How the Democrats are anti Democracy.

[bver_hunter]

The fact you think an endorsement by Cheney, is a good thing, says it all.

No wars were started under Trump. That's a fact. Deal with it. Why do you think a war mongering like Cheney endorsed Harris? Sounds to me she will be starting more.

You are hilarious especially as someone like RF Kennedy endorsed Trump. Yes, the one that was instrumental in his Conspiracy Theories about the Covid-19 Vaccine, Mass Shootings are linked to prescription drugs, the 2004 Presidential Election was Stolen, The CIA was involved in John Kennedy's assassination, The Pharma are funding the Democrats, Gun Ownerships, Vaccines can cause autism, and the list goes on and on. No wonder that even his own relatives disowned him and he appeals only to the Trump base!!

RFK Jr.’s Conspiracy Theories: Here’s What Trump’s Pick For Health Secretary Has Promoted

Kennedy Jr. suggested that the COVID-19 virus was engineered to give Chinese and Ashkenazi Jewish people immunity.

www.forbes.com

But what why dub Liz Cheney as a "warmonger"? Did she start any wars? Guess you took it out of Trump's story book when he called her "a low IQ war hawk'!!

The Russia invasion of Ukraine was preplanned well in advance according to the Intel Agencies. We know that Putin would not have invaded Ukraine prior to 2018, as Russia was hosting the FIFA World Cup. They were originally intending to host it in 2022, but then mysteriously pulled out of it and instead won the bid to host it in 2018. No way Putin was going to get involved in any wars prior to this World Cup. Then with China involved with the Winter Olympics in 2021, meant that Putin help off until the games ended and within a few days after it, started the war in Ukraine. No wonder that he was the only major world leader to be at Xi's side during the Winter Olympics in Beijing!!

But Trump was unique in being the only President that almost started a Civil War with his January 6th Incitement to an insurrection. Definitely, a threat to Democracy. Otherwise, why would he say very recently that if he is not elected as a President, then this will be the last elections. Something repeated by Elon Musk!!

 

[Butler1000]

You are hilarious especially as someone like RF Kennedy endorsed Trump. Yes, the one that was instrumental in his Conspiracy Theories about the Covid-19 Vaccine, Mass Shootings are linked to prescription drugs, the 2004 Presidential Election was Stolen, The CIA was involved in John Kennedy's assassination, The Pharma are funding the Democrats, Gun Ownerships, Vaccines can cause autism, and the list goes on and on. No wonder that even his own relatives disowned him and he appeals only to the Trump base!!

RFK Jr.’s Conspiracy Theories: Here’s What Trump’s Pick For Health Secretary Has Promoted

Kennedy Jr. suggested that the COVID-19 virus was engineered to give Chinese and Ashkenazi Jewish people immunity.

www.forbes.com

But what why dub Liz Cheney as a "warmonger"? Did she start any wars? Guess you took it out of Trump's story book when he called her "a low IQ war hawk'!!

The Russia invasion of Ukraine was preplanned well in advance according to the Intel Agencies. We know that Putin would not have invaded Ukraine prior to 2018, as Russia was hosting the FIFA World Cup. They were originally intending to host it in 2022, but then mysteriously pulled out of it and instead won the bid to host it in 2018. No way Putin was going to get involved in any wars prior to this World Cup. Then with China involved with the Winter Olympics in 2021, meant that Putin help off until the games ended and within a few days after it, started the war in Ukraine. No wonder that he was the only major world leader to be at Xi's side during the Winter Olympics in Beijing!!

But Trump was unique in being the only President that almost started a Civil War with his January 6th Incitement to an insurrection. Definitely, a threat to Democracy. Otherwise, why would he say very recently that if he is not elected as a President, then this will be the last elections. Something repeated by Elon Musk!!

Her father is the war criminal. She 100% agrees and defends him. He has endorsed her.

 

[silentkisser]

When Joe Biden announced he would would only have a woman of colour as his VP, that is the definition of a DEI hire, as it means he would not consider other candidates, and that race and sex were the first and primary qualifications.

As for Alcoholic, even SNL was mocking this. She is, imo a functioning Alcoholic. I think the pressure has gotten to her.

Trump did not sing the playbook. He did end up following most of it, but he was anti war and stayed that way, protectionist on trade which was not the GOP playbook at the time. Which along with immigration are three of the highest polling policy concerns. And in case you don't remember every single opponent was pushed as the one to beat him, almost on a weekly basis, as they sought to get rid of him.

