hand have a lot to do with Hamas' insistence that money is needed to attack Israel. When Israel left Gaza, there were very few restrictions and it wasn't until Hamas started their rocket campaigns that Israel started restricting goods. Again, how much could have been done to help Gazan's in Hamas spent that Billion on building civilian infrastructure instead of underground military complexes.

 

[Darts]

I want to remain a neutral objective observer, but do want to point out a couple of historical facts.

1) Many if not most of the freedom riders were Jewish.

2) Many if not most of the lawyers who fought Trump's Muslim ban were Jewish.

Remembering Jews who Fought for Black Civil Rights | Aish

In the 1960s, hundreds of Jews worked tirelessly to advance civil rights. Two of them were murdered.

aish.com

Why a Jewish Organization Is Suing to Stop the Muslim Ban

We cannot remain silent as Muslim refugees are turned away just for being Muslim, just as we could not stand idly by when the U.S. turned away Jewish refugees fleeing Europe during the 1930s and 40s. The Torah requires us to intervene. To stop these things from being done by our government and...

hias.org

 

[shack]

I guess you have to take it on faith. Or with a grain of salt. Or call bullshit on it.
Frankly, considering the shit show the IDF has made of the being caught with their pants down for 9 hours during a border breach

It was a sneak attack and IDF blew it.

But, considering the human shielding puts Israel in a difficult situation, IMO, they've been awesome in tactics, sticking to their plan, trying to warn the Palestinians, keeping the U.S. in the loop and even most importantly their messaging. They can't back up every claim but it doesn't necessarily mean that they're wrong or lying.
It seems like their plan has been well thought out and well executed.

More so than whatever the hell Hamas was thinking when they attacked.

 

[Robert Mugabe]

It was a sneak attack and IDF blew it.

But, considering the human shielding puts Israel in a difficult situation, IMO, they've been awesome in tactics, sticking to their plan, trying to warn the Palestinians, keeping the U.S. in the loop and even most importantly their messaging. They can't back up every claim but it doesn't necessarily mean that they're wrong or lying.
It seems like their plan has been well thought out and well executed.

More so than whatever the hell Hamas was thinking when they attacked.

"More so than whatever the hell Hamas was thinking when they attacked."

No argument from me on that one. You know what you are getting when you are having to live next door to Hamas. I question Israel's " awesome in tactics. Sticking to their plan trying to warn the Palestinians." Anyway. It was a "sneak attack" prepared for two years in the wide open daylight a mile or so from Israel's border. With a sizeable training compound where they held practices every day.
Where the fuck are civilians meant to go? Get in an uber and tell the driver " just drive". When Israel claims they warned to Palestinians to move away, what was the plan there? Let them figure it out. Empty the hospitals with hundreds of sick and injured. Unplug the incubators. Put the babies on a truck and ship them somewhere else.
Their explanations sound empty and sanctimonious. and frankly Ludicrous.

 

[Frankfooter]

I don't disagree there...palestinians are in the recipient of the shortest stick in this conflict...the easiest person to manipulate are those that are desperate and got nothing to lose....give them an inch of hope and they will do almost anything you want....That's how Hamas got the palestinians to play their game...Egypt, Jordan and Lebanon learn their lessons about Hamas. They would take over anyone (including Arab States) if they can...Like I said, If Hamas actually police their borders, They have every right to drive settlers away.

Here's the stat of the day.
Israel has killed more civilians in two weeks than Hamas has killed in 30 years.
Which ones are the terrorists?

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1719527248418451633

 

[Frankfooter]

that’s not true

Very much true.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1719753047117529220

 

[Frankfooter]

The Palestinians can't win it.

If Israel decides it can't win it, then there's a good chance it stops trying. And then things will REALLY get ugly for the Palestinians.

So they can't afford to win it. And they can't afford for Hamas to win it either.

It was never about winning.

Its the exact same thing as in 2021 except this time Hamas got outside the prison walls and Netanyahu is reacting more like 2008.

