Toronto Maple Leafs 2013/14 Season

[Ironhead]

As a Sens fan I'm glad we got the win but have to say that your Toronto Maple Leafs didn't even show up tonight.

If they are trying to get RC fired then I would venture they did a great job. It was like they absolutely didn't give a crap.

What was it when then Blackhawks coach Orval Tessier said of his team after a loss once, ''The whole team needs a heart transplant''.

I attended the game in person. I think there were as many Leaf jerseys in the crowd as there were Senator jerseys. Some good natured ribbing between fans but nothing over the top.
The Canadian Tire center is very nice. Location sucks, but I guess one cannot have everything.
The Senators gouge their fans just as much as the Leafs do here.

As for the game ... two teams playing out the string.
Ottawa finally scored actually seemed to spark the Leafs ... for a while any way.
Leafs non-goal I do not even know why it took a look to determine I saw it clear as day, high stick.

Changes are definitely needed over the summer.
I would not get rid of Carlyle yet.

If I had my way(as a start) I would say good bye to ...
Kulemin
Franson
Gunnarsson
Reimer

 

[Bargnani_]

Just listened to press confernce ... To sum it all up ... Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah ..

 

[Boober69]

Just listened to press confernce ... To sum it all up ... Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah ..

Yes this appears to be deja vu all over again:

"Minority owner Larry Tanenbaum hired Dryden to become the president of the Toronto Maple Leafs hockey club in 1997. Pat Quinn became head coach in 1998, and the two men reportedly had a frosty relationship. A few months after joining the Leafs, Quinn took on the General Manager position, reportedly to preempt Dryden from hiring his preferred GM which was former Habs teammate Bob Gainey.[6]

On August 29, 2003, with the hiring of John Ferguson, Jr. as GM, there was a major management shakeup. Majority owner Steve Stavro was bought out by the Ontario Teachers' Pension Plan and he stepped down as chairman in favour of Larry Tanenbaum. Quinn continued as head coach but was relieved of GM duties. Dryden's position was abolished, in favour of having both the Leafs and Raptors managers reporting directly to MLSE President and CEO Richard Peddie. Dryden was shuffled to the less important role of vice-chairman and given a spot on MLSE's board of directors, which was described by commentators as "sitting outside the loop" as he did not report directly to Leafs ownership.[6][7] He stayed on until 2004 when he resigned to enter politics."

...inevitably nothing new here folks...just change the names...yada...yada.

 

[shack]

has no connection to the Leafs in terms of heritage.

Valid question. I'd like a legitimate response.

Why does it make a difference if he has no history with team?

Are former Leafs smarter than non-former?
Will a former Leaf try harder to be successful at his job than a non-former?
As for heritage, any Leaf from the 70's on will have a losing Leaf heritage. I suspect you'd have criticized them on that point if they had hired a former Leaf. You can get them from lots of angles. Damned if they do. Damned if they don't.

Regardless, you said you like honest debate, so here is your chance. Why is hiring somebody with no Leaf heritage a bad thing?

 

[demien2k5]

Truth is, it's a bit of a reach to imply there has been some grand conspiracy going on within MLSE for 47 years to milk the cash-cow fan base while deliberately avoiding fixing the 'problem' of righting the Leafs ship in terms of talent and wins. It's simply bad management. Too many poor managers hired with too little real hockey talent making too many bad hockey decisions. Honestly, who was the last real, credible hockey guy put in a position to make good hockey decisions? Cliff Fletcher is as close to that as you can come...besides him? Pretty thin...

Maybe a guy like Shanahan has enough hockey experience to identify what the Leafs really need to do to turn it all around, and with that kind of direction, maybe Nonis has enough management talent to actually pull the trigger and make Shanahan's vision of success a reality.

 

[shack]

Truth is, it's a bit of a reach to imply there has been some grand conspiracy going on within MLSE for 47 years to milk the cash-cow fan base while deliberately avoiding fixing the 'problem' of righting the Leafs ship in terms of talent and wins. It's simply bad management. Too many poor managers hired with too little real hockey talent making too many bad hockey decisions. Honestly, who was the last real, credible hockey guy put in a position to make good hockey decisions? Cliff Fletcher is as close to that as you can come...besides him? Pretty thin...

I think you summed it up pretty well.

