Bibi Wins, Two State Solution Dies?

[basketcase]

god you are such a liar, I never said Israel should invade Gaza, I said they should have assisted Fatah with artillery, air power and transport when Hamas launched a coup. Only a retard would say that is an invasion. The Arab league could be given sovereignty, Israel does not WANT to change the Palis minds. How would that help them. Peace needs to be imposed with a carrot and stick.

You can't even keep your arguments straight. You say you favoured Israeli military intervention against Hamas but every time Israel acts against Hamas you act like it's the worst thing ever. Just like you say the Geneva Conventions are meaningless when justifying attacks on Israeli or American targets but constantly call Israel out when you think they violated them. Just like you repeatedly say Israeli civilians are to blame for being murdered but blame Israel when Palestinian civilians die. Just like your calling Nemtsov a traitor for possibly revealing Russian secrets yet called Snowden a hero for releasing American secrets. Just like you complain that US intervention in Iraq was wrong but Russian intervention in Ukraine is right. You have to be laying one of the biggest piles of bullshit whenever you talk morals.

As for the Arab League, are you seriously suggesting that a bunch of despots be in charge of transitioning Palestine into a democracy? Is there a single Arab League country that can serve as a model of democratic rights?


p.s. The Palestinians went to war with Jordan once already over the West Bank.

p.p.s. It's pretty interesting that you now agree with fuji on who should control Palestine.

 

[Aardvark154]

He said it, its out there, who is gonna bother negotiating with him now. Why not put Hamas in charge of peace talks, same result.

Given that Hamas is a major fact on the ground in the P.A. they already have been a major hang-up to any talks.

 

[Moviefan-2]

There's a great piece by Charles Krauthammer in the National Post that reminds everyone that the Palestinians don't want a two-state solution.

http://news.nationalpost.com/2015/0...anyahu-but-because-palestinians-dont-want-it/

For those who run into paywall issues, the article can also be found here: http://www.nationalreview.com/artic...ime-soon-not-because-bibi-charles-krauthammer

 

[fuji]

Coming from the guy who largely appears to believe that almost all criticism of Israeli policy is rooted in Antisemitism.

Quite a lot of it is. Not all. But a lot, particularly on forums.

In a related note I see that a Palestinian activist from the GTA has been convicted of conspiracy to commit terrorism today. In Canada. Against Canadians.

And I wonder why a couple of the usual suspects are missing in action..

At any rate you are obviously unwilling to apologize for misrepresenting my post, and unwilling to confront the substantive point that the Palestinians (in authority) flat or aren't interested in peace.

 

[fuji]

god you are such a liar, I never said Israel should invade Gaza, I said they should have assisted Fatah with artillery, air power and transport when Hamas launched a coup. Only a retard would say that is an invasion. The Arab league could be given sovereignty, Israel does not WANT to change the Palis minds. How would that help them. Peace needs to be imposed with a carrot and stick.

Only a retard would think artillery and air power would be effective in stopping a house by house coup by a more popular urban militia against a less popular minority government in a dense civilian city.

Short of just shelling Gaza into oblivion and calling it job done, what exactly do you think Israel was capable of? They already take out Hamas leaders and agents whenever they can and you have recently taken to posting about some reserve pilots who think even that goes too far.

You are a hilarious and pathetic clown.

 

[onthebottom]

Do you not think that the Palestinian leadership's refusal to negotiate a peace has an impact on why there is no peace?

Yes, I think they are incompetent, I also think stealing land and ethnic cleansing aggravate the situation.

 

[fuji]

Yes, I think they are incompetent, I also think stealing land and ethnic cleansing aggravate the situation.

Explain what you mean by incompetent? And are you talking about Hamas or the less relevant PA?

I certainly do agree that Arab efforts to steal land and ethnically cleanse Jews are the primary aggravating factors!

 

[basketcase]

Yes, I think they are incompetent, I also think stealing land and ethnic cleansing aggravate the situation.

Ethnic cleansing claim is bullshit. The Arab Israeli population is growing which you frequently point out.

And before the settlements were the Palestinians willing to make peace and live alongside Israel? Remember that the Arabs refused to discuss the Peel Commission plan that would have made a tiny Israel on 15% of the Mandate on land predominantly already owned by Jews. The Arabs and Palestinians refused to discuss peace when Jordan and Egypt annexed the Palestinian Partition.

I do agree that the settlements aren't useful (excluding maybe the parts that were Jewish owned land before Partition or any the Palestinians are willing to swap for) and provide the Palestinians with an easy excuse for Western audiences but they are not the root of the conflict.

