Toronto Passions

The complexities of Sudan

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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You keep asking the same question even after numerous adequate responses.

BTW, what is the proper amount of power a lobby is permitted before it is considered too powerful? What are the units of measure of power? Ergs? Kilowatt hours?
How about acting like a democracy and listening to the 80% of your party calling for a ceasefire instead of the 9 billionaires of AIPAC?

 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
51,719
10,122
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Toronto
If it lobbies on behalf of a foreign government, any power is too much.

If another country has that much influence over your elected representatives, they are not serving you. They are serving the foreign country.
Isn't AIPAC an American entity?

1710925541421.png

FoundedJanuary 3, 1963; 61 years ago[1]
Tax ID no.53-0217164[2]
Legal status501(c)(4) organization
HeadquartersWashington, D.C., U.S.[2]
Coordinates
38.9004676°N 77.0146576°W
President, Board of DirectorsBetsy Berns Korn
Chairman, Board of DirectorsMort Fridman
Chief Executive OfficerHoward Kohr[2]
Subsidiaries251 Massachusetts Avenue LLC,
American Israel Educational Foundation,
AIPAC-AIEF Israel RA[2]
Revenue (2014)$77,709,827[2]
Expenses (2014)$69,267,598[2]
Endowment$258,533[2]
Employees (2013)396[2]
Volunteers (2013)60[2]
Websiteaipac.org
American Israel Education Foundation
Founded1990
Tax ID no.52-1623781
Legal status501(c)(3) organization
Revenue (2014)$55,234,555
Expenses (2014)$50,266,476
Endowment$24,527,692
Employees (2013)0
Volunteers (2013)39
American Israel Public Affairs Committee Political Action Committee
Founded2021
Registration no.C00797670
Legal statusPolitical Action Committee
Location
  • Washington, DC
TreasurerJustin Phillips
Federal Election Commission[3]
The American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC /ˈeɪpæk/ AY-pak) is a lobbying group
 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
51,719
10,122
113
Toronto
How about acting like a democracy and listening to the 80% of your party calling for a ceasefire instead of the 9 billionaires of AIPAC?
Nothing illegal or even improper has occurred in our governance.

Regardless, just like every individual in the world, no government is always right or always wrong.
 

toguy5252

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2009
15,964
6,108
113
Then what does Israel need such a powerful lobby for? One that coerces US politicians to divert billions of their taxpayers' money to a foreign country.

Does anyone need to lobby TERB members to give their money to SPs?

I was going to quit this hobby for good, but toguy5252 bribed me to continue spending my money on SPs. He also threatened to pay Frankie and Kautilya instead if I stopped spending on SPs. That bastard!

You and I both know what the Israel lobby is for. It's to keep their puppets in line, and to keep the free bombs flowing.
I have never said that Israel dissent have a powerful lobby. I hope they do. That is very different than saying that any legislator who is Israel is bought rather than acting out of conviction. Very different.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
91,866
22,266
113
Isn't AIPAC an American entity?

View attachment 306924

FoundedJanuary 3, 1963; 61 years ago[1]
Tax ID no.53-0217164[2]
Legal status501(c)(4) organization
HeadquartersWashington, D.C., U.S.[2]
Coordinates
38.9004676°N 77.0146576°W
President, Board of DirectorsBetsy Berns Korn
Chairman, Board of DirectorsMort Fridman
Chief Executive OfficerHoward Kohr[2]
Subsidiaries251 Massachusetts Avenue LLC,
American Israel Educational Foundation,
AIPAC-AIEF Israel RA[2]
Revenue (2014)$77,709,827[2]
Expenses (2014)$69,267,598[2]
Endowment$258,533[2]
Employees (2013)396[2]
Volunteers (2013)60[2]
Websiteaipac.org
American Israel Education Foundation
Founded1990
Tax ID no.52-1623781
Legal status501(c)(3) organization
Revenue (2014)$55,234,555
Expenses (2014)$50,266,476
Endowment$24,527,692
Employees (2013)0
Volunteers (2013)39
American Israel Public Affairs Committee Political Action Committee
Founded2021
Registration no.C00797670
Legal statusPolitical Action Committee
Location
  • Washington, DC
TreasurerJustin Phillips
Federal Election Commission[3]
The American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC /ˈeɪpæk/ AY-pak) is a lobbying group
Yes, AIPAC represents 9 or 10 Jewish billionaires who echo the policies of Likud instead of Americans.
They are trump loving, hate filled right wingers pushing Americans to support genocide.


 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
91,866
22,266
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Nothing illegal or even improper has occurred in our governance.

