I Want To Stop Seeing Escorts

aj11

Member
Feb 2, 2010
54
11
8
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
This is a really heartfelt post. Thanks for sharing with us.

You are very caught up in intellectualizing and over-thinking things... that comes across in your post. (And especially in the reference to Ansari's book as well, which is a good book (probably better in print form given all the graphs/data) and likely helpful to many people, but for you it probably just provides more ammunition towards overthinking things.)

It sounds like what you've never had is a "break-in girlfriend". That's the type of first relationship you feel comfortable/deep enough in that you do a lot of things reflexively, rather than as intellectual efforts to interact. The first relationship where you're comfortable enough to be taking a dump in bathroom while she's in the shower, for example.

You should just put yourself out there and go with the flow. Online dating is much better in your 30s than in your 20s. Don't write women off for intellectual reasons at first, e.g., single mothers or others who don't meet some list of criteria... you need a relationship that's just a relationship for now. Doesn't have to be with the perfect person. Put yourself out there in other non-online areas as well of course. You can do this.
Thank you for your feedback!

Honestly, what you've mentioned here is one of the best replies in this thread, in my opinion -- you get it.

I have had short-term girlfriends, but I never had that "break-in girlfriend" that you described, and in addition to some other factors, that has made dating throughout my adult life incredibly challenging and scary (from my perspective).

When I go out on dates, or when I interact with almost anyone, I am constantly weighing pros and cons, I am constantly psychoanalyzing them and myself, and I am constantly looking for different body cues. I am basically doing mental acrobatics during all of my social interactions, and it's exhausting.

I am open to putting myself out there more, and experimenting with "going with the flow", and what you mentioned about writing women off for intellectual reasons is beyond accurate.

I have even created pros and cons lists for women that I have dated (in my journal), which usually results in me distancing myself from them, because the cons end up outweighing the pros.
 

aj11

Member
Feb 2, 2010
54
11
8
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
I gotta ask: how much do you bench press? How much do you overhead press?
After a series of lower back injuries, and numerous muscular imbalances in my 20s, I don't go as heavy as I can now, and I practice more yoga than I lift weights.

With that said, my 10 rep max for flat bench press is currently 245 pounds, my 10 rep max for dead lifts is 275 pounds, and my 10 rep max for overhead press is 125 pounds.

I haven't done my 1 rep max on flat bench in over 6 years, but at the time, when I was in worse shape than I am now (in terms of my mobility, and other factors), and when I weighed 185 pounds, it was 505 pounds.
 

Vermeer27

Active member
Jan 5, 2010
587
42
28
Think about travelling more (maybe you already do). The world is very big and our problems are actually very small. Your problems are first world problems, and billions of people on this planet have far less than you, and yet they're happier. You can learn from them. Think about philanthropy or volunteering, you may even meet the compassionate female you seek in that context. Happiness is to serve some cause greater than yourself, and with all due respect, you sound a little self-absorbed. (I don't know you of-course.)
I've basically stopped seeing escorts because it became boring, plain and simple.
 

aj11

Member
Feb 2, 2010
54
11
8
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Think about travelling more (maybe you already do). The world is very big and our problems are actually very small. Your problems are first world problems, and billions of people on this planet have far less than you, and yet they're happier. You can learn from them. Think about philanthropy or volunteering, you may even meet the compassionate female you seek in that context. Happiness is to serve some cause greater than yourself, and with all due respect, you sound a little self-absorbed. (I don't know you of-course.)
I've basically stopped seeing escorts because it became boring, plain and simple.
I travel a lot, I have been around the world (even though there are many countries that I want to see), and at this time last year, I was in Qatar and the United Arab Emirates.

Through my travels, and also because my mother is a psychiatric nurse, I am well-aware of the suffering that many people experience, and I am aware of how wealthy and privileged I am, on a number of levels. I am grateful.