 

[shack]

I'm more of a Brooke Baldwin fan

http://nomorecocktails.com/images/BrookeBaldwin1.jpg

I'm in love with Kate Bolduan.
http://assets.nydailynews.com/polop.../derivatives/article_970/bolduan31n-3-web.jpg

 

[AK-47]

I'm in love with Kate Bolduan.
http://assets.nydailynews.com/polop.../derivatives/article_970/bolduan31n-3-web.jpg

Poppy is hot too: http://articlebio.com/uploads/2014/P/Poppy-Harlow.jpg

I got first dibs on her btw, just in case you think you're getting cute

 

[AK-47]

Its time for a "knock on the roof": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doYmYby_7mk

You Arabs and muslims are soooooooooooooooooo lucky we have nukes and we dont use them on you sorry fucks!!!!!!

If we did decide to use them, we could turn your entire sandbox into a glassbox.

Think about that for a while

 

[nottyboi]

You can't even keep your arguments straight. You say you favoured Israeli military intervention against Hamas but every time Israel acts against Hamas you act like it's the worst thing ever. Just like you say the Geneva Conventions are meaningless when justifying attacks on Israeli or American targets but constantly call Israel out when you think they violated them. Just like you repeatedly say Israeli civilians are to blame for being murdered but blame Israel when Palestinian civilians die. Just like your calling Nemtsov a traitor for possibly revealing Russian secrets yet called Snowden a hero for releasing American secrets. Just like you complain that US intervention in Iraq was wrong but Russian intervention in Ukraine is right. You have to be laying one of the biggest piles of bullshit whenever you talk morals.

As for the Arab League, are you seriously suggesting that a bunch of despots be in charge of transitioning Palestine into a democracy? Is there a single Arab League country that can serve as a model of democratic rights?


p.s. The Palestinians went to war with Jordan once already over the West Bank.

p.p.s. It's pretty interesting that you now agree with fuji on who should control Palestine.

Actually YOU cannot keep my arguments straight. After all you are a confused simpleton Basketcase that seem to have no perception of the time continuum. Kinda like an insect. I said Israel could have (and should have) easily wiped out Hamas when they initiated a coup. They could have done this by assisting Fatah, but they did not. Now Hamas is entrenched. Much more difficult problem. But it is a problem people like Likud want so they can terrify moderate Israelis into voting for their douchebag party by fearmongering..and continue the successful war of genocide against the Palis.

I don't think the killing of Nemetsov was right, but the fact is, my point is they are all the same and I am bitching about hypocrisy. Russia had far more legitimate national interests as Ukraine is right on its border. Plus they held a referendum in Crimea. and there was maybe 1 person killed. How would you contrast that with the rivers of blood and wanton destruction in Iraq that was no where near the US and had no historical ties to the US like sectors of Ukraine had with Russia.

I call Israel out because they are liars, and pretending to fight a just war while oppressing millions and murdering children. Which I am against. It is also a war of conquest, not of defense, so I oppose it. I also resent the lie that they seek peace, a lie that has become VERY CLEAR in the last week.

I think you answered your own question in that last one. If all the rich Arab countries are so fucked up, what makes you think democracy can ever work in Palestine? Even in Israel, they just re-elected the Israeli version of Hamas.

 

[fuji]

I call Israel out because they are liars, and pretending to fight a just war while oppressing millions and murdering children. Which I am against. It is also a war of conquest, not of defense, so I oppose it. I also resent the lie that they seek peace, a lie that has become VERY CLEAR in the last week.

The problem with making up post hoc justifications for your racist bile is that you aren't consistent and the hypocrisy reveals that you are just a shallow race hater.

When you discussed 1947 you repeatedly justified the Arab war of conquest with its explicit goals of killing women and children and every other Jew. You have no problem with wars of conquest or the murder of children, so long as the victims are Jews you are on record justifying it. Not once but many times, we can quote you extensively.

So even if your claims about Israel were true, which they are not, that is CLEARLY not your reason for opposing Israel because when the shoe was on the other foot you thought wars of conquest were fantastic.

In fact it is the Palestinian propaganda that is full of lies. The whole conflict could be over tomorrow, could have ended at any time, by the Palestinians simply agreeing to renounce attacks on civilians and accept Israel's existence as a Jewish majority state.

They have had sixty five years to accept that and they have consistently and openly and explicitly chosen violence.

 

[Moviefan-2]

Even in Israel, they just re-elected the Israeli version of Hamas.

After a while, such idiocy loses its shock value.

 

[AdamH]

At any rate you are obviously unwilling to apologize for misrepresenting my post, and unwilling to confront the substantive point that the Palestinians (in authority) flat or aren't interested in peace.

I didn't misrepresent your post. I read it as you wrote it.

So long as the Palestinian goal is to ethnically cleanse all the Jews, Likud is right not to make peace.

