Yet you refuse to hold Arab states to account for their treatment of generations born in their countries. Shows a pretty clear bias against Israel that doesn't seem to apply anywhere else.
Bibi Wins, Two State Solution Dies?
- Thread starter onthebottom
- Start date
Seems the same kind of racist background GW posts with.Here's the way I see things:
Arabs: (and associated extremist muslims) are batshit crazy!!!
Jews: Are fairly stable. Kind of people you wanna build a country around
You might want to read the UN Convention on Refugees. No where in it do children of refuges get the same rights. In fact it requires host countries do have the obligation to allow refugees to be assimilated; something that most Arab states have refused to do for Palestinian refugees or their descendents.Only the ones who were born there ? so why the ones who are born in Europe have the right to return after 2000 years and not the ones whose fathers were displaced 60 years ago ?
And yes, recent history is filled with similar examples that you don't complain about. The Chinese occupation and settlement of Tibet is one. The ethnic cleansing and colonization done by ethnic Russians during the Soviet era would be another (the current crisis in Crimea and Easter Ukraine are a direct result of Russian settlement). There is even a little chunk of Russia in Europe that is part of Russia only because the Soviets forced out all ethnic Germans and replaced them with Russians. Greece and Turkey had a violent population exchange. India and Pakistan too. Several other parts of Europe would also count after each of the World Wars.
Yet your complaints come down to just one country. You have yet to explain why Israel deserves so much of your contempt but Arab states (amongst others) get a pass from you. Why is it that you insist that Palestinians born in the Occupied West Bank should be allowed to vote in Israel yet say nothing about Arabs born in Arab states not allowed even basic rights?
If those Cree or Ojibwes were born outside of Canadian territory then they would.Do crees and Ojibwes need to apply for Canadian citizenship?...
It's not automatic. There have been a number of cases where Jews were denied because of criminal history.Anyone foreign citizen outside of Israel who can simply prove that he's Jewish is automatically granted israeli citizenship upon arrival.
Another of your epic fails. Israel did not deport all of those Arabs. According to historians only a small number were actually forced out when their villages became actively involved in the war.Bullshit. Did Canada deport natives...
Jordan for starters. They annexed the West Bank. A significant number of West Bank Palestinians have Jordanian citizenship papers. Secondly the governments of Lebanon, Syria, etc. who have refused to abide by the UN Convention on refugees and keep them stateless.Who's responsible of the statelessness of those populations then ?...
Palestinians who come to Canada as refugees are integrated and now have the nationality of Canadian. Why don't Lebanese or Syrian born have those rights. Even more Abysmal is that Jordanian troops were standing on the border with Syrian these past few years refusing to allow refugees from Syria if they had Palestinian ancestry.
What a steaming pile. It was sensible to target South Africa for Apartheid because they were the only ones to practice it.So according to your logic the apartheid regime in south africa was morally justified because neighboring black countries had dictatorships.
This thread is about Israel not about human rights in Egypt or Jordan. Feel free to start another thread to talk about human rights abuse in Egypt or any other country but not divert any critics about Israel politics by bringing up other arab states issues.
Meanwhile here your argument is that Palestinians born in the West Bank should have the right to Israeli citizenship yet Palestinians born in Syria, Jordan, Lebanon, etc. don't have the right to citizenship in countries where they were actually born?
I could also ask why you don't spend much time complaining about Turkey's invasion, occupation, and ethnic cleansing of Northern Cyprus. Should we start a campaign because Greek Cypriots don't have the right to vote in Turkish elections?
So once again you go back to excusing Arab states and trying to cast blame on Israel.Only the ones born before 1967 ( which is a minority) have Jordanian citizenship, the majority is stateless . And Jordan no longer recognizes the west bank as a jordanian territory since it was invaded by Israel which should be held responsible of keeping these populations stateless
Yeah, that would be the same letter where Arafat claimed he renounced terrorism. :biggrin1:Bullshit Arafat already recognized Israel in 1993 twenty two years ago.
The fact is that Arafat was never prepared to accept Israel's existence as a Jewish state.
But no matter. We can disagree on the reasons for Arafat's actions, but it doesn't change the fact that the Palestinians were offered their own state, at two different times, and rejected both offers. Your claims that the Palestinians have been "denied" statehood are unequivocally wrong.
Sorry but Israel is a complete democracy. The Arab Supreme Court judge in charge of overseeing the elections would easily testify to that. You can try to lie about the West Bank residents being Israeli but neither the UN, the PA, nor any other official body considers the West Bank a part of Israel.Because there is no debate on what we agree. When you say that Egypt, Turkey etc .. don't respect human rights I cannot argue with that, but when you say that Israel is the only democracy in Middle east I have the right to disagree. And this thread isn't about Turkey/Cyprus
Again, Turkey doesn't respect human and minorities rights ( and denied membership of EU because of that), so that prove that Israel is democracy.
What's your point ? North Korea is a dictatorship , therefore china is a democracy ?
Absolutely. There are a million or so 'stateless Palestinians' living in Jordan and Jordan has been turning back refugees from Syria for their ancestry.Blame Jordan for what happened in west Bank after 1967 ? I'm having some trouble to follow you
If you think Palestinians deserve to vote in a country they weren't born in, why do you not think they deserve rights in the countries of their birth?