The last really good GM was Jim Gregory who built up the Sittler, Lanny, Tiger, Borje, Turnbull teams. They were reaching their prime when Ballard decided to clean house. After that it was an out of date Imlach, and then Floyd Smith:Eek:, Gerry MacNamara. The 80's were the low point with those guys running the ship.

 

[Ironhead]

Valid question. I'd like a legitimate response.

Why does it make a difference if he has no history with team?

Regardless, you said you like honest debate, so here is your chance. Why is hiring somebody with no Leaf heritage a bad thing?

Shack, do not hold your breath.

 

[Boober69]

Valid question. I'd like a legitimate response.

Why does it make a difference if he has no history with team?

Are former Leafs smarter than non-former?
Will a former Leaf try harder to be successful at his job than a non-former?
As for heritage, any Leaf from the 70's on will have a losing Leaf heritage. I suspect you'd have criticized them on that point if they had hired a former Leaf. You can get them from lots of angles. Damned if they do. Damned if they don't.

Regardless, you said you like honest debate, so here is your chance. Why is hiring somebody with no Leaf heritage a bad thing?

I think you missed my point much like the Leafs have been missing the post-season...
My point wasn't to suggest that they should have a former Leaf...I was grasping at some potential reason as to why bring in Shanahan, i.e. at the very least, if there was a former Leaf player being hired, it would lend to "heritage" as perhaps being some part of the reason.
Would it make a difference...probably not. Like I said, more qualified people have tried and failed. Shanahan has no experience in this role, so the odds are stacked against him regardless.
As I've said before...don't worry about the small details looking for silver bullets with this organization...it's the big picture that's important. Like that old saying about the forest & the trees goes...

Oh and BTW, here's another MLSE success in raping their fans...http://globalnews.ca/news/1270561/raptors-first-round-playoff-tickets-most-expensive-in-nba/

...see any trends here?

 

[Ironhead]

I think you missed my point much like the Leafs have been missing the post-season...
My point wasn't to suggest that they should have a former Leaf...I was grasping at some potential reason as to why bring in Shanahan, i.e. at the very least, if there was a former Leaf player being hired, it would lend to "heritage" as perhaps being some part of the reason.
Would it make a difference...probably not. Like I said, more qualified people have tried and failed. Shanahan has no experience in this role, so the odds are stacked against him regardless.
As I've said before...don't worry about the small details looking for silver bullets with this organization...it's the big picture that's important. Like that old saying about the forest & the trees goes...

Oh and BTW, here's another MLSE success in raping their fans...http://globalnews.ca/news/1270561/raptors-first-round-playoff-tickets-most-expensive-in-nba/

...see any trends here?

I bet you do not run a business.
The Raps have the most expensive tickets ... yeah and ?
Why charge only $50 when you can get $75 for an item ?
It is the capitalist system in which we live. Charge what the market will bear.
ONLY reason you refer to it as 'raping' is because that fits your argument.

No one missed your points.

 

[shack]

I think you missed my point much like the Leafs have been missing the post-season...
My point wasn't to suggest that they should have a former Leaf...I was grasping at some potential reason as to why bring in Shanahan, i.e. at the very least, if there was a former Leaf player being hired, it would lend to "heritage" as perhaps being some part of the reason.

And aside from being from the area, has no connection to the Leafs in terms of heritage.

I did not miss your points. I was asking you about this one. You definitely make it sound like a significant mistake.

Which Leaf from a winning heritage would you suggest because you would not approve of one from a losing era. Guaranteed if they picked a Leaf from after the 60's you'd criticize them for picking a player with a losing heritage.

Again, I ask you to give good reasons why the fact that Shanahan has no history with the team a bad thing.

 

[shack]

I bet you do not run a business.
The Raps have the most expensive tickets ... yeah and ?
Why charge only $50 when you can get $75 for an item ?
It is the capitalist system in which we live. Charge what the market will bear.
ONLY reason you refer to it as 'raping' is because that fits your argument.

No one missed your points.

If he refuses to engage in legitimate debate, then he is a clear cut troll.

 

[Bargnani_]

Nobody asked Shanny " why did you never want to be a Leaf when you were a

player but as a President you came calling ? What is going to tell Free Agents when they ask " if it is so great to put on a Leaf Jersey then why did you never choose to come yourself when you had opportunity ?

What next will Steve Nash become President of the Raptors

 

[Polaris]

Nobody asked Shanny " why did you never want to be a Leaf when you were a

player but as a President you came calling ? What is going to tell Free Agents when they ask " if it is so great to put on a Leaf Jersey then why did you never choose to come yourself when you had opportunity ?