Finally, I also volunteer quite a bit, and I am in the process of following-up with the Centre For Addiction And Mental Health about volunteering.
 

aj11

Member
Feb 2, 2010
54
11
8
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
It sounds like you're running away from a lot of pain... better find a therapist that doesn't fill your head with theories but works with the emotions that are under all your coping strategies... Your perfectionism, over working, your over control.. in short, your anxiety. Once you confront the pain and grief that you're holding onto and realize that another can be loving, supportive and caring without smothering you, then you can intimacy.

Find yourself a good Gestalt therapist or any therapist who isn't afraid of someone else pain... turned my life around.

pm me if you want more info.

Good luck.
My therapist definitely knows that I am in my head, far too much.

We will be starting Eye Movement Desensitization And Reprocessing (EMDR) soon (http://tinyurl.com/nnyv4t2), and I am also doing research on Somatic Experiencing (http://traumahealing.org), Holotropic Breathwork (http://tinyurl.com/gqj5dhr), and psychedelic therapy with 100% pure MDMA (and the help of a psychotherapist).

If you could please give me some more information on Gestalt therapy, I would greatly appreciate it.
 

aj11

Member
Feb 2, 2010
54
11
8
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Jesus murphy you sound a little complicated bud! Three suggestions for you. Wanna get laid & not pay an escort... Tinder my friend(you'll find out after texting, drinks, dinner that if your times worth anything an escort is usually cheaper). If your serious about a having a relationship try E harmony or if you Christian, Christian Mingle. A couple people I know have had great success with both & have seemed to find happiness. My last advice don't over analyze things(this is hard for A type's), life's not made to be perfect. When it gives you lemons, make lemonade. Everyday your above the lawn is a good day my friend!
Thank you for your feedback, and I agree with the vast majority of it.

Letting go of control, surrendering, relaxing more, trying EHarmony, and putting myself out there (in terms of dating), will all help me.

And yes, everyday above the lawn is a great day!
 

Vermeer27

Active member
Jan 5, 2010
587
42
28
I travel a lot, I have been around the world (even though there are many countries that I want to see), and at this time last year, I was in Qatar and the United Arab Emirates.

Through my travels, and also because my mother is a psychiatric nurse, I am well-aware of the suffering that many people experience, and I am aware of how wealthy and privileged I am, on a number of levels. I am grateful.

Finally, I also volunteer quite a bit, and I am in the process of following-up with the Centre For Addiction And Mental Health about volunteering.
I stand corrected. This thread is titled "I want to stop seeing escorts", so just stop seeing them. For me, it really was that simple. Your best bet for a healthy relationship is probably an existing platonic friendship that deepens into a Romantic/sexual one. That's been my experience.
 

aj11

Member
Feb 2, 2010
54
11
8
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
I stand corrected. This thread is titled "I want to stop seeing escorts", so just stop seeing them. For me, it really was that simple. Your best bet for a healthy relationship is probably an existing platonic friendship that deepens into a Romantic/sexual one. That's been my experience.
That's a great insight, however, having a platonic friendship deepen isn't something that I can force.

Maybe I'm in the midst of that process right now, with any one of my female friends. I'm not sure yet.

In the meantime, I am open to that, and to dating more, in general.
 

aj11

Member
Feb 2, 2010
54
11
8
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
I feel you bro. When I saw two escorts in the past it was because of the following reasons:

1) My ex-wife separated from me and I had to start a legal process of divorce because I was worried she was going to start it first.
2) At the time I served over the papers to her I went and started seeing escorts.
3) A law bill c-36 was coming into effect and I wanted to try it out without having a potential complication of law enforcement.

This is called a "last resort" because it's supposed to be a last resort. However, in the process of seeing these two escorts I discovered something worst than the issues that I was seeing them in the first place.

"Something" attacked me the day after seeing the second escort that ensured that I would never see an escort again, despite having an amazing experience, that up to this day I wouldn't see myself comfortable here.

