Titanic Submersible
- Thread starter Darts
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....and yet, OceanGate produced an unsafe vehicle that ultimately resulted in a catastrophic failure because they didn't understand the design defects. If this domain really is so simple and easy to master, what happened to Titan? The guys working on the initiative weren't experts but they weren't chimps either...
Well..... mistakes happen. No industry is more regulated than the atomic industry, and accidents and incidents still happen. The air transport industry is extremely heavily regulated and planes still crash.
It is always easy to criticize others without knowing all the facts and red tape involved with this search.
Here the proof. Straight from the CEO oceangate mouth.
PS. Yup Diversity Equatiy Inclusion ( DEI )killed a billionaire!!
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I don’t like to draw remotely possible similar comparisons. Space Shuttle O-rings disagreement between engineers and the PR department overruling the cautions raised by the engineers. Maybe, it depends on what might be determined to have caused the implosion. We will probably never know.
But a DEI he hired certainly didn’t help this tragic situation . But a 50+ year white guy ex military navy operator would not had hinder the situation , maybe they would have survived. I bet the billionaire family will sue and this company oceangate . It will go bankrupt!
An Inexperienced ( “ DEI”) submarine pilot errors may had cause the sub to hits something causes a small crack in the sub or in the sub window and at that depth the submersible will imploded .Maybe the submersible got caught on a bad underwater current then got slam into something ( like the descenting cable or underwater old fishing debries like old net and old anchor from fishing trawlers that was lost in the sea floating around) .
An experience 50+ year old ex military/ navy sub operator may or may not had prevented this tragic. Unfortunately no one know! Would you rather DEI pilot a Boeing 747 in a bad weather or a 50+ year old white guy that have many year of experience Of real flight experience. I take skill and experience then DEI hire.
CEO didn't want to hire the best qualified pilots for going under the water 13000 ft! Instead, they go for 'inspirational' hires? OMG. this is too much. You reap what you sow! Expected a lawsuit! Freaking nuts using a game controller to drive a sub! An experience 50 year old + white guy or 50 year old black navy sub operator who had refused to get into the submarine.
FYI
The Lost Titanic Sub Didn’t Even Have a Basic Safety Beacon
Untethered by regulations, the vehicle wasn’t even equipped with some of the most essential tools. Its inexplicable design may end in tragedy.
www.thedailybeast.com
PS An experienced 50+ year ex military/ navy sub operator ( white guy or black guy ) would had refuse to get on the sub and report that to transport Canada!
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Because Mr Rush used an inappropriate material for constructing the pressure hull.
As I posted above, composite carbon fiber has tensile strength ( I.e. being good for airplane bodies) but has poor compression strength characteristics. Any mechanical engineer knows that.
Dude, the CEO was piloting the sub. A 61 year old white guy.But a DEI he hired certainly didn’t help this tragic situation . But a 50+ year white guy ex military navy operator would not had hinder the situation , maybe they would have survived. I bet the billionaire family will sue and this company oceangate . It will go bankrupt!
An Inexperienced ( “ DEI”) submarine pilot errors may had cause the sub to hits something causes a small crack in the sub or in the sub window and at that depth the submersible will imploded .Maybe the submersible got caught on a bad underwater current then got slam into something ( like the descenting cable or underwater old fishing debries like old net and old anchor from fishing trawlers that was lost in the sea floating around) .
An experience 50+ year old ex military/ navy sub operator may or may not had prevented this tragic. Unfortunately no one know! Would you rather DEI pilot a Boeing 747 in a bad weather or a 50+ year old white guy that have many year of experience Of real flight experience. I take skill and experience then DEI hire.
CEO didn't want to hire the best qualified pilots for going under the water 13000 ft! Instead, they go for 'inspirational' hires? OMG. this is too much. You reap what you sow! Expected a lawsuit! Freaking nuts using a game controller to drive a sub! An experience 50 year old + white guy or 50 year old black navy sub operator who had refused to get into the submarine.