What next will Steve Nash become President of the Raptors

That's a good question. I looked up his career, and the simple answer is why come to Toronto, or go anywhere, when you're winning cups with Detroit. Three cups in ten years there for him. After that, he was basically an old player.

The front office of the Toronto Maple Leafs seem unusual. The new guy has three Stanley Cups wins as a player, the coach a former Norris Trophy winner with a Stanley Cup as a coach. The current Leafs roster cannot even make the playoffs.

The news conference to introduce the new guy, Nonis was there too, indicating he will stay. Then Shanahan later talked about the coach, and said he respects him very much. We know what that means, that means no changes in coach or management.

Finally, they will do something drastic with the roster. I rather like that way more. Get rid of the players, instead of always firing the coach.

Seems to me that they are hoping Shanahan will be like Brian Burke minus the personality.

 

[Polaris]

This is who I would keep on the roster.

Kessel, JVR, Kadri, Lupal, Clarkson, Bolland.

Phanuef, Gleason, Gardiner, Riely.

Bernier.

As for everyone else, who knows. The Leafs need a third a fourth line. A backup goalie too.

:hippie:

 

[Polaris]

You guys think Bolland staying with the Leafs is more likely now with Shanahan in charge?

I think so. Before he got hurt, Bolland was the Leafs best center. On ice leadership in the center position. Bolland was good in all three areas of the ice. He plays a style of game that Don Cherry would like. So would Shanahan.

 

[bullitt]

why wasn,t 'rc', at the conference?

 

[Boober69]

I bet you do not run a business.
The Raps have the most expensive tickets ... yeah and ?
Why charge only $50 when you can get $75 for an item ?
It is the capitalist system in which we live. Charge what the market will bear.
ONLY reason you refer to it as 'raping' is because that fits your argument.

No one missed your points.

So are you a business man or are you a fan? Pick one.

In any other business, you can not expect to charge more and make more if the product is not as good as someone else's product. Raptors have been mediocre and have had a good year this year and suddenly that justifies raising ticket prices? For some reason, MLSE knows they have a cult of fans who will pay whatever they want them to pay.

So are you a business man/consumer? If yes, you should see there is not enough value to justify the high prices as in my argument above.

Or are you a fan? If yes, then why support an organization that is taking advantage of you?

 

[Boober69]

If he refuses to engage in legitimate debate, then he is a clear cut troll.

This is the 2nd time you guys have said something about hearing back from me or engaging in a debate, "if he refuses..."???. What's up with that exactly? Have I refused to be engaged here or are you desperately looking to distract from the real points I'm making? The best defense is a good offence perhaps?
Don't worry ladies, I won't leave you just yet.
I have 46+ years of arguments to offer.

 

[shack]

I have 46+ years of arguments to offer.

OK. Let's hear why hiring a non-former Leaf is a bad thing, as you've implied.

Former Leafs would come from a losing heritage. Also, as to Barg's point, only a lifetime Leaf would not have to answer why didn't you come here or why did you leave?

 

[Bargnani_]

So are you a business man or are you a fan? Pick one.

In any other business, you can not expect to charge more and make more if the product is not as good as someone else's product. Raptors have been mediocre and have had a good year this year and suddenly that justifies raising ticket prices? For some reason, MLSE knows they have a cult of fans who will pay whatever they want them to pay.

So are you a business man/consumer? If yes, you should see there is not enough value to justify the high prices as in my argument above.

Or are you a fan? If yes, then why support an organization that is taking advantage of you?

My question on Business ? Why do NHL teams make people Like Shanny ( Only finished High School I think ( St Mikes ) ) a President .. Would Rogers / Bell ( owners of MLSE ) hire High School grads to head their other companies ? He will be in charge of a department that spends over 70 million dollars ... Dave Nonis ( who I am not saying is a great GM ) who has a Degree and years of knowledge in the Hockey Industry business side is now going to take his leadership from a man who will be learning on the Job ... Nonis will play good company mand for awhile and the moment Shanny says no to one of his ideas is the moment that relationship will deteriorate

I wonder what Dougie is thinking right now .... He actually has put in the time at the AHL level and OHL level as assistant coach , Coach and GM ... I am not saying I want Dougie as President but he sure has more of a reseme then Shanny ..