Bush's Pathetic Record on Terrorism

[WoodPeckr]

BUSH REJECTED PLANS TO GO AFTER TOP TERRORIST

Just got this interesting article on Abu Musab al-Zarqawi the terrorist involved in those two recent beheadings of Americans in Iraq :

In his effort to claim he is the strongest candidate on national
security, President Bush has lately been speaking a lot about how he is doing
everything possible to track down terrorist Abu Musab al-Zarqawi[1] -
the man thought to be responsible for escalating attacks on U.S.
soldiers in
Iraq.[2] But according to NBC News, it was Bush who in 2002 and 2003
rejected three plans to strike and neutralize Zarqawi because he believed
a successful strike would undermine the public case for targeting
Saddam Hussein.

As NBC News reported, "Long before the war, the Bush administration had
several chances to wipe out his terrorist operation and perhaps kill
Zarqawi himself - but never pulled the trigger." In June 2002, the
Pentagon drafted plans to attack a camp Zarqawi was at with cruise missiles
and airstrikes. The plan was killed by the White House. Four months
later, as Zarqawi planned to use ricin in terrorist attacks in Europe, the
Pentagon drew up a second strike plan, yet "the White House again
killed it." In January 2003, the Pentagon drew up still another attack plan,
and for the third time, the White House killed it.[3]

According to NBC, "Military officials insist their case for attacking
Zarqawi's operation was airtight, but the administration feared
destroying the terrorist camp in Iraq could undercut its case for war against
Saddam."[4]

Zarqawi is thought to be at least indirectly responsible for hundreds
of U.S. casualties. Just yesterday, Zarqawi's terrorist group beheaded
an American civilian in Baghdad.[5]

Sources:

1. "President's Remarks to the General Conference of the National Guard
Association of the United States," The White House, 9/14/04,
http://daily.misleader.org/ctt.asp?u=2942478&l=56809.
2. "Going after Iraq's most wanted man," The Christian Science Monitor,
9/21/04, http://daily.misleader.org/ctt.asp?u=2942478&l=56810.
3. "Avoiding attacking suspected terrorist mastermind," NBC News,
3/02/04, http://daily.misleader.org/ctt.asp?u=2942478&l=56811.
4. Ibid, http://daily.misleader.org/ctt.asp?u=2942478&l=56811.
5. "Zarqawi Group Beheads U.S. Hostage Armstrong," Reuters, 9/20/04,
http://daily.misleader.org/ctt.asp?u=2942478&l=56812.


Visit www.Misleader.org for more about Bush Administration distortion.

 

[papasmerf]

I have a problem with truman's refusal to let Mac Authur go beyond the 38th parallel. Pressing on would have shaped a different history for democracy and seriously hamstinged communism

 

[papasmerf]

I can not agree with you
in the mid 50's china was not prepaired to take on the US.


Today there seems to be a fear of conflict with China and it is even higher then it was in 1953.

 

[papasmerf]

Actually Don, yes

But we are looking back in history, here.

throughout the 50's and a portion of the 60's there was more propaganda then substance.

Since the BAMBOO CURTIN was intact no one could verify anything

 

[WoodPeckr]

I have a problem with truman's refusal to let MacAuthur go beyond the 38th parallel. Pressing on would have shaped a different history for democracy and seriously hamstinged communism

Truman made the right decision refusing to let Mac Arthur go into Red China. At the time the US didn't have enough Nuclear weapons to do the job, a conventional war would not have beaten China. A nuclear war with China would make the USA bigger killers than Hitler. China just has too many divisions and troops.

For some interesting reading do a search on some the Civil Wars China has gone through during their long history, longer than ours. There have been many Civil Wars in China and it was not uncommon for 'Several Hundreds of Millions' to have died in some of them. Chinese history goes back thousands of years and their Civil Wars make the USA Civil War casualities look like a mere skirmish.

 

[papasmerf]

Don,
many a man has followed other to war and did what we had to so as to survive. Reality is when the shooting starts, there is not right or wrong, just survival.

I agree with you on China and the value of their dollar.
But the problem is called MOST FAVORED NATION.

 

[papasmerf]

Don,
I respect your opinion
But consider the alternative
Kerry was ANTI-WAR in College

In action he was hit alot in a short period of time
His own testimony has him tuning and running.

On his return he called those who fought criminals.


Just can not trust him not to sell out. that and 20 years in public office, yet nothing to brag about?????


I just dont trust Kerry.


GW got my vote on 9-14-01, his speach, response and commitment got mine.


Adfmittedly i did not vote for him in 2000, but before you think gore, think anyone else.

 

[WoodPeckr]

Rare Video Footage On 9/11

Rare Video Footage From Inside The World Trade Center On 9/11

Newly released clip:

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article6932.htm

 

[papasmerf]

Don I have to say you are wrong.

Perhaps once he was the man his campaign claims he was.

But since then his record of voting has not shown a man who believe in a stong millitary. His own words to congress in the 70's. Bush steped up when it counted and shows a willingness to take this to completion. I suspect Kerry will leave us in the same position we were in when Clinton left. Home securtity reduced by 50% and reduced ability to respond to attacks, in a swift manner.

I just can not get behind Kerry.

 

[langeweile]

I am sorry- you are talking about Canada and Germany here? or the U.S.A.?

I am talking mainly about Europe.
You talking about poor people..meaasured in disposable income Europe has gone to the bottom of the scale. Due to failed social programs nobody can afford. Canada has chosen to follow the same path.

 

[langeweile]

schadenfreude I guess is the first part, not sure what liking someone for the enemies they make would be- ummm... weird

Because he has exposed our so called friends for what they really are.
They are fair weather friends who only stay with us if there is money to be had. This anti americanism is nothing you it has been going on in Germany for the last twenty years.
It has finaally been exposed, that's why I like Bush.
Americans don't realize how many other nations realy hate them. While I am not sure we should really care it is time to drop the charade and take names and find out who our real friends are.