Wow. You keep throwing out excuses.Wrong. 80% of the population of Jordan are originally palestinians, you also contradicting yourself when you admitted that the ones in the west bank were granted Jordanian citizenship before 1967 and now you said that Jordan kept palestinian stateless
Are you suggesting to deport arabs from west bank east of Jordan river ? I'm having some trouble to follow you
There are two million or so West Bank Palestinians 'stateless' in Jordan because Jordan's government chooses to keep them that way.
I could also see criticism that Jordan is ruled by a clan of foreigners distinct from the original East Bank Palestinians but you won't go there.
That's it. Keep doing your best to avoid criticizing Arab treatment of Palestinians.
There are 2 million+ Palestinians living inside Jordan who are excluded from Jordanian rights and politics because their ancestors fled Israel in 1947/8. The vast majority of them were born in Jordan yet Jordan still forces them to live in camps and denies them full rights.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine_refugee_camps#Jordan
There are 2 million+ Palestinians living inside Jordan who are excluded from Jordanian rights and politics because their ancestors fled Israel in 1947/8. The vast majority of them were born in Jordan yet Jordan still forces them to live in camps and denies them full rights.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine_refugee_camps#Jordan
If they become fully Jordanian, how will they fight Israel? As the saying goes-the Arabs will fight Israel to the last Palestinian.That's it. Keep doing your best to avoid criticizing Arab treatment of Palestinians.
There are 2 million+ Palestinians living inside Jordan who are excluded from Jordanian rights and politics because their ancestors fled Israel in 1947/8. The vast majority of them were born in Jordan yet Jordan still forces them to live in camps and denies them full rights.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestine_refugee_camps#Jordan
Actually you should read it yourself. It says those who actually lived in Israel are refugees but their (male - no sexism there) descendents are eligible for aid.Another lie. This what the UN website says about palestinian refugees, it considers their children to be recognized also as refugees
http://www.unrwa.org/who-we-are
You should also check out http://www.unhcr.org/cgi-bin/texis/vtx/home. They are quite clear that refugee status only applies to refugees, not offspring. They are also quite clear that host nations are obligated to provide rights and opportunity for integration to refugees Arab states have refused to do that for the descendents of Palestinians.
Do you know how idiotic you look when you link to UNRWA and then ignore what they say?This is a list of refugees camps from the 50'S and 60'S, do you have any evidence that there 2 million people who are stateless in Jordan in 2015 ? All these refugees from the 50's that you listed became Jordanian citizens .Stop lying
It is UNRWA themselves who gave the details and the numbers. 2,097,338 people registered with them.
http://www.unrwa.org/where-we-work?...nrwa_fields__unrwa_fields_where_we_work_block
More significantly, your argument is that people born in the West Bank should be given Israeli citizenship because they were born in territory under Israeli occupation.
Meanwhile you seem to have no problem with Palestinians born in Jordan, Lebanon, or Syria being denied rights there.
p.s. lets ignore for a moment that their democratic view is they don't want to be Israeli - last poll I read has 71% opposed to a one state solution. http://www.pcpsr.org/sites/default/files/poll-54-Dec2014-English new.pdf
p.p.s. That same poll has a majority of Palestinians opposed to a two state peace as well. They don't want one state with equal rights for all. They don't want a two state peace alongside Israel. Pretty clear what option they are hoping for. The poll also has a majority supporting armed rebellion and rocket attacks that even Amnesty considers a war crime. One of my 'favourite' questions that their polls regularly ask is:
70) Concerning armed attacks against Israeli civilians inside Israel, I....
1) certainly support 22.0%
2) support 43.2%
3) oppose 28.4%
4) certainly oppose 3.4%
Yes, two thirds of Palestinians in the poll support attacking Israeli civilians.
Meanwhile you seem to have no problem with Palestinians born in Jordan, Lebanon, or Syria being denied rights there.
p.s. lets ignore for a moment that their democratic view is they don't want to be Israeli - last poll I read has 71% opposed to a one state solution. http://www.pcpsr.org/sites/default/files/poll-54-Dec2014-English new.pdf
p.p.s. That same poll has a majority of Palestinians opposed to a two state peace as well. They don't want one state with equal rights for all. They don't want a two state peace alongside Israel. Pretty clear what option they are hoping for. The poll also has a majority supporting armed rebellion and rocket attacks that even Amnesty considers a war crime. One of my 'favourite' questions that their polls regularly ask is:
70) Concerning armed attacks against Israeli civilians inside Israel, I....
1) certainly support 22.0%
2) support 43.2%
3) oppose 28.4%
4) certainly oppose 3.4%
Yes, two thirds of Palestinians in the poll support attacking Israeli civilians.
Do you ever run out of excuses? UNRWA's numbers show hundreds of thousands of Palestinians still stuck in camps. I guess 'closing' cases is your only way to avoid criticizing anyone except Israel.Do You ....
And yes, there are around half a million in Lebanon with essentially no rights. They are not allowed to purchase land. They are not allowed to work in many fields. They are not allowed access to health care (except through UNRWA). They are not allowed access to education (except through UNRWA)
"They do not enjoy several important rights; for example, they cannot work in as many as 20 professions. Because they are not formally citizens of another state, Palestine refugees are unable to claim the same rights as other foreigners living and working in Lebanon."
http://www.unrwa.org/where-we-work/lebanon
So why are you going to such great lengths to ignore the massive rights violations Palestinians get in Arab states and instead focus on 'rights' that the Palestinians clearly don't want?
