School Shooting In Minnesota With A Twist

[Phil C. McNasty]

"HIPAA database" lmfao.
And you are talking about me googling stuff?
There is nothing called a HIPAA database. Medical records are not maintained in any centralized repository in the US.
HIPAA does not prevent any federal agency from requiring health information for law enforcement, licensing etc.,
And I did not even propose something of that nature.
I said the person applying for the license should be given a psych eval at the time of application as part of the process.

I never said it was a central database.
Every hospital, medical centre, caregiver home...etc has their own database of patient information, which is protected by HIPAA.
The US nor State governments are allowed access to these databases, unless its for crimes committed or national security (the latter which is rare).

So again, how would you uncover the names of 47% of the US population who have mental illness and should, in your opinion, be denied firearms??

 

[cunning linguist]

Because you collect things designed to kill other humans - probable cause you are more likely to kill other humans.

That's no different from people who say certain races are more likely to commit crime.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

I never said it was a central database.
Every hospital, medical centre, caregiver home...etc has their own database of patient information, which is protected by HIPAA.
The US nor State governments are allowed access to these databases, unless its for crimes committed or national security (the latter which is rare).

So again, how would you uncover the names of 47% of the US population who have mental illness and should, in your opinion, be denied firearms??

Yes and I did not propose government agencies accessing them in any case even if HIPAA does not protect you if an agency were to request information for certain reasons - such as licensing, law enforcement, national security - all of which guns fall under.
I proposed that a psych eval should be given at the time of applying for a gun license and subsequently during renewals.
So you are talking about something I did not even propose.

 

[Frankfooter]

That's no different from people who say certain races are more likely to commit crime.

Its very different.
People who collect records are more likely to play records.
People who collect guns are more likely to shoot.

That has nothing to do with race.

 

[cunning linguist]

Its very different.
People who collect records are more likely to play records.
People who collect guns are more likely to shoot.

That has nothing to do with race.

Yes, it's different.

Go to any shooting range and every member has a clean criminal record and are screened daily.

Can you say the same thing when you go to a basketball court?

 

[Frankfooter]

Yes, it's different.

Go to any shooting range and every member has a clean criminal record and are screened daily.

Can you say the same thing when you go to a basketball court?

Basketball courts?
Really?
You went there?

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

Yes and I did not propose government agencies accessing them in any case even if HIPAA does not protect you if an agency were to request information for certain reasons - such as licensing, law enforcement, national security - all of which guns fall under.
I proposed that a psych eval should be given at the time of applying for a gun license and subsequently during renewals.
So you are talking about something I did not even propose

Okay, so you want psych evaluations for everyone who wants to buy a gun.
Approximately 1 in 3 Americans currently owns a gun. The household ownership of firearms is close to 50%.
So you want to mentally evaluate 1/3 of the US (at minimum), which is around 110 million people.

You realize thats almost impossible to do, right??

First of all if someone really wants a gun they will lie on their test.
They will just say no, I am not bipolar or depressed.
Then what are you gonna do?? You cant check their medical records., so you have to accept them at their word.

And then if you do deny some people the government can expect to get sued, because you're denying them their 2nd amendment, and if it goes to court they will win.
Their argument will be, so what if I'm bipolar, shouldnt I be able to protect myself against burglars just like everyone else??

I dont think you've though this through, Shaq.
Its not as easy as you think it is

 

[Frankfooter]

Okay, so you want psych evaluations for everyone who wants to buy a gun.
Approximately 1 in 3 Americans currently owns a gun. The household ownership of firearms is close to 50%.
So you want to mentally evaluate 1/3 of the US (at minimum), which is around 110 million people.

You realize thats almost impossible to do, right??

First of all if someone really wants a gun they will lie on their test.
They will just say no, I am not bipolar or depressed.
Then what are you gonna do?? You cant check their medical records., so you have to accept them at their word.

And then if you do deny some people the government can expect to get sued, because you're denying them their 2nd amendment, and if it goes to court they will win.
Their argument will be, so what if I'm bipolar, shouldnt I be able to protect myself against burglars just like everyone else??

I dont think you've though this through, Shaq.
Its not as easy as you think it is

If they lie, treat them like Hunter Biden.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

Okay, so you want psych evaluations for everyone who wants to buy a gun.
Approximately 1 in 3 Americans currently owns a gun. The household ownership of firearms is close to 50%.
So you want to mentally evaluate 1/3 of the US (at minimum), which is around 110 million people.
You realize thats almost impossible to do, right??
First of all if someone really wants a gun they will lie on their test.
They will just say no, I am not bipolar or depressed.
Then what are you gonna do??

I said you get them to take a psych eval test when they apply for a license.
Not ask them.
92% of Americans own a car and each and every one of them is tested.
It is totally doable for guns as the number of gun owners is much less than the number of car owners.