 

[Dabbler]

No offense, but this is about as naive as it gets. France, Germany and the UN won't come close to Iraq no matter who the President is.
<<Hey OTB, well for one, Kerry will involve the United Nations in rebuilding Iraq. This would make reconstruction appear as a joint UN operation rather than just an American occupation. Secondly Kerry has also indicated that he will also consult with US allies rather than taking a unilateral approach.>>

Hey Fritz, no offense taken. I was just answering a question from OTB relating to the difference between Bush's and Kerry's Iraq policy. I would also guess that if Germany, France and other industralized nations had access to all those lucrative non bid contracts that Bush\Chaney supporters and friends are getting the answer might be different. I watch BBC news which I believe gives a fairly accurate picture of the carnage and violence and neither the US nor their puppet government are in control there and Afghanistan does not appear much better. I think the US voting public is the one who is naive if they believe Bush's claim to the UN yesterday that freedom is spreading either place.

 

[Dabbler]

.
While I am a true conservative and don't agree with everyhting Bush does. (I like him for the enemies he made).

I am your worst nightmare..born and raised in Germany..family members in a former communist country....now by the grace of god and American Citizen......here it comes....working and living in Canada.

The control and power that the goverments of Canada and Germany has over his people is absolutely mindblowing. In all fairness though Canada hasn't quiet gone down as far as Europe did.Although your leaders are trying hard.

If your own country is on the brink of disaster, build up an enemy, that you can blame for your own mistakes. If you don't believe me I suggest you read "Mein Kampf". A classic tale of hoew you manipulate the masses by blaming all your woes on somebody else.


Hey langeweile, thats quite an introduction, welcome. Cheers for now, Dabbler.

 

[Ickabod]

Don I have to say you are wrong.

Perhaps once he was the man his campaign claims he was.

Ok, then when bullets start flying, you hitch your wagon to the guy who will take you running in the other direction, i'm hitching mine to Kerry.

Bush steped up when it counted and shows a willingness to take this to completion.

You're kidding, right? How much guts does it take to send other people to get killed?

I suspect Kerry will leave us in the same position we were in when Clinton left.

You mean with OBL still out there planning to kill us?

 

[papasmerf]

Ok, then when bullets start flying, you hitch your wagon to the guy who will take you running in the other direction, i'm hitching mine to Kerry.


I would rather be free to defend myslef, then wait for the world to vote on it.


"You're kidding, right? How much guts does it take to send other people to get killed? "


Hate to break it to you but everyone in the service is there by choice.


"You mean with OBL still out there planning to kill us?


You are right, Clinton should have OKed him being taken out.

 

[Ickabod]

Ok, then when bullets start flying, you hitch your wagon to the guy who will take you running in the other direction, i'm hitching mine to Kerry.


I would rather be free to defend myslef, then wait for the world to vote on it.

Which ignores the context of the point you addressed. You're learning well from Bush.

"You're kidding, right? How much guts does it take to send other people to get killed? "


Hate to break it to you but everyone in the service is there by choice.

Once again, you have to reply with a statement that totally ignores the context of the statement you are addressing. Ignoring the truth doesn't make it go away. And so much for supporting the troops i guess.

"You mean with OBL still out there planning to kill us?


You are right, Clinton should have OKed him being taken out. [/B]

I think he did. 2 questions. 1)How many years of not getting OBL in a post 9/11 world does it take to trump not getting him in 8 years of a pre 9/11 world. And remember, before you answer, "9/11 changed everything".

2)Where does letting Zarqawi get away so Bush could keep a justification for going into Iraq compare next to not grabbing OBL from Sudan (assuming that's even true - but for sake of this argument, i'll give you the benefit of the doubt)? Especially given the fact that we are in a "9/11 changed everything" atmosphere?

Bush is so lousy at this game that he's actually supplanting Bill Clinton as my hero.

 

[papasmerf]

Have you ever arguied creationism over evelution???


Neither side shall be swayed. In that once a belief is established. That belief is not shakable.

 

[langeweile]

I think Bush did pull the trigger too fast on Iraq if for only one reason - he didn't have an exit plan better than being greeted by flowers.
I also think this is not only thing Bush pulls the trigger too fast on.


I don't think the exit strtegy is the problem. The problem lied in the assumption that the Iraqis would welcome their freedom.
We in the west have the notion that people want the same thing, that we want. Here in lies the miss calculation.
That's the same reason why foreign aid has mostly failed. It is always given under the premise, that they should adapt our way of live. We forget that we are a settler or agrarian society, while most people in Africa and the mideast are mainly nomads.
Their view on the world and their cultural values differ quiet a bit.
Why is it that with all the turmoil, the Iraqi people themselves haven't stepped up the plate and fought the terrorist.
Maybe they don't think that our definiton of freedom and democracy is the same their own?
Exit is not the problem..cultural understanding is.
Bye

 

[WoodPeckr]

...Maybe they don't think that our definiton of freedom and democracy is the same their own?
Exit is not the problem..cultural understanding is.
Bye

For one Iraqis have never lived with either freedom or democracy. As you know from personal experience, Herr langeweile, that is something that takes many years to develop....with the help of other countries, therefore Exit does become a problem. Unfortunately for those in Iraq, Bush does not strike most as being much of a 'nation builder.'


Sind Sie wirklich gebohrt,.... Herr langeweile?

Willkommen zum Brett.

 

[WoodPeckr]

Bush has put himself in a nasty box.
As long as he stays he is an occupier.
Staying out of the way will insure Iraq sinking into a civil war.

There is a possibility that civil war has already begun......