In terms of my moral beliefs, sex without being married to someone is wrong. But I never had sex with any escort, I just fondled them up, groped them or rubbed them against me until I came, but I didn't actually have sex. Then I realized, in my heart I was having sex with her and it's just as bad if not worst. I also believe my body is the temple of God and that I'm partaking with devils and darkness when I did that, although I never intended that. I just wanted to deal with a woman.

Therefore, since you never had an extreme reaction like I did, or have that type of belief system, then I see you have maintained a habit of seeing an escort once a month. I only saw two escorts and their memories, although faded after 2 years, are still there and can't be completely wiped out.



At least you are not worried about demonic possession and the potential need of an exorcist.



What about Jesus? Become born-again. You tried everything else. What do you have to lose? With Jesus in my boat, I think I'll lose my mind before this ever has a chance to become anything I'd try to fight out of my life as you are doing. His holiness and the filth of this will clash like matter and anti-matter and create a bomb inside your system and will ensure you will not go back there.



The reason I saw escorts is because "meaningful relationships" have actually ended up a break-up or a divorce. No woman are true in my experience so far, and therefore, seeing an escort made sense since I don't really HAVE to trust them to deal with them. That logic didn't work out. I felt I sold out and would never be normal again, never be who I was before seeing that escort, that she stole a part of my soul that I would never get back. After 2 years later, I feel back to normal but not in a hurry to go there again lest I lose myself.
Thank you for sharing your story with me.

In terms of my belief system(s), I believe in the sun, I believe in the equanimity of the universe, I believe in the equanimity and wisdom of nature, I believe in the power of the human spirit (and mind), I believe in the power of the human experience, I believe in myself, I believe in my intuition, I believe in the scientific method, and I believe in many great thinkers of the past, including but not limited to Marcus Aurelius, Thomas Edison, Epictetus, Seneca, Sun Tzu, Laozi, and many others.

With that said, I have no interest in abiding by the rules of the vast majority of organized religions, and when I look at human history in its totality, organized religions have caused more human strife, death, conflict, and confusion than anything else, despite the many aspects of organized religions that are positive.

As a spiritual agnostic, I have more or less created my own belief system, that is based on my experiences, various eastern and western philosophies (such as zen buddhism, existentialism, stoicism, etc.), and that works for me.

As I mentioned in my original post, I do not view escorting, or having sex with escorts as being morally wrong, I don't view escorting or having sex with escorts as being objectively good or bad, and I think that whether being an escort or having sex with an escort is a positive or negative thing depends on the individual, and whether or not they are acting in alignment with their personas, interests, goals, individual values, and sense of self, and if they are thinking clearly.

As far as marriage, and the moralities that surround it are concerned, based on my paradigms, marriage and what it entails is up to the individuals. I am currently struggling with dating, so I will think about marriage when I get to that point.

I find that most people get married because they're supposed to, according to social norms, and various expectations and pressures from the media, their family, and society as a whole. I find that most people rarely get married because of the innate nature of their being and intuition dictates that they should get married.

With that said, I don't think that human beings are genetically or physiologically wired for monogamy, just like the vast majority of primates and other mammals.

Many animals are monogamous, like Emperor Penguins for example, but based on what I've learned about biology, anthropology, and human history, monogamy doesn't seem to align with humanity. It's still something that I have to put more thought into, though.

Finally, I will also say that I don't believe in objectivity or objective truths, so what works for you, and what brings you joy and fulfilment is unique to you, and may or may not apply to others.

It does seem like your idea of marriage creates a lot of guilt, shame, and numerous restrictions though, at least from my perspective.
 

aj11

Member
Feb 2, 2010
54
11
8
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
You could start by not going to escort review boards...
I have received feedback on my situation, fears, and insecurities from numerous specialists, numerous people via Reddit, as well as individuals in the various fellowships that I am a part of.

