European Refugee Crisis
- Thread starter james t kirk
- Start date
Actually throwing immigrants at the problem appears to solve it. The US will avoid the aging population problem primarily because of immigration from Mexico. Legal or otherwise, the US now has a young and growing population.We are heading for catastrophe regardless. All our economic systems depend on more people going into them than are going out. Compounding the problem is the fact we are living longer and the added expense associated with doing so. Our social safety nets are giant ponzi schemes that will collapse at some point. Irresponsible politicians will speed up the process. Throwing immigrants at the problem just delays the inevitable and makes the impending collapse all the more brutal. I expect my senior life will be drastically different than what today's seniors are enjoying...and not in a good way.
We haven't had a mass wave of ME immigrants like you are suggesting so who can say. But even you have to agree that they are historically homophobic and misogynist. Add in the fact they are choosing to segregate themselves I foresee the issue continuing.Are second and third generation parents doing that or are these the original immigrants that are having a tough time?
Large numbers give them political clout. The ability to affect policy. It also makes it easier for them to set up a separate school system and seperate further. The ones here are already either discussing just that or homeschooling.
So unless you are going to make attending public school mandatory I see the problem getting worse.
Better limited numbers from several groups who would be more prone to integrate then a mass wave like this. There are lots of deserving people, out there. What makes just the Syrians so special? There are about 2.4 million supposedly from there and North Africa on the move. No way we can take them all. And taking from one nation is in fact cherry picking due to some pictures. I'm perhaps a bit callous when I say this but life is cheap over there. There have been thousands of toddlers killed over decades. And that isn't going to change until the people do.
Why not a reimplementation of the Chinese head tax? Except this time make it an across the board tax on all. That would raise some money.We need more immigrants if in future we want to be able to pay for anything, owing to our aging population. Young, hardworking, resourceful people are just what we need.
While I agree with much that you have said with respect to the refugees in Europe, you are wrong on the above.My point exactly! Both populations come from non-English speaking countries.
French Canadians are the exception. Because they are one of the original founding peoples, they were given (even in defeat) their own ethnic, linguistic ghetto called Quebec
Quebec was never conquered.
France lost the Seven Years War which was a European war and the British demanded payment in the form of either Quebec or Guadeloupe. Th British allowed the French to choose which colony they wanted to keep, Quebec or Guadeloupe. But they couldn't have both. France picked Guadeloupe. Quebec was never taken by force. The British guaranteed religious freedom and the Catholic Church was maintained in Quebec and the church worked to maintain Quebec isolationism, which included preserving the French language in Quebec.
http://www.usnews.com/news/world/ar...n-church-muslim-refugees-converting-in-droves
Not a big surprise. Iranians are the most westernized Muslims. Plus, their ancestors were forced to convert to Islam at the point of a sword so now they are undoing by free will what their ancestors were forced to do under penalty of death.
Not a big surprise. Iranians are the most westernized Muslims. Plus, their ancestors were forced to convert to Islam at the point of a sword so now they are undoing by free will what their ancestors were forced to do under penalty of death.
I was trying to find info on what mosques in Canada and Canada's one million Muslims are doing to resolve the Syrian refugee crisis. Instead I found a bunch of articles about what churches (not mosques) are doing. An example is
http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...ross-canada-rally-to-resettle-syrian-refugees
http://news.nationalpost.com/news/c...ross-canada-rally-to-resettle-syrian-refugees
So why not enjoy life now and commit suicide later lol.We are heading for catastrophe regardless. All our economic systems depend on more people going into them than are going out. Compounding the problem is the fact we are living longer and the added expense associated with doing so. Our social safety nets are giant ponzi schemes that will collapse at some point. Irresponsible politicians will speed up the process. Throwing immigrants at the problem just delays the inevitable and makes the impending collapse all the more brutal. I expect my senior life will be drastically different than what today's seniors are enjoying...and not in a good way.
Western Europe is truly reaping what it sowed. But it is possible this was all orchestrated to trigger a mass migration of the best and brightest from these countries to the west, further ensuring they will remain DIRT. It also provide Europe with a cheap labour pool to fund its massive welfare obligations. Kinda like a new type of colonialism.
Actually Fuji, I find your comments always "racist". I'm simply stating a fact, no where did I claim that White Europeans are the only ones welcomed into Canada. I think our society needs a broad spectrum of people to bring in new ideas and experiences so that Canada benefits. My father came to Canada in 1947 in a converted Lancaster Bomber, as he was recruited to come to Canada by the Canadian government and was required to settle in Peterborough to work at Massey-Ferguson and after a few years he moved to Toronto as he had fulfilled his obligations to the government in sponsoring his emigration.Canada was originally founded by people fleeing discrimination in Europe. And you racist claim that only white europeans can integrate into Canada needs to be relegated to the last century where it belongs.
