Read my previous post on the compensatory draft pick. If you google it many teams feel the draft pick is worth $10-15 mil.
Jays 16-17 off season?
- Thread starter wazup
- Start date
I read it. Don't necessarily agree with it. A draft pick is a draft pick, may or may not be a big leaguer. You can put any price you want on anything, does not mean you will get that price!Read my previous post on the compensatory draft pick. If you google it many teams feel the draft pick is worth $10-15 mil.
Doesn't really matter what you, I or anyone else thinks of the value of a 1st rounder. If you search, that is what the 30 GMs that control the market feel a draft pick is worth.I read it. Don't necessarily agree with it. A draft pick is a draft pick, may or may not be a big leaguer. You can put any price you want on anything, does not mean you will get that price!
That explains why JB EE and Trumbo
remain unsigned. Just shedding light on the situation.
Didn't you say that EE was worth and easily going to get 23 million or more per year? And that I didn't know what I was talking about.......Doesn't really matter what you, I or anyone else thinks of the value of a 1st rounder. If you search, that is what the 30 GMs that control the market feel a draft pick is worth.
That explains why JB EE and Trumbo
remain unsigned. Just shedding light on the situation.
Hmmm. The jury is still out but I feel a mea culpa coming my way.
LOLDidn't you say that EE was worth and easily going to get 23 million or more per year? And that I didn't know what I was talking about.......
Hmmm. The jury is still out but I feel a mea culpa coming my way.
You still around?
Your memory fails you. DIdn't you admit that you were "mistaken" and gave in mid-season, when EE was leading the lead in RBI's?
Why don't you troll back to your estimate and mine (since you have so much time) and quote it here.
What did JP Richiardi and protégé win in the decade plus in Toronto?I think we have it all wrong.
BTW, what did all these guys win in Cleveland?
So you would approve if JP reassembled his whole team somewhere else?What did JP Richiardi and protégé win in the decade plus in Toronto?
Not really, not a fan of his work nor a Mets fan.So you would approve if JP reassembled his whole team somewhere else?
You seem very upset with the direction the current Jays organizational has taken. Yet the prior 2 regimes the Jays had did not win anything either. Yet you are not critical of either JP or his hand picked successor Alex Anthoupolos. What gives?
I remember my estimate at about 18 million per. 3 plus an option. You said up to 5 at 23 million. And I didn't concede. You are unfortunately mistaking me for someone else.LOL
You still around?
Your memory fails you. DIdn't you admit that you were "mistaken" and gave in mid-season, when EE was leading the lead in RBI's?
Why don't you troll back to your estimate and mine (since you have so much time) and quote it here.
Feel free to check yourself. My memory along with this prediction are far less fallible it appears.
I distinctly recall that you conceded that you were "mistaken".I remember my estimate at about 18 million per. 3 plus an option. You said up to 5 at 23 million. And I didn't concede. You are unfortunately mistaking me for someone else.
Feel free to check yourself. My memory along with this prediction are far less fallible it appears.
Since you want to dig up old shit, last spring I quizzed you that there is a certain baseball factor that MAY hold back EE's FA value. You declined to answer since you know dick all about baseball, and didn't want to expose your ignorance.
Now as I just explained here, the compensatory 1st draft pick holds down market values except for the longer contracts where $10mil is a rounding error.
BTW my last estimate was $21m per. Let's see where he lands.
Big difference between JP and AA.Not really, not a fan of his work nor a Mets fan.
You seem very upset with the direction the current Jays organizational has taken. Yet the prior 2 regimes the Jays had did not win anything either. Yet you are not critical of either JP or his hand picked successor Alex Anthoupolos. What gives?
JP accomplished shit and was a bit of a sleazy character.
AA was bold, enthusiastic, willing to go all in and came within 2 games of the WS, had built a very good scouting and development team, had a core that was going to be competitive for some time, hired Canadians that understood the market and the players loved him and were willing to give home team discounts based on his promises which he mostly kept. He reenergized the market and was the face of the team.
I didn't hear too many people saying he was a failure in 2015 but I did see a ton of fans upset when he left, so I guess I am very much not alone in my opinion.
Maybe I am wrong but it seems to me that Shapeero is mainly a corporate guy who is more intent on reinventing the team in his image, undoing a lot of AA's good work for the sake of the corporate bottom line and Toronto is now reverting from being a big market team (all of Canada) that they should be, into a mid market team. He is for himself and the bottom line as opposed to the players and the fans. He feels the need to surround himself with (previously proven Cleveland) yes men. I'd be shocked if they maintain their attendance and viewership under Shaps.
So he won nothing? hmm that was a beef of yours towards current management.Big difference between JP and AA.
AA was bold, enthusiastic, willing to go all in and came within 2 games of the WS, .