However, this is the first time that I have reached out to escorts, and individuals that see escorts, to get feedback on my situation, since they are tied to my situation and can identify with it, in many ways.

Besides this thread, and a couple of others, I never use these forums.

Today, I am here for research purposes.
 
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aj11

Member
Feb 2, 2010
54
11
8
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Good Morning :) I think you missed this post of his. He's an animal when it comes to working out lol.

He will get where he needs to be because he really wants it, it's just a matter of when is it going to happen for him.
Yoga, weight training, and things of that nature seem to fuel my perfectionism and workaholism, can contribute to my burnouts and stress when I (often) take them too far, and they are simply things that are a part of my life (like eating), so they are not suitable, in terms of relieving stress.

I totally agree with the suggestions about going for walks, or helping someone in need though -- I can do more of that, for sure.

I need to figure out something new to do, when I am in the midst of a burnout -- something that doesn't involve more intensity and/or having sex with escorts.

And Sophie, thank you for your faith in me.

In addition to the many tools that I have employed, I hope to take the most relevant feedback from this Forum and thread, to be able to surrender more, to enjoy life more, and to be open to exploring the idea of a (long-term) romantic relationship, as part of my evolution as an individual (and not to fill some sort of void within me).
 

explorerzip

Well-known member
Jul 27, 2006
8,127
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Those are all great points, and until I build a relationship with the right, psychologically-integrated woman that is open to learning more about (the whole) me (and vice-versa), I have been doing most of my sharing through my psychotherapist, through Codependents Anonymous, through a select group of friends, through online forums, through the RTribe app, and through other avenues.

In terms of my apparent successes through business and life, success is relative, everyone's definition of success is completely subjective, and I am simply on my own unique journey, doing my thing, while doing my best to understand my psyche, life, and the world at large.
I was referring to the fact that people can seem to be supportive of you even if they don't feel that way. i.e. how could someone that seems to have it all: former pro athlete, personal trainer, amazing self-control and runs 2 business have so many demons inside?

One thing that you should also realize that the road to a relationship "with the right, psychologically-integrated woman that is open to learning more about (the whole) me (and vice-versa)" is not a direct route. You may have to date several woman to find "the one." That isn't to say that you can't get lucky and meet "the one" right away. More importantly, you're going to have to date multiple women to find if what you described is really what you want. Picturing something in your mind is very different than living with a real human being.

You also should realize that if you want to have a woman be accepting of your insecurities and anxieties, you also have to do the same for her.
 

VirginJohn

Active member
Dec 1, 2005
500
45
28
Thank you for sharing your story with me.

In terms of my belief system(s), I believe in the sun, I believe in the equanimity of the universe, I believe in the equanimity and wisdom of nature, I believe in the power of the human spirit (and mind), I believe in the power of the human experience, I believe in myself, I believe in my intuition, I believe in the scientific method, and I believe in many great thinkers of the past, including but not limited to Marcus Aurelius, Thomas Edison, Epictetus, Seneca, Sun Tzu, Laozi, and many others.

With that said, I have no interest in abiding by the rules of the vast majority of organized religions, and when I look at human history in its totality, organized religions have caused more human strife, death, conflict, and confusion than anything else, despite the many aspects of organized religions that are positive.

As a spiritual agnostic, I have more or less created my own belief system, that is based on my experiences, various eastern and western philosophies (such as zen buddhism, existentialism, stoicism, etc.), and that works for me.

As I mentioned in my original post, I do not view escorting, or having sex with escorts as being morally wrong, I don't view escorting or having sex with escorts as being objectively good or bad, and I think that whether being an escort or having sex with an escort is a positive or negative thing depends on the individual, and whether or not they are acting in alignment with their personas, interests, goals, individual values, and sense of self, and if they are thinking clearly.

As far as marriage, and the moralities that surround it are concerned, based on my paradigms, marriage and what it entails is up to the individuals. I am currently struggling with dating, so I will think about marriage when I get to that point.