To me it sounds like you're backpedaling now.

 

[fuji]

I didn't misrepresent your post. I read it as you wrote it.



To me it sounds like you're backpedaling now.

For great clarity: So long as the Palestinian goal is to ethnically cleanse all the Jews, Likud is right not to make peace.

Now respond properly this time -- if you rat hole into another misreading claiming that statement refers to every Palestinian individually rather than their leaders then you deserve the disparaging remarks about your English comprehension that will follow.

 

[basketcase]

...

I think you answered your own question in that last one. If all the rich Arab countries are so fucked up, what makes you think democracy can ever work in Palestine? Even in Israel, they just re-elected the Israeli version of Hamas.

Out of all the idiocy in the post, this is the one most worth being called out. You quite obviously have a racist view that Arabs are incapable of democracy.

And once again, Israel is proof of the pudding since the Arabs there seem to be quite fine with democracy. Hell, the Supreme Court judge in charge of the election is an Arab.

 

[scouser1]

I don't think democracy is good for all situations. They can be democratic in the future but the situation needs to be stabilized first like how Japan and Korea when tough transitory stages with pseudo democracies under firm guidance. Perhaps with their constitution being written with some external assistance.

Dude every time I think I might agree with you, you come up with crap like this!!! As if your previous "come on guys Bashar really isn't that bad" postings are not bad enough now you are telling us the Arabs are too backward to have democracy. Now you could be a plain racist or twit or both. Why do you think hundreds of thousands of Syrians, Egyptians, Tunisians and Yemenis decided enough is enough! Because the price of shawarma was too high? No because they got tired of decades of dictators, their families and their hangers on treating them like animals. They want dignity and a say in their lives they never had in most cases. "External assistance" eh? Yeah it's been awesome in that part of the world propping up some of the worst pro West and pro Soviet dictatorships, the Arabs are not stupid, simpleton idiots who need the likes of you to assist them, case and point Tunisia has had a democratically elected government, yes it has a lengthy list of challenges but it's a step in the right direction.

 

[nottyboi]

The problem with making up post hoc justifications for your racist bile is that you aren't consistent and the hypocrisy reveals that you are just a shallow race hater.

When you discussed 1947 you repeatedly justified the Arab war of conquest with its explicit goals of killing women and children and every other Jew. You have no problem with wars of conquest or the murder of children, so long as the victims are Jews you are on record justifying it. Not once but many times, we can quote you extensively.

So even if your claims about Israel were true, which they are not, that is CLEARLY not your reason for opposing Israel because when the shoe was on the other foot you thought wars of conquest were fantastic.

In fact it is the Palestinian propaganda that is full of lies. The whole conflict could be over tomorrow, could have ended at any time, by the Palestinians simply agreeing to renounce attacks on civilians and accept Israel's existence as a Jewish majority state.

They have had sixty five years to accept that and they have consistently and openly and explicitly chosen violence.

You are making up lies as usual, I have never justified the killing of women and children. You say the Arabs have chosen violence, when have the Israelis NOT chosen violence? The are both the same, as I have always said. Why do they have to accept Israel as a "Jewish Majority State" when demographics are changing? Why can't they just accept the existence of Israel? What other nation demands recognition of demographic status?
What you say is utter nonsense. If even if the Arabs agreed to all those things, the conflict would still continue as it is not the Arabs that need to agree to things, it is Israel that refuses to agree to many conditions.

 

[nottyboi]

Dude every time I think I might agree with you, you come up with crap like this!!! As if your previous "come on guys Bashar really isn't that bad" postings are not bad enough now you are telling us the Arabs are too backward to have democracy. Now you could be a plain racist or twit or both. Why do you think hundreds of thousands of Syrians, Egyptians, Tunisians and Yemenis decided enough is enough! Because the price of shawarma was too high? No because they got tired of decades of dictators, their families and their hangers on treating them like animals. They want dignity and a say in their lives they never had in most cases. "External assistance" eh? Yeah it's been awesome in that part of the world propping up some of the worst pro West and pro Soviet dictatorships, the Arabs are not stupid, simpleton idiots who need the likes of you to assist them, case and point Tunisia has had a democratically elected government, yes it has a lengthy list of challenges but it's a step in the right direction.

Ahhh yes, so the Egyptians decide enough is enough, overthrow their dictator, and WHO THE FUCK DID THEY VOTE FOR? Man you have proven my case. Saddam was overthrown by the US, the Iraqis given the vote.. and NOW where is this GREAT IRAQI DEMOCRACY? Syria, PLEASE!! Tunisia, yeah that is a real MAJOR arab country. With the democracy there only a few years old I would suggest you shaddap until a bit more time passes before claiming they are a democracy.