The continued line of the old establishment GOP has always been "HE COOPTED THE PARTY". That screams outsider. When the Cheney's are campaigning against you, that is a sign you can't deny.

Trump is an ass, no doubt, but his messaging on anti war, economic policy, immigration policy resonated. He was, after Obama, the next push to kill the Neo-Liberal concencus in Washington. Represented by Clinton. Both of whom beat her.

And in comparing Stein RFK and Trump, it might be apples and oranges, but they both are fruit, grow in trees, taste sweet. They are just different flavors.

Dude, the whole alcoholic thing is a fucking joke. There are no credible sources who say this shit. Only right-wing trolls. So, if you believe that, everything else you spew is probably utter bullshit. It's hilarious that you would believe this sort of shit, but doubt negative stuff about Trump, even if you say he's an ass.

 

[Butler1000]

Dude, the whole alcoholic thing is a fucking joke. There are no credible sources who say this shit. Only right-wing trolls. So, if you believe that, everything else you spew is probably utter bullshit. It's hilarious that you would believe this sort of shit, but doubt negative stuff about Trump, even if you say he's an ass.

I believe it may be true because as a bartender for a long while she has wine/vodka mom mannerisms and speaking type, and has been erratic enough in unscripted events, that there is real cause to consider it.

And let's face it, if the press was willing to hide the cognitive disfunction of Biden and signs of senility, as are his staff, until it was so blatantly obvious they had to remove him from contention, I can see desperation with another bad choice leading to more cover ups.

They are the ones through their actions that lead to this. And SNL mock through parody and the truth, it's their hallmark.

 

[bver_hunter]

Her father is the war criminal. She 100% agrees and defends him. He has endorsed her.

The Republican Party with George Bush as President was the biggest war monger indecent USA History. All Republicans and some Democrats supported the invasion of Iraq. Does that make all of them "war mongers"? Trump on the other hand is the first President in recent times that almost started a civil war in the USA. His insurrection encouragement on Jan.6th was irresponsible and he has blood on his hands with those who lost their lives at his beckoning. Liz Cheney could have been one of them along with Mike Pence!!

 

[Butler1000]

The Republican Party with George Bush as President was the biggest war monger indecent USA History. All Republicans and some Democrats supported the invasion of Iraq. Does that make all of them "war mongers"? Trump on the other hand is the first President in recent times that almost started a civil war in the USA. His insurrection encouragement on Jan.6th was irresponsible and he has blood on his hands with those who lost their lives at his beckoning. Liz Cheney could have been one of them along with Mike Pence!!

Yes. They are. Are you justifying the Iraq war now?

 

[bver_hunter]

Yes. They are. Are you justifying the Iraq war now?

Listen butler, if those who supported the Iraq war were fed with some false Intel from the Republican Bush administration, then that is where the fault lies.
I have always condemned the Iraq war, especially as our own PM at the time called Chretien refused to commit the Canadian forces as he was not provided the evidence that he demanded.
Maybe you praised Harper for his partisan condemnation of Chretien's actions and threw his support. behind Bush in this respect. But why slander Liz Cheney as a War criminal? But you praise the JFK Junior individual who was full of Conspiracy Theories that even Kamala Harris refused to have him in her future cabinet, as it will be a taint on her Government with him in it!!

 

[Butler1000]

Listen butler, if those who supported the Iraq war were fed with some false Intel from the Republican Bush administration, then that is where the fault lies.
I have always condemned the Iraq war, especially as our own PM at the time called Chretien refused to commit the Canadian forces as he was not provided the evidence that he demanded.
Maybe you praised Harper for his partisan condemnation of Chretien's actions and threw his support. behind Bush in this respect. But why slander Liz Cheney as a War criminal? But you praise the JFK Junior individual who was full of Conspiracy Theories that even Kamala Harris refused to have him in her future cabinet, as it will be a taint on her Government with him in it!!

Dick Cheney wasn't fed false information. He created it. And his daughter knows this and still says the war was justified.

Harper? Nothing to do with this.

The Cheney family support starting wars in the middle east. It's that simple. She does too. Thankfully her power was quelled.

If Harris had any ethics she would reject the endorsement.

Btw I never supported RFK, just his right to run. A distinction you can't accept.

