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Covid-19 most likely came from a lab leak,,,,,,,,,duh

WyattEarp

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What this woman says is true, but I think there is great economic pressures today. With the advent of multiple 24/7 cable news outlets and the newspaper industry declining, the fight for eyeballs has never been this intense. Network news of the past was also considered for its prestige by their operators. As we are seeing with the pressure on CNN now, cable news outlets have to justify their existence with their bottom line.
 
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Valcazar

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What should we take from this?
Did you read the thread?

What we can take from this is more evidence that the WIV didn't have a precursor of SARS-CoV-2 they were studying.
Is it definitive? No. It goes to 2018.
But a lot of the various lab leak stories require them to have had it and in ones where they were working on GoF they would have needed it for some time.
So it pushes those even further into the "unlikely" category.
 

Valcazar

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What this woman says is true, but I think there is great economic pressures today. With the advent of multiple 24/7 cable news outlets and the newspaper industry declining, the fight for eyeballs has never been this intense. Network news of the past was also considered for its prestige by their operators. As we are seeing with the pressure on CNN now, cable news outlets have to justify their existence with their bottom line.
And this is why the "Fox news wins in the ratings" is such a silly talking point for why people should believe them.
Fox News has expressly decided that telling their audience what they want to hear is the way to better ratings (and they are correct).

Good journalism is expensive to do and rarely gets the same kind of audience.
Fox pulling in those kinds of ratings while still getting to pretend to be a news organization created tremendous pressure on the other cable news organizations to follow suit. (And there already was a lot of pressure for the reasons you cite.)
 

jcpro

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And this is why the "Fox news wins in the ratings" is such a silly talking point for why people should believe them.
Fox News has expressly decided that telling their audience what they want to hear is the way to better ratings (and they are correct).

Good journalism is expensive to do and rarely gets the same kind of audience.
Fox pulling in those kinds of ratings while still getting to pretend to be a news organization created tremendous pressure on the other cable news organizations to follow suit. (And there already was a lot of pressure for the reasons you cite.)
LOL! Fox didn't tell its viewers that lab leak was debunked and a conspiracy theory. Fox didn't tell its viewers that Rogan took horse medicine. Fox didn't tell its viewers that the laptop was Russian misinformation, etc, etc, etc. Fox opinion side certainly said objectionable things, too Point is- if you're going to toss rocks, step out of the glass house Mr. Ideologue. All MSN is guilty of something- some of them are so guilty, their viewers fled, like the CNN.
 
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WyattEarp

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And this is why the "Fox news wins in the ratings" is such a silly talking point for why people should believe them.
Fox News has expressly decided that telling their audience what they want to hear is the way to better ratings (and they are correct).

Good journalism is expensive to do and rarely gets the same kind of audience.
Fox pulling in those kinds of ratings while still getting to pretend to be a news organization created tremendous pressure on the other cable news organizations to follow suit. (And there already was a lot of pressure for the reasons you cite.)
I haven't checked Fox News' ratings in awhile, but it always seemed to me that the CNN, MSNBC and the network news split up the non-conservative news. The NYT and WaPO also have a lot of reach.

When I hear 3 million people tuned in to watch Tucker Carlson, I think that's good but that's a little over 1% of American adults. (Although it seems judging by this forum, that 10 million Canadians are watching him. Lol.). That 3 million is good business, but it's hardly a national wave tuning into his show. I'm guessing of that 3 million many are in the audience every night. So what's his overall reach 4 million?

I'm sorry Rachel Maddow hurts my ears and more importantly my brain. She makes Don Lemon seem like lemon chiffon.
 
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Valcazar

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I haven't checked Fox News' ratings in awhile, but it always seemed to me that the CNN, MSNBC and the network news split up the non-conservative news. The NYT and WaPO also have a lot of reach.
They do.
And yes, you can say that the other networks all split up the non-conservative news but I don't think that's quite right.

The issue is you can't point to ratings and say "they do the best news".

It's just the wrong metric.

The ratings show that a lot of people want what Fox is delivering. That's it.

Pointing to CNN beating MSNBC or whatever (I have no idea which does better in the ratings) also doesn't tell you anything about the quality of their news.
It tells you about what people watch.
It sometimes can tell you a bit about who people trust, but even that's probably indirect and again, that actually says nothing about the quality of their news.

When I hear 3 million people tuned in to watch Tucker Carlson, I think that's good but that's a little over 1% of American adults. (Although it seems judging by this forum, that 10 million Canadians are watching him. Lol.). That 3 million is good business, but it's hardly a national wave tuning into his show. I'm guessing of that 3 million many are in the audience every night. So what's his overall reach 4 million?

