Climate Change

bob2613

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Jan 21, 2004
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So weird, Climate champions with their super computers and models. They can’t answer that question for you to Google?

Or, if that not question. Can you not find answer for when Armegeddon will arrive assuming net zero is reached by 2030? 2050? So weird.

wouldn’t a smart investor know what his money is buying? A few years? 100?

We know, do we not. That given warmer temps, summers will be drier, winters milder and that precipitation patterns will change. We sort of know in the prairies that means less snowpack and thus less spring run off, that replenishes aquafiers. That means less water. Also true here too…You know how that works right?

We also know hotter summers means more droughts. We also know drier kindling like grass means more wildfires.

why can’t you tell us if wheat and corn will grow there, and if not where?
All models are derived my data and an analysis. We currently do not have the physical ability to collect data and changes on every square kilometre of the planet. Models are used to approximate and make extrapolations on the climate (not the weather). These are tested by running backward in times to see if they match observed data. Increased tools to track data to smaller points will lead to better predictive models.

The James Webb Telescope is providing new data allowing physicists to update models on the universe developed over time since Copenicus. We are currently reviewing new data which may indicate the universe is twice as old as we believed in models just a year ago.

Chromosones were discovered in the mid 1800's and new data is providing data on how the models for the Y chromosone functions in our biology

I think its a mistake to take a mechanistic approach to complex subjects and expect to know the outcome tomorrow , the week after, a year after. One can use a mechanistic look at the stock market such as AI and expect gains with every investment but I would suggest there is more to the movement of stocks, bonds etc beyond what is found daily trades.

As George Box in the 1970s “All models are wrong, some are useful.” His point was that we should focus more on whether something can be applied to everyday life in a useful manner rather than debating endlessly if an answer is correct in all cases.
 
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Not getting younger

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All models are derived my data and an analysis. We currently do not have the physical ability to collect data and changes on every square kilometre of the planet. Models are used to approximate and make extrapolations on the climate (not the weather). These are tested by running backward in times to see if they match observed data. Increased tools to track data to smaller points will lead to better predictive models.

The James Webb Telescope is providing new data allowing physicists to update models on the universe developed over time since Copenicus. We are currently reviewing new data which may indicate the universe is twice as old as we believed in models just a year ago.

Chromosones were discovered in the mid 1800's and new data is providing data on how the models for the Y chromosone functions in our biology

I think its a mistake to take a mechanistic approach to complex subjects and expect to know the outcome tomorrow , the week after, a year after. One can use a mechanistic look at the stock market such as AI and expect gains with every investment but I would suggest there is more to the movement of stocks, bonds etc beyond what is found daily trades.

As George Box in the 1970s “All models are wrong, some are useful.” His point was that we should focus more on whether something can be applied to everyday life in a useful manner rather than debating endlessly if an answer is correct in all cases.
will say, I am more than just a little familiar with powerful computers and models. Might have something to do with years on Bay st, hedge funds, economics, trading. Maybe their quants and models aren’t all that…because I know what ours were able to extrapolate, the dozens or hundreds of stress test, and far far far more that could be executed in the blink of an eye.

funny, ticks with brains the size of pins heads have been migrating for years…yet we aren’t even….

But the point is.
funny how they seem to good at looking down the road some, so stressed about buying a few years. If it’s going to be all that, um one might think figuring out where to grow corn, and many other things….
 

Frankfooter

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will say, I am more than just a little familiar with powerful computers and models. Might have something to do with years on Bay st, hedge funds, economics, trading. Maybe their quants and models aren’t all that…because I know what ours were able to extrapolate, the dozens or hundreds of stress test, and far far far more that could be executed in the blink of an eye.

funny, ticks with brains the size of pins heads have been migrating for years…yet we aren’t even….

But the point is.
funny how they seem to good at looking down the road some, so stressed about buying a few years. If it’s going to be all that, um one might think figuring out where to grow corn, and many other things….
Anyone familiar with models wouldn't have asked the date of armegedon.
 