I find that most people get married because they're supposed to, according to social norms, and various expectations and pressures from the media, their family, and society as a whole. I find that most people rarely get married because of the innate nature of their being and intuition dictates that they should get married.

With that said, I don't think that human beings are genetically or physiologically wired for monogamy, just like the vast majority of primates and other mammals.

Many animals are monogamous, like Emperor Penguins for example, but based on what I've learned about biology, anthropology, and human history, monogamy doesn't seem to align with humanity. It's still something that I have to put more thought into, though.

Finally, I will also say that I don't believe in objectivity or objective truths, so what works for you, and what brings you joy and fulfilment is unique to you, and may or may not apply to others.

It does seem like your idea of marriage creates a lot of guilt, shame, and numerous restrictions though, at least from my perspective.
You are free to read other threads (namely one I wrote in February) by doing a search that I wrote about my experience a day after using the two escorts. What I experienced had nothing at all to do with my beliefs about what I did. I felt like I was being attacked. I was nauseated, wanted to vomit, was unable to eat (had to struggle to drink soup), and could not drive for a good week and could not sleep. I'd wake up and my heart would be beating fast like I was being attacked by a spirit. If I dare to think to waiver on my belief system, or what I believe about the sanctity of marriage, that this is not a societal programmed thing, but it is holy in the fear of God, then at the very least, I respect my own experience. I can not deny what happened to me and, if I never end up with a real woman for the rest of my life and just lived a celibate life, I'd rather that then ever having to go through whatever I did back in those dates. I can live without a woman. i can't live without sanity and peace of mind. Since the attacks I learned to value my peace of mind and enjoy allot of things knowing that the ability to enjoy life could go if your mind goes.

If a woman has to come from the devil and his kingdom, then I have to pass on that type of woman because then I become subject to the darkness and will suffer. I know that because I'm a Christian I'm an open target the minute I see an escort and they will try to get me. They got me once and I bet they are itching for me to go back so they can finish me off since I survived the first attack (I am here, alive, healthy and in my right mind).

It's like I invaded their territory and had fun, and they invaded my territory and had their fun against me.

You've mentioned everything in your post except Jesus Christ. Demons hate Jesus. I'd start there. You look at Hollywood movies, what name do they defame the most? What religion is mostly persecuted by Muslims on the other side of the world, and by Communists? It's always mainly the Christian faith. It's like there is an aversion to the name of Jesus Christ. I am not talking about cultural or white American Christianity (I'm not white by the way so I can 100% tell you this is not cultural for me) but a real relationship with Jesus Christ.
 

Sniper Jr.

Member
Sep 24, 2005
313
15
18
You are free to read other threads (namely one I wrote in February) by doing a search that I wrote about my experience a day after using the two escorts. What I experienced had nothing at all to do with my beliefs about what I did. I felt like I was being attacked. I was nauseated, wanted to vomit, was unable to eat (had to struggle to drink soup), and could not drive for a good week and could not sleep. I'd wake up and my heart would be beating fast like I was being attacked by a spirit. If I dare to think to waiver on my belief system, or what I believe about the sanctity of marriage, that this is not a societal programmed thing, but it is holy in the fear of God, then at the very least, I respect my own experience. I can not deny what happened to me and, if I never end up with a real woman for the rest of my life and just lived a celibate life, I'd rather that then ever having to go through whatever I did back in those dates. I can live without a woman. i can't live without sanity and peace of mind. Since the attacks I learned to value my peace of mind and enjoy allot of things knowing that the ability to enjoy life could go if your mind goes.

If a woman has to come from the devil and his kingdom, then I have to pass on that type of woman because then I become subject to the darkness and will suffer. I know that because I'm a Christian I'm an open target the minute I see an escort and they will try to get me. They got me once and I bet they are itching for me to go back so they can finish me off since I survived the first attack (I am here, alive, healthy and in my right mind).

