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Elon Musk dismantles USAID

Leimonis

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Feb 28, 2020
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WyattEarp

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May 17, 2017
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I would rather call it corruption and abuse of power.
Your entire case rests on the fact that you dont find the government transparent and therefore you believe whatever Elon tells you.
In short you are just as much, in the dark now as you were before.
No, that's not at all what I am saying. You said Elon's role isn't transparent. That was my response to your point.

My argument is that the President of the United States has certain authorities to review and make decisions on expenditures. He also has the authority to appoint and hire people to act in his name.

The abuse of power you are concerned about is a matter for the courts and/or Congress.

PS- I don't think your use of the word corruption is applied properly.
 

Shaquille Oatmeal

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Jun 2, 2023
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My argument is that the President of the United States has certain authorities to review and make decisions on expenditures. He also has the authority to appoint and hire people to act in his name.

The abuse of power you are concerned about is a matter for the courts and/or Congress.
Yes and using such authority to hire someone to work without transparency, protocol or oversight is abuse of power and corruption.
I think the word is applied properly.
 
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Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
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mandrill, Valcazar, Shaq, etc. listen to me, Trump is the Chief Executive of the United States of America. These are normal executive decisions.
Wrong.
These are not and it is willful blindness by you to say so.
These may not even be Trump's decisions, as you know.

No one in the executive branch has the legal authority to unilaterally cancel congressional appropriations.
Taking over the Treasury payments system and using it as a means of political retribution is not something that is a normal executive decision.
Summarily dismissing civil servants without cause is not a normal executive decision, they don't have the authority.
The "fork in the road" letters offering fake "buyouts" that aren't appropriated funds isn't something they have the authority to do.
Can't take down and scrub government websites of public data - don't have the authority.

He's got limited time while the Democrats and the liberal media proclaim this is some travesty and an affront to Democracy.
Because it is.

I have no idea what they are beefing about.
That seems odd, though, because despite our differences, I didn't peg you for someone who is in favor of wanton abuse of executive power.

If expenditures are valid and the current Congress approves of them, they can be reinstated fairly quickly. We do have a $1.7 billion dollar deficit to consider.
Congress has approved them.
The executive doesn't have the right to cancel shit and steal it for its own purposes and only re-instate the ones their new pet Congress approves of.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
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Let me get this straight. You want to keep Musk, Trump and the American public away from the business records of the United States, but you are worried that their communications are outside the authority of a FOIA.
Of course I'm worried about them explicitly telling DOGE to not use slack so that their communications can't be FOIA'd.
You are not concerned by the blatant "Look, we can't allow the people to find out what we are doing or planning"?

And yes, Musk needs to be kept away from Government systems.
If he wants to do an audit, he should do an audit.
You know, not illegally seize systems and start rewriting code.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
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Acting aggressively for optics without thought or protocol is useless and harmful.
And Elon is not an auditor of government programs.
He knows nothing about these programs and therefore there needs to be an established process for it.
Transparency goes both ways.
There needs to be transparency on what Elon is dong, how he is making decisions, what data is exposed to him, and on the impacts of whatever he is cutting.
Wyatt seems to be very much against the idea of government accountability like that.
Far better to have unaccountable moves by diktat.
 
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Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
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Indeed.
We warned people about the autocratic risk and people didn't listen.
Therefore it is in every citizen's interest to do what they can to resist with the tools still available to us.

I think you simply object to Musk on a personal level. Let's be real. You are always complaining about any public person who stands up against or in the way of progressives. The more aggressive they are the more you complain.

This is the nature of politics. You have to let go.
I don't simply object to Musk on a personal level.
(I do object to him on a personal level, he is rather odious.)

Yes, this is the nature of politics.
Power grabs by the executive and oligarchs are part of politics.
So is resisting these abuses.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
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What I hear is I don't like the Executive so I don't want him managing the Federal government.

I think the Courts will establish boundaries like they are and they will deem certain actions and activities within the normal authority of the Executive (POTUS).
The courts will get involved, yes.
We will see a lot about how the judiciary is positioned and how willing Trump and Musk are to just ignore it when it is inconvenient.
We've already seen the Republican congress go supine and submissive.
Of course, one of the reasons for all the illegal, secretive, and very fast moves is to get facts on the ground that make the court rulings irrelevant if possible.
 
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Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
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Should we have another national vote on each item? A line item referendum on the $7 trillion dollar Federal budget.

You don't really understand the concept of our Executive Branch and who heads it. Maybe you do and you merely don't like our President.
Are we asserting a line item veto now?
 

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
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I think you simply object to Musk on a personal level. Let's be real. You are always complaining about any public person who stands up against or in the way of progressives. The more aggressive they are the more you complain.

This is the nature of politics. You have to let go.
Maybe he just doesn't like unelected poobahs appointed to positions that they are unqualified to fill because of massive campaign contributions and much ass-licking. 😯
 
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mandrill

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Who do you think does the leg work for the Big 4 audit firms?
Yes, but they work for specialist organizations and are specifically selected and trained to do the very job that they perform.

And the role and ambit of a corporate auditor are well established.

And there is no political agenda involved. Just book-keeping.

And everyone knows and expects these audits to occur and they are not a political exercise.

And there are well-established and time-tested professional standards of ethics, procedure and competence applied.

You want me to keep thinking of differences?
mandrill, Valcazar, Shaq, etc. listen to me, Trump is the Chief Executive of the United States of America. These are normal executive decisions. He's got limited time while the Democrats and the liberal media proclaim this is some travesty and an affront to Democracy. I have no idea what they are beefing about.

If expenditures are valid and the current Congress approves of them, they can be reinstated fairly quickly. We do have a $1.7 billion dollar deficit to consider.
In the last 3 weeks, the fartus in chief has axed well established US humanitarian / soft power projection tools with no discussion beforehand. This is the same doofus-in-chief who had to suck back in his own turds with the tariff horseshit and got overturned on the 14A EO nonsense.

These are not normal executive decisions. NONE of this crap are "normal executive decisions".

I know you yearn for a little win on the board after all the reverses since Trump took office. But ffs, read back over all the silly arguments you've just written and think long and hard!
 
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WyattEarp

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May 17, 2017
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Yes and using such authority to hire someone to work without transparency, protocol or oversight is abuse of power and corruption.
I think the word is applied properly.
It's a weak use of a word that is generally meant to describe abusing power and authority for personal gain.
 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
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Trump has started a revolution, it’s underway, and I am 100% here for it.
Be careful what you wish for.

trump will fuck over the cult with disdain whenever it suits him. He'll dump you by the wayside just like every person who worked for him that either he stiffed them or they ended up in jail. Open your eyes.

Yeah, reminds of 2 symptoms of tDS that I've listed a number of times:

1)an unfailing belief that trump cares about you
2)an inability to see the reality that is right in front of their faces

Every time one of you cultists posts you unfailingly exhibit one or more traits of tDS, trump Devotee Syndrome.

You are correct that it is a phenomenon rarely seen before in history.
 
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