And also I think most people realize that it is ownership that sets the payroll not the President or GM or whomever is the defacto head of Baseball Operations. Anyone who chastises Shapiro (correct spelling for adults) for cutting payroll in Cleveland....well hate to tell you it was his boss, the owner of the Indians that told him to do so. I don't believe he was ever even a minority owner of the Indians, unless you know better.
In Toronto, for those that want to call Shapiro, Atkins et al "cheap", correct me if I'm wrong but the payroll was higher in 2016 than 2015. And they offer that it will be the same or higher this year
That must mean that prior leadership was downright thrifty given that both Anthoupoulus and Beeston said repeatedly that they could have gotten more money from Rogers if a "baseball deal made sense."
For me, new management offers potential that was lacking in a few areas for Toronto in a number of ways;
[1] There is potential for a long term (5 years +) FA contract for players; under Beeston/AA = non starter
[2] They can sign FA's to major league deals with incentive clauses; under Beeston/AA = non starter; almost if not all the decent FA's have incentives in their contracts in the last few years.
NOTE: for those who thought Anthoupolus would have signed David Price it would have broken two of his central philosophies to do so.
[3] They will draft to develop position players not just pitchers; name any position player making an impact at the big league level for any team developed from the Jays in the past few decade . Makes for better balance at the big league level over the long haul .
Actually we had gone back and forth enough I figured I'd wait until the off season to see how things were going. And they aren't going to well.I distinctly recall that you conceded that you were "mistaken".
Since you want to dig up old shit, last spring I quizzed you that there is a certain baseball factor that MAY hold back EE's FA value. You declined to answer since you know dick all about baseball, and didn't want to expose your ignorance.
Now as I just explained here, the compensatory 1st draft pick holds down market values except for the longer contracts where $10mil is a rounding error.
BTW my last estimate was $21m per. Let's see where he lands.
Someone will sign him. And I stand by his best will probably be at 18 per 3+1.
The Jays offered 20 and four. He turned it down. They may show kindness to him and take him back at that. But only because he worked so cheap for so long.
But so far your superior knowledge hasn't been up to snuff. And if you down graded from 23 to 21 that's fine. I'll take a two million upgrade then from 18 to 20.
And that's about as close as it gets.
Don't feel like debating all the points but the issuing of long term FA contracts seems to be a fading trend across MLB. IIRC, I read an article last week that said of the 20 or 30 FAs signed to that point, only 1 was for 5 years. I think the average was about 1.5 years. I don't see Shapeero bucking that trend.[1] There is potential for a long term (5 years +) FA contract for players; under Beeston/AA = non starter
Fair point, but I prefer the flexibility of a management team to consider it as opposed to telling the entire league (the only team at the time) they absolutely refuse to entertain the idea. Does not create goodwill with the players. The younger the league gets, there lies the possibility of top notch players hitting free agency under 30 . Under the prior regime none of these types would ever play in Toronto with their hard and fast rules. Rules that to use your words, won them nothing.Don't feel like debating all the points but the issuing of long term FA contracts seems to be a fading trend across MLB. IIRC, I read an article last week that said of the 20 or 30 FAs signed to that point, only 1 was for 5 years. I think the average was about 1.5 years. I don't see Shapeero bucking that trend.
The odd dichotomy occurs when they end up trading for the ass end of long term term arguably expensive incentive laden deals that other teams had signed like Buerle and Reyes. If he is still around Tulowitski will be paid $18mln in his age 35 season.
The difference being I went down to $21 in April before the start of the season (cuz of the draft pick) while you went from 15 to 18 and now 20. you're changing your story now AFTER EE hit career highs on HR and RBI.. And if you down graded from 23 to 21 that's fine. I'll take a two million upgrade then from 18 to 20
You conceded my "superior knowledge" of baseball so everything else that is said is what you do best: trolling.
Those 5 and the Giants are all paying the luxury taxCap is 189million but that also includes an extra amount for other player expenses (e.g. benefits).
Dodgers, Yankees, Red Sox and Tigers are over. Cubs are close and may be over the 189 as well.
http://www.sbnation.com/mlb/2016/12/14/13942874/jose-bautista-rumors-blue-jays-free-agent
I tend to agree with this article, and think JB will re-sign with the Jays. He was unlucky to have injuries and his worst year after 6 very good to great seasons.
He really is best suited to DH and take a few shifts at 1B. Both his injuries last season were because he was clumsy/old in the OF.
He is still a dangerous hitter, so hope he returns, has a big year and then try to get his last big contract.
I tend to agree with this article, and think JB will re-sign with the Jays. He was unlucky to have injuries and his worst year after 6 very good to great seasons.
He really is best suited to DH and take a few shifts at 1B. Both his injuries last season were because he was clumsy/old in the OF.
He is still a dangerous hitter, so hope he returns, has a big year and then try to get his last big contract.
I'd be surprised to see the Jays give JB a 3-year deal, even with an opt-out after the first year. I could see them doing a 2-year deal with a opt-out, though.