I'm sorry Rachel Maddow hurts my ears and more importantly my brain. She makes Don Lemon seem like lemon chiffon.
There are a lot of people who hate Rachel Maddow's approach, which developed in radio and still has a lot of radio news tics as far as I can tell.

Again - that says absolutely nothing about the quality of the reporting in any way. (It may say something about the quality of the commentary, since those shows are as much about commentary as they are about transmitting the news.)
 

WyattEarp

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Again - that says absolutely nothing about the quality of the reporting in any way. (It may say something about the quality of the commentary, since those shows are as much about commentary as they are about transmitting the news.)
I see obvious bullshit on Fox, MSNBC and CNN. Awhile back, MSNBC gave the green light to their anchors to provide commentary within their supposed newscasts. If we're talking about commentary, Fox News had cordoned off their news hours from their commentators.

The Fox audience is obviously rewarding commentators over news anchors, but I think MSNBC has the same dynamic. I don't watch Fox News, but if Martha MacCallum lost her hour and Jesse Watters was given an hour that would be an obvious shift to commentary. But again, one would have to be a fool to not know the difference.
 
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Valcazar

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I see obvious bullshit on Fox, MSNBC and CNN. Awhile back, MSNBC gave the green light to their anchors to provide commentary within their supposed newscasts. If we're talking about commentary, Fox News had cordoned off their news hours from their commentators.

The Fox audience is obviously rewarding commentators over news anchors, but I think MSNBC has the same dynamic. I don't watch Fox News, but if Martha MacCallum lost her hour and Jesse Watters was given an hour that would be an obvious shift to commentary. But again, one would have to be a fool to not know the difference.
The problem is Fox News as a network doesn't report the news other than incidentally.
Yes, their anchor/commentator parts are the most egregious, with Tucker just being flat out a propagandist, but their news desk as well is not something that feels beholden to any journalistic standards.
That's always been the case to some degree, but it has gotten worse over time from what I can tell.

But as you say, this has been a big problem for years in all cable news. They need to fill time, and random speculation and punditry is easier to fill time with.
There is a reason Crossfire was being pilloried back in the day before it got canceled. It was exactly that kind of bullshit.
 

basketcase

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...

No, I'm simply pointing out that in 2020 the intelligence agencies and cooperative media partners didn't represent the information they had in hand accurately....
And what do you base that on? Do you have an intelligence summaries from 2020? Do you have anything other than Trump's ridiculous claim and the fact that there is a lab across the city?



Sorry but in the absence of definitive evidence (or even the intelligence agencies releasing their evidence), science always goes with the most probable answer. Until I get my ultra-top secret clearance, we're left with three possibilities.

a) The outbreak occurred in the immediate area of a market with live animals because of zoonotic transfer which we have seen occur many times
b) The outbreak occurred in the immediate area of a market because a lab leak occurred on the other side of the big city, infecting a worker who didn't infect anyone in the vicinity of the lab but only broke out near the market.
c) The outbreak occurred earlier around the lab because of a lab leak but the Chinese government locked it down except for one individual who spread it to the market where for some reason they were unable to lock it down.


a) is a definite possibility. b) is possible but ... c) well that's just conspiracy thinking.
 

basketcase

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As the female news anchor said in the video: "We actually don't have different outlets covering the same kind of news...............
What you believe becomes completely determined by the news channels you watch."
...
Absolutely true.

I know it's a study so it won't get play in right-wing circles but Democrat leaning voters have a much broader range of news sources than the right. Seems Fox views only trust Fox while the rest of us make a point of looking at a variety of sources.

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The Oracle

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On the slopes of Mount Parnassus, Greece

What is the risk/benefit to gain of function research? What are we getting out of it? With immense risk we are getting no benefit at all.

Here Dr. Robert Redfield the formed CDC director testifies before a committee the specific problems with gain of function research. He has maintained from the beginning that this from a lab leak.

MSM won't even touch this testimony...
 
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Valcazar

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What is the risk/benefit to gain of function research? What are we getting out of it?
Totally legitimate question.
Too bad it isn't something the lab leak people want to talk about seriously.
 

lomotil

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Oblivion

What is the risk/benefit to gain of function research? What are we getting out of it? With immense risk we are getting no benefit at all.

Here Dr. Robert Redfield the formed CDC director testifies before a committee the specific problems with gain of function research. He has maintained from the beginning that this from a lab leak.

MSM won't even touch this testimony...
The Wuhan Lab was cautioned more than once not to infect human cells with Coronavirus from bats, pangolins etc.due to the risk of developing pathogens like Covid-19.
 
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