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The Great Debate

Who won the great debate?

  • Harris

    Votes: 77 78.6%
  • Trump

    Votes: 9 9.2%
  • Both were bad with no winner

    Votes: 10 10.2%
  • Both were good with no winner

    Votes: 2 2.0%

  • Total voters
    98

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
35,466
68,756
113
Trump has to find something else other than immigration to talk about because it was novel in 2016, repetitive and redundant in 2024. IMHO.
Not really.
Immigration is almost always an issue Americans rank highly and I think the US is currently in one of its more anti-immigration phases.
Now, you can say that he's bad at talking about immigration because he rambles and repeats himself and is even more openly racist than the population is willing to accept, sure.
And making immigration the only thing he will talk about probably doesn't help him.

But it would be political malpractice on his part to not make it a somewhat important part of his campaign.
 
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Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
35,466
68,756
113
Trump has never won a debate
People can argue he won the one earlier this year.
And some in the GOP primaries.

But that it is generally agreed he lost more debates than he won in the general elections but has a 50/50 track record should just remind you that in most cases the debates don't matter that much.
 

musky guy

Well-known member
Mar 19, 2018
866
679
93
I didn't think the debate was the blowout it has been portrayed. I still give Harris the W, but not the 10-5 or 10-6 (boxing 10 point must system), more 10-9 at best 10-8. Yes, Trump did firehose his lies about his economy but the fact Harris didn't respond I think was rather effective by Trump to folks who are too busy to dig up stats.

I think how she started out not answering the first question and went right into her campaign speech bugged me too.
She let a lot of things go. And Trump powered through the moderators on more than one occasion thus getting the final word much more than 50% of the time (I could be wrong, it felt that way). He did get 5 more minutes of speaking time. However, she gutted him on abortion and the crowd size thing made him look pathetic.

However, overall she accomplished goal #1 is she has a strong presence, gave the impression she was in charge, without coming across as a whinger. Thus more people now can envision her in charge. But IMHO it was not a blowout.
she didnt really answer any of the softball questions they were lobbing in.
 

Shaquille Oatmeal

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2023
5,640
5,683
113
I don't know your handle.

You should dig into Canada's structural economic stagnation for the last two decades. You're falling behind the industrialized West while most of your population lives 100 miles from an economic engine to the South. Something's up and it ain't your economy.

Like I have said before, the economy pays for all the nice "social" things people seem to want the government to provide.
The economy isn't everything and it can be recovered. The American conservative movement is culturally deteriorating and is being taken down a dangerous slippery slope, which is more serious. IMHO.
 
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Shaquille Oatmeal

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2023
5,640
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Not really.
Immigration is almost always an issue Americans rank highly and I think the US is currently in one of its more anti-immigration phases.
Now, you can say that he's bad at talking about immigration because he rambles and repeats himself and is even more openly racist than the population is willing to accept, sure.
And making immigration the only thing he will talk about probably doesn't help him.

But it would be political malpractice on his part to not make it a somewhat important part of his campaign.
He never actually talks about immigration. He instead dog whistles by saying millions are violently taking over cities and eating pets, which while in 2016 could have created a huge stir, in 2024, doesn't invoke the same reaction. So I am afraid this strategy isn't really working for him like it used to anymore.
 

Valcazar

Just a bundle of fucking sunshine
Mar 27, 2014
35,466
68,756
113
Her turf? Trump got 6 minutes more talking time ( but of course he just filled it with repeating the same dire warnings about the evil migrants .
As many of Mitch's posts show, fact checking is considered inappropriate and wrong by these people.
The fact ABC hosts questioned in any way what he said means they were biased and against him and she had home-field advantage.

Why did they allow his mic back on when he continually rebutted her comments, but she never got the same chance to answer his lies? The moderators were weak and allowed Trump to babble on and on, but that only showed him to be a babbling fool, jumping from topic to topic.
I didn't watch it, but have heard a few different things about this.
No one seems to agree exactly what was going on with the mics.
They were supposed to be cut completely if it wasn't your turn.
Neither of them should have been able to interrupt, but both seemed to be able to sometimes but not always.

And, as you know, Harris wanted Trump's mic on because she was planning to bait him into acting like a blustering idiot.
So I might say, far more than fact checking, ABC leaving the Trump's mic on might have been evidence of them being biased against him.
 

WyattEarp

Well-known member
May 17, 2017
8,070
2,565
113
The economy isn't everything and it can be recovered. The American conservative movement is culturally deteriorating and is being taken down a dangerous slippery slope, which is more serious. IMHO.
These will be considered Canada's lost years and it's unlikely they will be recovered. You're not the only member who believes you can just turn the economy on when you think you're ready. I presume some type of direct govt. action would be the chosen remedy. From what I've been reading, the Canadian govt. already controls a lot of the country's spending.

I see Biden and now Harris heading down that path. I could point to Obama but I think he saw the practical limitations to government or at least worked within a limited framework.
 
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mandrill

monkey
Aug 23, 2001
80,674
106,134
113
The reality is no one who is on Obamacare will have the best insurance. It's not the Dems fault. It's just the way it is. There's probably not enough money to bring it in line with private insurance.

Fighting the defrauding of the U.S. government and excessive care is where they can have a chance to make Obamacare better. There's been some good ideas thrown around. Just throwing money at healthcare is not the answer.

I'm surprised we don't hear more about healthcare fraud in Canada on TERB.
Maybe because it's not a major problem up here?

But then our governors don't appoint their son-in-laws to the state appeals court either up here.

Different place.Different standards.
 

mandrill

monkey
Aug 23, 2001
80,674
106,134
113
I don't need to pick. I'm not an american voter....but, when Trump said he will build a wall, he built it...Kamala "Biden is in his best shape ever and cognitive" Harris didn't lie to you?
What's your pick?
You know he didn't really build the wall, huh?..... 😯
 

dirtydaveiii

Well-known member
Mar 21, 2018
7,899
5,672
113
wow I didnt realize just how much of a disaster this was for Donnie. He looked worse than Biden did

1726092242023.png
 

WyattEarp

Well-known member
May 17, 2017
8,070
2,565
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Not really.
Immigration is almost always an issue Americans rank highly and I think the US is currently in one of its more anti-immigration phases.
Now, you can say that he's bad at talking about immigration because he rambles and repeats himself and is even more openly racist than the population is willing to accept, sure.
And making immigration the only thing he will talk about probably doesn't help him.

But it would be political malpractice on his part to not make it a somewhat important part of his campaign.
Immigration is a major issue in the United States. Immigration will be an issue in Canada next year. Immigration is a major issue in the U.K, France, Germany, Italy and elsewhere in Europe.

Governments that ignore voters' sentiments will continue to be under pressure. It's not complicated. Why make democracy so hard?
 

K Douglas

Half Man Half Amazing
Jan 5, 2005
28,549
9,641
113
Room 112
People can argue he won the one earlier this year.
And some in the GOP primaries.

But that it is generally agreed he lost more debates than he won in the general elections but has a 50/50 track record should just remind you that in most cases the debates don't matter that much.
I would agree debates are more or less meaningless. What will ultimately decide this election is a comparison of track records
4 years under Trump (2017-2020)
4 years under Biden/Harris (2021-2024)
 
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WyattEarp

Well-known member
May 17, 2017
8,070
2,565
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I would agree debates are more or less meaningless. What will ultimately decide this election is a comparison of track records
4 years under Trump (2017-2020)
4 years under Biden/Harris (2021-2024)
You do realize that Trump is running against Harris and not Biden. :ROFLMAO:
I spit up my cocktail when she said that.
 
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