 

[bver_hunter]

Dick Cheney wasn't fed false information. He created it. And his daughter knows this and still says the war was justified.

Harper? Nothing to do with this.

The Cheney family support starting wars in the middle east. It's that simple. She does too. Thankfully her power was quelled.

If Harris had any ethics she would reject the endorsement.

Btw I never supported RFK, just his right to run. A distinction you can't accept.

Listen, the whole corrupt Bush Administration was responsible for the Iraq invasion based on some flawed Intel advice.
But Liz Cheney spoke up against Trump's attempts to overturn the 2020 Elections with that violent Jan. 6th Insurrection.
Don't you give her credit for it? Especially as she had nothing to do with the Iraq Invasion. Yet it was Harper who endorsed it and was attacking Chretien for refusing to commit the Canadian armed forces to it. But you say that Harper had nothing to do with it and Liz Cheney was responsible for that war. Your logic!!

But you loved the RFK "sweet flavour", especially as he was the one to push all sorts of conspiracy theories as I showed you. :

And in comparing Stein RFK and Trump, it might be apples and oranges, but they both are fruit, grow in trees, taste sweet. They are just different flavors.

RFK is also blaming the USA for causing the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Not surprising that he cozys up with Trump:

https://www.newsweek.com/robert-f-kennedy-jr-ukraine-russia-war-fox-news-fact-check-1815994

 

[Lenny59]

Dick Cheney wasn't fed false information. He created it. And his daughter knows this and still says the war was justified.

Harper? Nothing to do with this.

The Cheney family support starting wars in the middle east. It's that simple. She does too. Thankfully her power was quelled.

If Harris had any ethics she would reject the endorsement.

Btw I never supported RFK, just his right to run. A distinction you can't accept.

Dick Cheney voting for Kamala Harris: https://nypost.com/2024/09/06/us-news/former-gop-vice-president-dick-cheney-will-vote-for-kamala-harris/

Kamala Harris's gushing tribute to Dick Cheney backfires spectacularly: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13925145/Kamala-Harris-Dick-Cheney-Liz-Cheney-campaign.html

 

[Butler1000]

Listen, the whole corrupt Bush Administration was responsible for the Iraq invasion based on some flawed Intel advice.
But Liz Cheney spoke up against Trump's attempts to overturn the 2020 Elections with that violent Jan. 6th Insurrection.
Don't you give her credit for it? Especially as she had nothing to do with the Iraq Invasion. Yet it was Harper who endorsed it and was attacking Chretien for refusing to commit the Canadian armed forces to it. But you say that Harper had nothing to do with it and Liz Cheney was responsible for that war. Your logic!!

But you loved the RFK "sweet flavour", especially as he was the one to push all sorts of conspiracy theories as I showed you. :



RFK is also blaming the USA for causing the Russian invasion of Ukraine. Not surprising that he cozys up with Trump:

https://www.newsweek.com/robert-f-kennedy-jr-ukraine-russia-war-fox-news-fact-check-1815994

You are comparing two different things. An illegal war that cost a trillion dollars, hundreds of thousands of lives and more affected. Created ISIS, and was a factor in spreading more instability in Syria. It was all based off of a false premise. Dick Cheney was an architect of this, his daughter fully supports it.

And btw it was Trump’s attack on the Bush family, in the debates, calling out Jeb Bush, othe GOP for support of the war, that launched his campaign and was a major factor in his winning.

Vs a protest that got out of hand, what 1 death? Complete failure otherwise, as the election was upheld, the the rioters imprisoned.

Really they are equal in your eyes?

And the argument, while certainly not the deciding factor, of NATO encroachment on the borders of Russia, is valid. I personally think David Zahn has a far better take on the reasons why, most of which involve the collapse of the Russian nation within 10 years, Putin's ambition, and natural resources in Ukraine.

But it's a reason that is legit, just as when Russia tried to placed missiles in Cuba it was considered a threat and provoked the crisis then.

Bver, try harder, that was weak, even for you

 

[bver_hunter]

You are comparing two different things. An illegal war that cost a trillion dollars, hundreds of thousands of lives and more affected. Created ISIS, and was a factor in spreading more instability in Syria. It was all based off of a false premise. Dick Cheney was an architect of this, his daughter fully supports it.