And of course since I'm white I MUST BE A RACIST? Well I'm sorry to burst your bubble but discrimination was alive and well in Toronto in the 1950's & 60's. If you weren't a WASP or Protestant you couldn't get a job with the City of Toronto. You could apply, but unless you had the right kind of last name, or weren't born in England, Scotland or Northern Ireland, it's going into the reject pile. My father was one of the first Irish Catholics to be hired by the Toronto Board of Education only because he BY CHANCE was walking out of the office after dropping off his application and ran into a supervisor that he had worked for in England during the war repairing bomb damage. He walked my Dad back into the office asking the receptionist where his application was, telling her to put it in "the other pile" so I would get approved.
Most groups of immigrants do not fully integrate into Canadian society especially those who are from "visible majorities" because our value and customs remain strange to them. Their children usually end up being more integrated into Canadian society because they grew up here and by daily exposure they learn. They learn to value their heritage and the things that make Canada such a great country, Hockey, Snow, Back Bacon, etc...
My worry is that they can't integrate successfully because of language, education and cultural difficulties, not to mention employment issues. Look at the issues we are continuing to experience in certain areas with drugs, guns and violence because there just aren't the opportunities available to everyone to get out of poverty.
Yes it is...LOL....this dude said my educational background was in question, they start teaching this stuff in grade 7 (I have studied this stuff at a post-secondary level). However I think it's unfair to label all Muslims in the same light, it's far more complicated than you suggest.
Aren't you currently living in the USA because you can make more money there, for a better quality of life? And my ancestors also fought for Canada in WW2 and Korea. My teachers for the most part were all WW2 veterans. So unless you've got skin in the game by living here, your opinion doesn't count for squat. You're entitled to your opinion, but I disagree with you as I find that unless I happen to agree whole heartily with you I'm a bigoted racist. Since we're throwing around labels, I find you to be a Liberal Communist Socialist Internet Troll...Without a massive increase in immigration we are headed for a catastrophe. Our population is aging. As the ratio of workers to retirees starts to climb taxes will go up, working people will leave for regions without an aging population therefore lower taxes, leaving even fewer workers to pay even higher taxes in a death spiral. It is already happening in the maritime provinces and it will eventually spread nation wide.
Your absolute racism is disgusting by the way. My ancestors fought for Canada to be open and free.
And when the Irish in my family came, people were saying they'd gladly welcome the Scots, French, Germans, and even the Welsh. Fact is the Irish they didn't want integrated pretty damn well too.Name calling, false accusations and demonizing Canada will not solve this crisis. Also, knee jerk emotional reactions are no substitute for sound policy and due diligence.
Fearmongering about lack of immigrants is groundless. Racist me would gladly welcome the Chinese, Koreans, Filipinos, Portuguese and E.I.'s (and even those dreaded red hair Irish Catholics) and many of them would be happy to come to Canada and adopt our values.
Yeah, A few hundred thousands more would make the Muslim population what, 4% of the Canada?...
Large numbers give them political clout. The ability to affect policy. It also makes it easier for them to set up a separate school system and seperate further. The ones here are already either discussing just that or homeschooling. ....
And no matter what the parents want, the kids will see other Canadian kids and want to be just like them. It's not an instantaneous process but it happens and has been happening for generations of immigrants.
If you go back far enough, the City of Toronto (i.e. the municipal employees) was all Irish Protestant. In fact, to succeed, you'd better be a member of the Orangemen. And the trades were all controlled by the Scots, and the banks by the English. Much has changed.Actually Fuji, I find your comments always "racist". I'm simply stating a fact, no where did I claim that White Europeans are the only ones welcomed into Canada. I think our society needs a broad spectrum of people to bring in new ideas and experiences so that Canada benefits. My father came to Canada in 1947 in a converted Lancaster Bomber, as he was recruited to come to Canada by the Canadian government and was required to settle in Peterborough to work at Massey-Ferguson and after a few years he moved to Toronto as he had fulfilled his obligations to the government in sponsoring his emigration.
And of course since I'm white I MUST BE A RACIST? Well I'm sorry to burst your bubble but discrimination was alive and well in Toronto in the 1950's & 60's. If you weren't a WASP or Protestant you couldn't get a job with the City of Toronto. You could apply, but unless you had the right kind of last name, or weren't born in England, Scotland or Northern Ireland, it's going into the reject pile. My father was one of the first Irish Catholics to be hired by the Toronto Board of Education only because he BY CHANCE was walking out of the office after dropping off his application and ran into a supervisor that he had worked for in England during the war repairing bomb damage. He walked my Dad back into the office asking the receptionist where his application was, telling her to put it in "the other pile" so I would get approved.
Most groups of immigrants do not fully integrate into Canadian society especially those who are from "visible majorities" because our value and customs remain strange to them. Their children usually end up being more integrated into Canadian society because they grew up here and by daily exposure they learn. They learn to value their heritage and the things that make Canada such a great country, Hockey, Snow, Back Bacon, etc...