You cant check their medical records., so you have to accept them at their word.

HIPAA isn't blanket protection.
Yes, a government agency can request medical records if they do need to.
HIPAA does not protect your privacy if another law requires disclosure of your health and fitness.

https://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/for-individuals/guidance-materials-for-consumers/index.html

Who Is Not Required to Follow These Laws
Many organizations that have health information about you do not have to follow these laws.
Examples of organizations that do not have to follow the Privacy and Security Rules include:

• Life insurers
• Employers
• Workers compensation carriers
• Most schools and school districts
• Many state agencies like child protective service agencies
• Most law enforcement agencies
• Many municipal offices

And then if you do deny some people the government can expect to get sued, because you're denying them their 2nd amendment, and if it goes to court they will win.
Their argument will be, so what if I'm bipolar, shouldnt I be able to protect myself against burglars just like everyone else??

No, they won't win.
Current state and federal law prevents former convicted criminals from possessing weapons.
Current state and federal law also prevents mentally ill from possessing weapons.
These laws are already in place, so nothing new.
So they won't win in court if they use the 2A argument.

https://www.ncsl.org/civil-and-criminal-justice/possession-of-firearms-by-people-with-mental-illness

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

I said you get them to take a psych eval test when they apply for a license.
Not ask them.
92% of Americans own a car and each and every one of them is tested.
It is totally doable for guns as the number of gun owners is much less than the number of car owners.

HIPAA isn't blanket protection.
Yes, a government agency can request medical records if they do need to.
HIPAA does not protect your privacy if another law requires disclosure of your health and fitness.

https://www.hhs.gov/hipaa/for-individuals/guidance-materials-for-consumers/index.html

No, they won't win.
Current state and federal law prevents former convicted criminals from possessing weapons.
Current state and federal law also prevents mentally ill from possessing weapons.
These laws are already in place, so nothing new.
So they won't win in court if they use the 2A argument.

https://www.ncsl.org/civil-and-criminal-justice/possession-of-firearms-by-people-with-mental-illness

Actually they will win if citizens use the 2nd amendment argument.

You havent thought this through, Shaq

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

Actually they will win if citizens use the 2nd amendment argument.
You havent thought this through, Shaq

Current law prevents them from owning weapons and I don't see anybody wining anything.
You are now stuck on your usual repeat mode until you get the last post in after losing the argument lmfao. So have at it.

 

[Frankfooter]

Actually they will win if citizens use the 2nd amendment argument.

You havent thought this through, Shaq

You think the 2nd amendment means criminals are allowed to own guns?

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

Current law prevents them from owning weapons and I don't see anybody wining anything.
You are now stuck on your usual repeat mode until you get the last post in after losing the argument lmfao. So have at it

And how does a gun store owner assess that a customer who wants to buy a gun is somebody with mental health issues??

Walk me through the process how he or she would do that

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

And how does a gun store owner assess that a customer who wants to buy a gun is somebody with mental health issues??
Walk me through the process how he or she would do that

You don't read my posts?
I said a gun license issuance should involve a psych evaluation as part of the process, not a gun purchase.
Gun stores don't issue licenses.

 

[Phil C. McNasty]

You don't read my posts?
I said a gun license issuance should involve a psych evaluation as part of the process, not a gun purchase.
Gun stores don't issue licenses

And you think that some guy who wants to shoot up a school is going to answer the psych test honestly and tell the interviewer he's bipolar??

 

[richaceg]

You don't read my posts?
I said a gun license issuance should involve a psych evaluation as part of the process, not a gun purchase.
Gun stores don't issue licenses.

a guy who has intent to shoot a school full of kids isnt' gonna apply for a license, he will obtain that weapon illegaly...this logic you guys think that somehow gun control will solve crime magically is the dumbest take on this matter...

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

And you think that some guy who wants to shoot up a school is going to answer the psych test honestly and tell the interviewer he's bipolar??

Psych eval tests are not questionnaires.

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

a guy who has intent to shoot a school full of kids isnt' gonna apply for a license, he will obtain that weapon illegaly...

No.
The majority of the guns used in school shootings are legally acquired.

 

[Frankfooter]

a guy who has intent to shoot a school full of kids isnt' gonna apply for a license, he will obtain that weapon illegaly...this logic you guys think that somehow gun control will solve crime magically is the dumbest take on this matter...

So does this mean you think there should be no gun licenses or rules so everyone can get guns to defend themselves from everyone else with guns?
Somehow you think that the NRA fantasy of turning the US into a country with everyone armed will be more safe.

 

[richaceg]

No.
The majority of the guns used in school shootings are legally acquired.

used by the owner?