FYIThe Lost Titanic Sub Didn’t Even Have a Basic Safety Beacon
Untethered by regulations, the vehicle wasn’t even equipped with some of the most essential tools. Its inexplicable design may end in tragedy.
I agree in principle that vessels that carry civilians should be government regulated. The issue of course is that the sub exists in a grey area where it's unclear who has jurisdiction over it because it operates in international waters. I am also not sure if regulating Ocean Gate would have changed anything. A well connected and wealthly person has the ability to go with another company that isn't government certified.
I think James Cameron claimed that the industry has never had disaster like this in it's history. That's an excellent track record especially if there hasn't been any regulation thus far. So I don't see how more regulation is going to improve that statistic.
On the other hand, I am not sure how the government can regulate experimental vessels. By definition an experimental vessel isn't regulated. The only way to test material limits and vessel design is to put people at risk. We can certainly reduce the risk by doing lots of virtual and un-manned tests, but someone will have to risk their life at some point. I don't think we should get government involved in that until it goes mainstream.
He also mention other employees not only submarine navy pilot , he mentioned like tech Or technician or platform operator too that could be DEI hire. Listen the video what the CEO of oceangate said. Lots of possibilities of errors that you cannot discounted like technical errors or tech errors or platform operator error Like maybe Cause the submarine to hit the ship when lower into water under a rough current or choppy seas. I will always go for experience over DEI hired when it come to safety or my life!
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Hiring inexperienced people base on DEI as a qualification is a receipe for disaster! Hiring experience people based intelligence is not a receipe for tragedy! 5 people died! Yes age and race of the employed don’t Matter if you have the skills and intelligence to pilot and ensuring the safety of the sub , but if you hired someone that is not qualified and then base on DEI qualification….. it will results in a disaster.
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ya you should actually listen to the video, he wanted to hire new, young people with fresh ideas, not a bunch of ex submariners. Beyond the one mention of "50 year old white guy" (describing the typical retired submariner) there is no reference whatsoever to anything to do with DEI. Call the guy an ageist if you want to get your panties in a twist and rage about something, but to blame this tragedy on "DEI hires" is a big huge nothingburger.
Not necessarily.
Professional engineers have a responsibility to ensure proper protocols are followed. If they are fired for refusing to follow Rush's design ideas, yes.
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CEO a mention the term “ white guy”. If he had not mentioned “ white guy” then you can call ageist! If he had only mentioned 50+year person then it would not be DEI hired. ! There are black 50+ year ex military navy submarines personal or technical or platform operators... but also mention race specifically “ 50+ year old white guy! “
PS. You can call it Ageism And anti white racism. Perfect combination. People died ( a billionaire& millionaire ) because of this CEO ocean gate arrogance.
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I don’t think this was a DEI issue. I think Rush wanted to spin it that way to his clients and investors; it seems more likely to me that he wanted younger, less experienced, more malleable staff who would not challenge his design ideas, do what they’re told, and not say No to him.
If I remember correctly, according to the maritime law, the operator in the international waters is under the jurisdiction of the the country where his vessel is registered. That's why we have flags of convenience to make things "easier " for those wishing to conduct commerce on high seas. The issue of liability, for example, vary greatly between various countries.
I don't know if the sub would carriy the same flag as the tow ship. You are correct that most ships are registered in Panama, The Bahamas, etc. because they can follow the labour laws (or lack thereof) of those countries. That's why there's a lot of Filipinos working on ships because the cruise or cargo companies can pay them next to nothing.
The US has a a law called the Jones Act. Ships carrying cargo or people between US ports must be flagged and built there and also crewed mostly by citizens. The ship also has to follow US labour laws including minimum wage. That covers Hawaii, Alaska and territories like Puerto Rico. That's why foreign flagged cruise ships (which is most of them) have stop at a port like Vancouver before re-entering US waters.
Fun fact, there's a cruise ship called Pride of America that operates exclusively around Hawaii. Since it's always sailing in US waters it has to be flagged and built there and crewed mostly by citizens. The ship also doesn't have a casino because it's illegal.