Netanyahu needs and aided Hamas, both to keep Palestinians divided and to keep him in power by being the war leader. Israel said they'd get rid of Hamas in 2008, 2011, 2014 and 2021 and each time they attacked until international pressure stoped them. There are rumours of plans to ethnically cleanse Gaza but that can't happen, Egypt would never let them in and Palestinians won't flee for a second Nabka.

This is performative. Hamas has to do something since the blockade continues, Netanyahu needs to have Palestinians labelled 'terrorists' to keep the conversation away from apartheid.

Israel will stop, the big question is what happens afterwards. Biden and Trudeau are hemoraging support they can't afford to lose. Publicly Israel made it impossible to keep supporting them, they had sympathy on Oct 7 but now the protests are to end genocide and apartheid they've become the pariah, not Hamas.

So sanctions will start to happen, bit by bit, until Israel changes.

 

[shack]

"More so than whatever the hell Hamas was thinking when they attacked."

No argument from me on that one. You know what you are getting when you are having to live next door to Hamas. I question Israel's " awesome in tactics. Sticking to their plan trying to warn the Palestinians." Anyway. It was a "sneak attack" prepared for two years in the wide open daylight a mile or so from Israel's border. With a sizeable training compound where they held practices every day.
Where the fuck are civilians meant to go? Get in an uber and tell the driver " just drive". When Israel claims they warned to Palestinians to move away, what was the plan there? Let them figure it out. Empty the hospitals with hundreds of sick and injured. Unplug the incubators. Put the babies on a truck and ship them somewhere else.
Their explanations sound empty and sanctimonious. and frankly Ludicrous.

What else can they do? Don't follow through and allow Hamas' human shield strategy to work?

It's somewhat of a contradiction in terms but right now Israel needs to be ruthless to achieve peace, for them and for the Gazans.

 

[Robert Mugabe]

What else can they do? Don't follow through and allow Hamas' human shield strategy to work?

It's somewhat of a contradiction in terms but right now Israel needs to be ruthless to achieve peace, for them and for the Gazans.

Well. Sorry to break it to you but bombing the civilian populace back into the stone age won't achieve peace or get the hostages released. There's no coming back from this.

 

[shack]

Well. Sorry to break it to you but bombing the civilian populace back into the stone age won't achieve peace or get the hostages released. There's no coming back from this.

Well, much to their chagrin, Hamas using people as their personal human shields isn't going to stop Israel from destroying Hamas. The best chance for peace is to remove Hamas from the equation.

 

[Frankfooter]

It's somewhat of a contradiction in terms but right now Israel needs to be ruthless to achieve peace, for them and for the Gazans.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1719665853891809761

 

[Frankfooter]

Well, much to their chagrin, Hamas using people as their personal human shields isn't going to stop Israel from destroying Hamas. The best chance for peace is to remove Hamas from the equation.

So you'll go final solution on all the civilians because you think Hamas is hiding behind them?
Then you'll use the wife beaters defence and blame Hamas?

Congrats, you made this meme seem reasonable. I had thought, no way, but here you are.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1717134917207781659

 

[Frankfooter]

Well, much to their chagrin, Hamas using people as their personal human shields isn't going to stop Israel from destroying Hamas. The best chance for peace is to remove Hamas from the equation.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1719527248418451633

 

[Robert Mugabe]

Well, much to their chagrin, Hamas using people as their personal human shields isn't going to stop Israel from destroying Hamas. The best chance for peace is to remove Hamas from the equation.

Well. That theory is bandied about. But removing Hamas from the equation is probably not going to be so easy now. Kind of like separating the yolk from the white of an egg after you have just mixed it up with an egg beater. Kind of a tangle at this point. The recommended way would be to kind of keep some separation between the populace and Hamas so you could see the wood from the trees to use another analogy.

 

[nottyboi]

that’s not true

Demonstrably true