Cito worked cause of old savvy GM in Gillick . First time young GM and first time coach may not be great formula.
Blue Jays 2012
- Thread starter Perry Mason
- Start date
They worked because of their skills.Cito worked cause of old savvy GM in Gillick . First time young GM and first time coach may not be great formula.
Gilliick was a first time GM. Brian Chapman, Theo Epstein and Dave Dombrowski were young 1st time GM's (not positive about DD and 1st time).
You're a "cup's half empty" kind of person, aren't you? I prefer to think of how Bautista in 2011, although his HR total dropped off a bit, raised his average to .302, or something like that.Wonder if EE will have another big year in 2013. Remember how Wells and Rios fell off?
Brian Chapman picked a vetern Torre to skip his team .. Theo Epstein picked ( coached before skipper Terry Francona ) Dombrowski has choosen Jim Leyland as his skipper when he was with the Marlins and now Tigers and when he was with the Expos he had Buck Rodgers ... My point is the fourmula of having a 1st time GM and 1st time skipperThey worked because of their skills.
Gilliick was a first time GM. Brian Chapman, Theo Epstein and Dave Dombrowski were young 1st time GM's (not positive about DD and 1st time).
with one of the youngest roster in the Majors maybe not a great formula . The Cito and Gillick comparison argument is good but Gillick was aleady on the job for a decade
and Cito inherited a veteran roster .
AA is headed into his 4th year.My point is the fourmula of having a 1st time GM and 1st time skipper
with one of the youngest roster in the Majors maybe not a great formula .
Don't think the 1st time tag can be used indefinitely. Pat Gillick was a 1st time GM when he hired Cito (by your definition).
I guess we can go back and fourth on this but comparing a AA who is 35 years old ( and was 33 years old when he actually hired his manager ) to Pat Gillick Jays days ( who was already with the Jays for 13 years and was in his 50's when he hired Cito ) is your preference but maybe I should have said going with having a young GM ( with little on his reseme ) with 1st time skipper is not a good formula . The other examples we both gave were young GM's but all choose a proven old savy skipper . Although I agree with you that there is not perfect formula and all examples given did suceed but they all had huge payrolls .AA is headed into his 4th year.
Don't think the 1st time tag can be used indefinitely. Pat Gillick was a 1st time GM when he hired Cito (by your definition).
Fair enough. There is no formula.I guess we can go back and fourth on this but comparing a AA who is 35 years old ( and was 33 years old when he actually hired his manager ) to Pat Gillick Jays days ( who was already with the Jays for 13 years and was in his 50's when he hired Cito ) is your preference but maybe I should have said going with having a young GM ( with little on his reseme ) with 1st time skipper is not a good formula . The other examples we both gave were young GM's but all choose a proven old savy skipper . Although I agree with you that there is not perfect formula and all examples given did suceed but they all had huge payrolls .
All combinations have had some success, which brings me back to an earlier point, i.e. it depends on the skill sets of the individuals.
Gord Ash had experience behind Gillick for years and did poorly regardless of his choices for manager, and I believe he had a mix.
Brains (and a free reign from ownership) are required for GM. Some guys learn sooner than others. Some are willing to try new ideas as the game evolves. Some are traditionalists. Some get stale after a period of time and can't vary their thinking and approach.
I think you look for the smartest person (in a baseball sense) first then factor in (in no particular order) resume, working with others, experience, negotiation/people skills etc.
Baltimore is awesomeBaltimore, it seems, will be the Jays kryptonite this season.
We need more KC sunshine. :thumb:
Mike Aviles is the player the Blue Jays will get, no word yet on who else is headed to Boston.
Aviles emerged somewhat unexpectedly as the everyday shortstop for the Red Sox for most of 2012. The 31-year-old hit .250 with a .282 OBP, .381 slugging mark, .663 OPS, 13 homers and 14 steals while playing 136 games. Most advanced defensive metrics also suggested that he was one of the top defensive shortstops in the majors last year.
http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/bo...2/10/20/red-sox-hire-john-farrell-as-manager/
Twitter is suggesting Adam Lind is possibly the player going to Boston.
Aviles emerged somewhat unexpectedly as the everyday shortstop for the Red Sox for most of 2012. The 31-year-old hit .250 with a .282 OBP, .381 slugging mark, .663 OPS, 13 homers and 14 steals while playing 136 games. Most advanced defensive metrics also suggested that he was one of the top defensive shortstops in the majors last year.
http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/bo...2/10/20/red-sox-hire-john-farrell-as-manager/
Twitter is suggesting Adam Lind is possibly the player going to Boston.
Sounds like a crappy deal to me with a player going back to them. Another shortstop? Does Hech play 2nd next year?Mike Aviles is the player the Blue Jays will get, no word yet on who else is headed to Boston.
Aviles emerged somewhat unexpectedly as the everyday shortstop for the Red Sox for most of 2012. The 31-year-old hit .250 with a .282 OBP, .381 slugging mark, .663 OPS, 13 homers and 14 steals while playing 136 games. Most advanced defensive metrics also suggested that he was one of the top defensive shortstops in the majors last year.
http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/bo...2/10/20/red-sox-hire-john-farrell-as-manager/
Twitter is suggesting Adam Lind is possibly the player going to Boston.
Lind heading Boston's way is a win for the Blue Jays, they get out from under ~$7,150,000 in salary.Sounds like a crappy deal to me with a player going back to them. Another shortstop? Does Hech play 2nd next year?
Aviles would be considered the frontrunner for 2nd baseman at the moment with Toronto.
typical toronto blue jays bad deal........we are really good at getting rid of players.So Boston gets our manager and for compensation they also get a better player.
Yes and what the Jays do with Lind salary off the books is part of the deal .Lind heading Boston's way is a win for the Blue Jays, they get out from under ~$7,150,000 in salary.
Aviles would be considered the frontrunner for 2nd baseman at the moment with Toronto.
This is the key. A.A. needs to spend those dollars, and wisely!Yes and what the Jays do with Lind salary off the books is part of the deal .