It's like I invaded their territory and had fun, and they invaded my territory and had their fun against me.

You've mentioned everything in your post except Jesus Christ. Demons hate Jesus. I'd start there. You look at Hollywood movies, what name do they defame the most? What religion is mostly persecuted by Muslims on the other side of the world, and by Communists? It's always mainly the Christian faith. It's like there is an aversion to the name of Jesus Christ. I am not talking about cultural or white American Christianity (I'm not white by the way so I can 100% tell you this is not cultural for me) but a real relationship with Jesus Christ.
I've heard that if you accept Jesus Christ as your saviour, you will have 72 escorts waiting for you in the afterlife. :angel:
 

Derp du Soleil

New member
Oct 1, 2016
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The first time I saw an escort, it was after many years of fantasizing about having no strings attached sex with a woman that has a great deal of sexual experience (such as an escort or a porn star).......

Since the first time I saw an escort, despite the fact that I have had many amazing experiences with escorts, including great sex, and interesting conversations, and despite the fact that I have learned a great deal about my psychology, my sexuality, human interactions, and the escort industry through sex with escorts, more often than not, when I see escorts, it's when I am physically and psychologically burnt out, or feeling isolated, or feeling overwhelmingly anxious, or a combination of many negative emotions, as a way of managing those emotions.

As such, sex with escorts has never been something that has been completely spontaneous and carefree for me, and seeing escorts usually comes after a great deal of stress, anxiety, and isolation.

....she was surprised that I don't have a girlfriend, and she motivated me to get back onto the dating scene, and to face potential rejection (and potential joy) once again.
Hi AJ - I read though the comment chain first, then went back to your original and cut out a few points. Now obviously, we've never met and I can only surmise what's troubling you, but I gather a lot of it comes from your perception of control. Now I'm in a line of work where control is a big deal. I'm used to planning, building contingencies when things go wrong, and generally going through life with a degree of manageable stress.

It seems that you may be attracted to escorts because you have a high degree of control going into the arrangement: The looks of your companion, the time, the price - and I'm guessing that you often make requests for particular outfits or lingerie to be worn. Once you meet, you're able to shut that portion of your brain off and give it a rest - you can escape into a controlled environment with an expected outcome and not have to worry about every detail. In essence, for whatever time you're together you're not anxious. However, once the "brief affair" is over... You're back to square one, and you probably feel worse about it because it's not what you want out of life. I don't think that you have a fear of intimacy...just a fear that the intimacy isn't going to be the summit of the mountain you're trying to conquer.

You're in a tough spot, because forward progress is going to involve releasing yourself from the predicable nature of your current path. You're going to need to have some unpredictable outcomes - women that may not call you back, despite you doing everything "right." People that don't like you, despite your looks, or your jokes, or any number of other qualities you have going for you. But that's not a bad thing, and you can't just look back at every event and wonder what YOU did wrong, or how YOU could have changed things for the better. Sometimes things just don't go your way, and there's no amount of analysis that will allow you to change the past. You have to accept that there are things that you cannot control. As you said at the end - you have to be able to accept rejection, and it comes in many forms.

You're not broken or damaged. You just need set manageable outcomes. As others have mentioned, online dating gives you the ability to set out some manageable expectations going into a relationship. Don't approach dating as something that you can plan from start to finish. Set out a few criteria you'd like to achieve and let the rest fill itself in as the time passes. "I'd like to have dinner, then go for a walk to place X where we can get desert." If she doesn't want desert, then fill that with something else. Plan a weekend where you pick a spot, one or two activities and leave the rest open. Find a few things that surprise you, or things that you haven't done before. Sit down together and let her plan some of the details, knowing that she may want to do things that may not 100% interest you, or involve events that you have no experience with. Let her take the lead, and see how the intimacy develops between you.

Anyways - hope this is on target. Good luck.
 
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