And btw it was Trump’s attack on the Bush family, in the debates, calling out Jeb Bush, othe GOP for support of the war, that launched his campaign and was a major factor in his winning.

Vs a protest that got out of hand, what 1 death? Complete failure otherwise, as the election was upheld, the the rioters imprisoned.

Really they are equal in your eyes?

And the argument, while certainly not the deciding factor, of NATO encroachment on the borders of Russia, is valid. I personally think David Zahn has a far better take on the reasons why, most of which involve the collapse of the Russian nation within 10 years, Putin's ambition, and natural resources in Ukraine.

But it's a reason that is legit, just as when Russia tried to placed missiles in Cuba it was considered a threat and provoked the crisis then.

Bver, try harder, that was weak, even for you

Once again try to comprehend that the Iraq War was a screw up by The Republicans under Bush. That had nothing to do with Liz Cheney, though she supported the invasion just like all The Republicans as well as some Democrats. so if you call Liz Cheney a War Monger or whatever, then call all the Republicans exactly the same thing. Also include Harper as he was the one as Opposition Leader that supported Bush in this respect!! But Trump was the one that supported the invasion at that time. It was only after the war did he walk that back. So what is your point? We know that he desperately tried to lie that he opposed it and only his usual cult followers believe his Fairy Tales. His condemnation of Bush during the 2016 Elections was solely for his political purposes!!

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/29/politics/fact-check-trump-false-claim-opposed-iraq-invasion/index.html

Once again if those former Soviet Union Nations want to disassociate themselves from Russia and do not trust Putin to the core, then they have a very valid reason as Putin has proven himself to be a rogue leader of Russia that wants to annex large swats of Ukraine and install a puppet leader. Now NATO have kept their side of their promise not to admit Ukraine into NATO. However comparing the installation of NUCLEAR MISSILES in Cuba versus just arming Ukraine to DEFEND itself is like comparing apples to crumbs!!

Butler try harder as you are going at a tangent, as your arguments are just plain flat, especially as you denied that you praised JFK, but I debunked that by posting your contradiction!!

 

[Butler1000]

Once again try to comprehend that the Iraq War was a screw up by The Republicans under Bush. That had nothing to do with Liz Cheney, though she supported the invasion just like all The Republicans as well as some Democrats. so if you call Liz Cheney a War Monger or whatever, then call all the Republicans exactly the same thing. Also include Harper as he was the one as Opposition Leader that supported Bush in this respect!! But Trump was the one that supported the invasion at that time. It was only after the war did he walk that back. So what is your point? We know that he desperately tried to lie that he opposed it and only his usual cult followers believe his Fairy Tales. His condemnation of Bush during the 2016 Elections was solely for his political purposes!!

https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/29/politics/fact-check-trump-false-claim-opposed-iraq-invasion/index.html

Once again if those former Soviet Union Nations want to disassociate themselves from Russia and do not trust Putin to the core, then they have a very valid reason as Putin has proven himself to be a rogue leader of Russia that wants to annex large swats of Ukraine and install a puppet leader. Now NATO have kept their side of their promise not to admit Ukraine into NATO. However comparing the installation of NUCLEAR MISSILES in Cuba versus just arming Ukraine to DEFEND itself is like comparing apples to crumbs!!

Butler try harder as you are going at a tangent, as your arguments are just plain flat, especially as you denied that you praised JFK, but I debunked that by posting your contradiction!!

Bver.....

You admitted they gave false information to the public. The "they" includes Dick Cheney. The "public" at that time included Trump, Harper and most of the world.

And that is the difference.

And Having a nation on your border, as a NATO member with foreign troops stationed, foreign planes and troop transports, is a threat. This is not condoning Russia. I fully support Ukraine. But it's not black and white, and the USA is not benign here.

And what's wrong with John F Kennedy?

 

[bver_hunter]

Bver.....

You admitted they gave false information to the public. The "they" includes Dick Cheney. The "public" at that time included Trump, Harper and most of the world.

And that is the difference.

And Having a nation on your border, as a NATO member with foreign troops stationed, foreign planes and troop transports, is a threat. This is not condoning Russia. I fully support Ukraine. But it's not black and white, and the USA is not benign here.

And what's wrong with John F Kennedy?