Regardless, just like every individual in the world, no government is always right or always wrong.
The US allows lobbyists to buy politicians influence over voters, like the NRA did, like the tobacco industry did, like the oil industry does and like AIPAC does for Likud.

Its no illegal but its not democratic.
 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
51,719
10,122
113
Toronto
Yes, AIPAC represents 9 or 10 Jewish billionaires who echo the policies of Likud instead of Americans.
They are trump loving, hate filled right wingers pushing Americans to support genocide.
Wow. Those billionaires formed the group in 1961 and those billionaires are still alive.

Meanwhile, the Hamas billionaires live in luxury outside of Gaza and the west bank using the money that they stole meant for humanitarian aid and they are hate-filled trying to wipe out the Jews from the river to the sea.
 
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shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
51,719
10,122
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Toronto
The US allows lobbyists to buy politicians influence over voters, like the NRA did, like the tobacco industry did, like the oil industry does and like AIPAC does for Likud.

Its no illegal but its not democratic.
AIPAC is supporting the US' greatest democratic ally in the ME.

Not all lobbyists support good causes. Or are you saying that all lobbying and all lobbyists are evil. Or have you been assigned the authority to decide which lobby groups are good and which are bad?

Are you saying that the environmental lobby and pro-choice lobby should not be allowed to influence politicians?
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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So Daddy Franky, the millions of funds that goes to Gaza yearly, where does it end? Is it "genocide"/apartheid to ask where the funds go?
There are 2.2 million people there.
Are you talking $5-10 for each person?

Under the Geneva Conventions Israel is responsible for their well being.
How many billions would it take to feed 2.2 million people, rich?
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
91,866
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AIPAC is supporting the US' greatest democratic ally in the ME.

Not all lobbyists support good causes. Or are you saying that all lobbying and all lobbyists are evil. Or have you been assigned the authority to decide which lobby groups are good and which are bad?

Are you saying that the environmental lobby and pro-choice lobby should not be allowed to influence politicians?
NRA, oil&gas industry and AIPAC are all not lobbying for good causes.
Imagine lobbying for cash just so you can starve 2 million people to death.

 

richaceg

Well-known member
Feb 11, 2009
14,038
5,826
113
There are 2.2 million people there.
Are you talking $5-10 for each person?

Under the Geneva Conventions Israel is responsible for their well being.
How many billions would it take to feed 2.2 million people, rich?
Hamas rules Gaza not Israel....they could've funded some infrastructure instead of tunnels and rockets...
 

toguy5252

Well-known member
Jun 22, 2009
15,964
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Hamas rules Gaza not Israel....they could've funded some infrastructure instead of tunnels and rockets...
I have a wall you can use. Probably more satisfying to bang your head against it than to get him to agree that schools and infrastructure are more important than tunnels.
 
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basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
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Blah blah blah... So what need is there for an Israel lobby? Why waste hundreds of millions every year to buy off US politicians, and to threaten the ones that don't comply?

If it's in their national interest, wouldn't they do it anyway, without needing to be bought or threatened? Get real.
Why do Americans lobby their government on anything? It's obvious that only some lobbying is a problem to you.


p.s. Threats? Okay then.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
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Canada does. Because Canada is an established state today. And back in the day, Canada was a settler colonial movement.

The British in 1919 did not. They were a colonial invader.

Canada did start out as a settler colonial movement similar to Israel, but it has since provided citizenship to its indigeneous peoples, acknowledges past and present injustices and takes steps, regardless of whether they are adequate or not, to alleviate concerns.

Israel on the other hand is still engaged in genocide.
First, the Brits (and the French further north) had the official mandate of the League of nations They were the legally established government. And it is telling that you think the foreign Ottoman Empire ruling over a region is okay but the British empire replacing them as illegal.

And as I said, the people attacked in the 1919 and 1929 anti-Jewish attacks were indigenous Jewish communities, not immigrants.


Canada still has systemic oppression of Indigenous people and as I previous documented, land is still being taken such as Ford's government taking treaty land because mining resources were recently discovered. You're just a pathetic hypocrite as a settler trying to justify your settler status, an immigrant justifying anti-immigrant violence, and a supporter of one country's nationalism complaining that another country has nationalism.

It's also clear that as you admitted, you don't know what you are talking about.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
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The ICJ ruling's Provisional Measures said Israel was to abide by the act by not committing genocide, to prevent killing Palestinians, to allow all aid through and to charge those who incite genocide.
...
Bullshit. There is absolutely nothing wrong with killing opponents in a war. There's not even anything illegal about civilians dying during combat, no matter how much you try to warp the statement. If there were, the ICJ would have said so when Israel reported on the provisional measures.
 
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