My worry is that they can't integrate successfully because of language, education and cultural difficulties, not to mention employment issues. Look at the issues we are continuing to experience in certain areas with drugs, guns and violence because there just aren't the opportunities available to everyone to get out of poverty.
After reading all of these posts, my position still has not changed. These refugees need to be sent back to their homelands. Sorry to be a "racist", but I do not believe that they or their children will ever integrate into Western society. I see it here in Canada (honour killings, home grown fundamentalist terrorists, guys trying to blow up railway bridges, to a guy shooting a soldier in Ottawa and then blasting up parliament., and in Europe, it's far worse (Je suis Charlie.)
The best course of action is for the west to help these countries change from within, to end war, to help their economies. I'm all for that, but not accepting millions of immigrants from a culture that is inherently intolerant.
When Islam has a reformation like Christianity did, and religion becomes secondary in their lives, we might be more compatible. But until then, it just won't work.
Correct, when I joined TD Bank in 1981, all of our senior management were from the UK. The bank used to go to England on a yearly recruiting drive. If you were a Canadian, you just didn't have the right stuff to run a bank in their opinion. Times have changed for the better, you're judged by your abilities and strength of character not where you came from. But that is still a factor.If you go back far enough, the City of Toronto (i.e. the municipal employees) was all Irish Protestant. In fact, to succeed, you'd better be a member of the Orangemen. And the trades were all controlled by the Scots, and the banks by the English. Much has changed.
Actually a homophobe to someone tolerant. And certainly not a Xenophobe. I stated we should take some in. We can easily absorb 10-25 thousand vetted refugees and get them set up immediately. There are over 4 million registered at the moment. Surely we don't need to take them all.So you went from being a homophobe to an xenophobe now. Sounds quite rational to me.
You certainly do have redneck in your background.
You claim to believe in freedom of expression but you don't believe in freedom of religion.
Canada was founded on Christian principles by both English and French. Read Canadian history 101.
Funny how Christianity was taken out of the schools and homosexuality was indoctrinated.
Shouldn't respect be given to all to be fair? That is a Christian principle.
So would you agree to homosexuality teachings to young children, but not have young children learn Christian principles in the same school???
Sure I believe in freedom of religion. That is why it shouldn't to fought in schools. It belongs in the home and places of worship. But teaching about biology, repoduction, and what we have come to realize are human rights to how we are born sexually should be taught.
Religion is a choice, sexuality is not.
You falsely claimed that prior waves of immigrants integrated faster and/or didn't live in segregated areas. But they were the same. It has taken every wave of immigration three generations or so to come out of their little Italy's and China towns. The first generation typically finds our culture strange and warns their kids about mixing with others. The second generation kind of listen to their parents. It is the third and later generations that have moved to a post ethic, secular outlook.Aren't you currently living in the USA because you can make more money there, for a better quality of life? And my ancestors also fought for Canada in WW2 and Korea. My teachers for the most part were all WW2 veterans. So unless you've got skin in the game by living here, your opinion doesn't count for squat. You're entitled to your opinion, but I disagree with you as I find that unless I happen to agree whole heartily with you I'm a bigoted racist. Since we're throwing around labels, I find you to be a Liberal Communist Socialist Internet Troll...
Other than fear mongering that Syrians are going to be different, what point have you made?
Or James?
We heard the same nonsense about Chinese not integrating and staying in their areas and then Indians and Sikhs. Well guess what? The grandkids mix it up.
You guys highlight the extremists and the honor killings, but actually those cases refute you in a way, as they show the kids aren't towing daddy's line, they get shit from their parents BECAUSE they are integrating.
And of course the violent cases are EXCEEDINGLY rare, even in Muslim countries. The few cases make the news because they are shocking but they are very few cases. .
Some suggestions here are good ones: assigning immigrants to parts of the country, putting them to work. These things would help them integrate and are not a bad idea.
But turning them away for racist reasons?
No.
That is exactly why many in these threads blame the US for all the conflict. How dare we encourage respect for human rights in other countries!...
The best course of action is for the west to help these countries change from within, to end war, to help their economies. I'm all for that, but not accepting millions of immigrants from a culture that is inherently intolerant.
....
Question is though, are we willing to allow massive death tolls in other countries while we wait for them to discover how wonderful the western way of life is?
Considering the death toll it took Europe to figure it out only 70 years ago that may be the only option.That is exactly why many in these threads blame the US for all the conflict. How dare we encourage respect for human rights in other countries!
Question is though, are we willing to allow massive death tolls in other countries while we wait for them to discover how wonderful the western way of life is?
We can point out how stupid the reasons are for fighting to our hearts content but until they are either sick of it or one side definitively wins that may well be the right choice.
A microcosm would be Sri Lanka. They recently elected a Tamil as leader of the the Opposition. But it took a civil war with horrible cost to achieve peace.