Butler, read all the investigations into this Weapons of Mass Destruction. They point to the Intel Agencies making the seriously flawed presumptions. But the whole Republican Government should take the blame as well. Trump supported it 100% as did Harper. Chretien got it 100% right when he refused to commit the Canadian troops as he wanted to see the real proof. Something Harper was condemning him for at that time. But blaming Liz Cheney is like blaming Ivanka for the January 6th Insurrection!!

I posted all the flaws with John F. Kennedy. You want me to repeat the same arguments, with his multiple Conspiracy Theories, that even his close family members distanced themselves from him!!

 

[Butler1000]

Butler, read all the investigations into this Weapons of Mass Destruction. They point to the Intel Agencies making the seriously flawed presumptions. But the whole Republican Government should take the blame as well. Trump supported it 100% as did Harper. Chretien got it 100% right when he refused to commit the Canadian troops as he wanted to see the real proof. Something Harper was condemning him for at that time. But blaming Liz Cheney is like blaming Ivanka for the January 6th Insurrection!!

I posted all the flaws with John F. Kennedy. You want me to repeat the same arguments, with his multiple Conspiracy Theories, that even his close family members distanced themselves from him!!

Of course I blame all the GOP. That includes Cheney at the top of the list.

And Harris has embraced his endorsement. And that also means she shares his policy values.

She can lie all she wants. But the administration she is in is sending 100's of billions in arms overseas. And she is supporting it.

Do you mean ROBERT KENNEDY Jr? Because his uncle is quite dead, as is his cousin.

 

[Bucktee]

Democrats love war. They're the neocons of our time.

The harpies on The View are indistinguishable from Cheney, Bush, Graham, and Rumsfeld supporters - men who are all war criminals.

None of these coddled creatures would ever take up arms themselves, but they love sending American boys overseas to get killed.

 

[wigglee]

If you think Trump is pro democracy, you are insane. And don't give us the old bullshit about you supporting some 3rd party that doesn't stand a chance - you're shilling for the Lyin' King who can't put 2 coherent sentences together.

 

[Butler1000]

If you think Trump is pro democracy, you are insane. And don't give us the old bullshit about you supporting some 3rd party that doesn't stand a chance - you're shilling for the Lyin' King who can't put 2 coherent sentences together.

You do realize it is possible for both parties to not want a 3rd party to have a chance right? All I did was point out facts of the Democratic Party using the courts and other dirty tricks to do just that.

Why do you have an issue with the truth?

 

[Valcazar]

The biggest issue with the US is the two-party system. But, it sure looks like both the GOP and Dems want to keep the status quo. Stein had literally no shot of winning anything (just like RFK), but could divert some votes from Dems and help Trump.

Stein has no interest in trying to fix the two-party system.
The current set up supports her needs just fine.

It would be interesting to see what would happen if there was another couple of parties out there with legit shots of putting members in congress of the White House. Hell, it could happen if Trump loses and the GOP tries to recalibrate more to the centre. Who's to say they wouldn't have a split where the MAGAts form a new ultra conservative party and the GOP moderates to classical conservatism...I'd be interested in seeing how that plays out.

A third party putting a member in the White House is virtually impossible in the current set up and no current minor party is seriously trying to do so.

Putting members in Congress would be feasible.
The GOP splitting could produce some of that, especially if the split was largely on regional lines. (The only way it would work.)

Getting a regional base that has a different two party system is the only way this happens.
Somewhere that is deep red or deep blue and getting the party that has no shot there to drop out and let someone else fill that space (like in Vermont, where the Democrats don't challenge Sanders) or otherwise have it not be very close.
Or, like in Maine, reform the voting system. (IRV in Maine probably helps Agnus King stay where he is.)

But get a solid regional base where people have a different second party and you can get some traction.

Once that's established, maybe you can start trying to reach out nationally.

But the real solution is reform of the electoral system, which unfortunately tends to be a hard sell. Entrenched power centres don't want change and lots of people don't understand how the systems work and so are easy to distract or scare off.

 

[Valcazar]

Did they do anything illegal?

No. But the current ballot access laws are pretty shitty.
Even if I am against plurality-winner voting and am well aware of the perverse effects of minor parties within that system, lots of states have really shitty systems for ballot access.
Sure, the Green Party is sloppy about ballot access in general and often screws itself, but that the rules are written to make it harder to get on than it need be is common.

That said, as long as the system is so susceptible to additional candidates, both parties are going to make legal maneuvers in response to every party's attempt to get on or off the ballot.