Not getting younger

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Missed the point entirely.

Sometimes it’s better to think…Liken it to teaching kids algebra. We can show the equations and answers. Or try to get them to think it through.

As a general rule, it’s a belief of mine that getting people to think, is better than telling them what to think. We/they are after all allowed our/their opinions.
 
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Frankfooter

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Missed the point entirely.

Sometimes it’s better to think…Liken it to teaching kids algebra. We can show the equations and answers. Or try to get them to think it through.

As a general rule, it’s a belief of mine that getting people to think, is better than telling them what to think. We/they are after all allowed our/their opinions.
You mean you want them to think like you and disagree with the science because you think your opinion is worth more than evidence.
You're going to say that your claimed history with financial modelling is exactly the same as modelling used in climatology and therefore your opinion should be listened to.
What you won't do is check the 20 years of modelling projections vs measured changes, nor the underlying science nor the evidence.
 

Not getting younger

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You mean you want them to think like you and disagree with the science because you think your opinion is worth more than evidence.
You're going to say that your claimed history with financial modelling is exactly the same as modelling used in climatology and therefore your opinion should be listened to.
What you won't do is check the 20 years of modelling projections vs measured changes, nor the underlying science nor the evidence.
If you say so. No doubt you’ve missed the many times I’ve had to go the extra step and say “draw your own conclusions”. For someone that follows people around.

Either way still missing the point. Ever heard of value for the dollar? Time value? No doubt you read the previous 4-5 post of posters saying much the same before you jumped in with your usuals. You also missed the subtle hint “wouldn’t smart investors”…not surprised…Ever hear of context and comprehension?
 

shack

Nitpicker Extraordinaire
Oct 2, 2001
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Why do you think I would refuse to see anything?
Because the clear evidence presented to you just seems to be ignored.

I understand two important points about climate - one that it functions chaotically not linearly
Which does nothing to dispute that the climate is moving on a path which is disastrous to humankind

and two, that it has changed rapidly in the past without human's emitting co2.
Again, this does nothing to disprove that human's emitting CO2 is exacerbating the problem.
 
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Frankfooter

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If you say so. No doubt you’ve missed the many times I’ve had to go the extra step and say “draw your own conclusions”. For someone that follows people around.

Either way still missing the point. Ever heard of value for the dollar? Time value? No doubt you read the previous 4-5 post of posters saying much the same before you jumped in with your usuals. You also missed the subtle hint “wouldn’t smart investors”…not surprised…Ever hear of context and comprehension?
draw your own conclusions = do your own research
 

Not getting younger

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draw your own conclusions = do your own research
typical, not at all surprised that’s the limits of your abilities.

Obviously,
1) I’ve done my research and just as obviously I don’t dispute climate change, nor that humans are “accelerating” the rate.

Obviously
2) I have come to conclusions about what to do about it, and have offered possible alternatives


THEREFORE VERY OBVIOUSLY
You struggle to read, to comprehend, to think.
Just another Franky brainfart.

or is it something else
or all of the above.
 

K Douglas

Half Man Half Amazing
Jan 5, 2005
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Because the clear evidence presented to you just seems to be ignored.

Which does nothing to dispute that the climate is moving on a path which is disastrous to humankind


Again, this does nothing to disprove that human's emitting CO2 is exacerbating the problem.
While I admire your idealism its just not rooted in reality. Even if climate change were an existential threat, which I don't believe it is, there is nothing we, as humans, can do about it. For instance, if we were to stop all global CO2 emissions by end of this decade, it wouldn't make a lick of difference to global temperatures.
 
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Not getting younger

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Idealism vs pragmatism. Is very much like left wing politics vs right wing politics. One might almost say related. The concept of a time and place for everything seems lost, in this first past the post, winner take all world.

for me anyways, on this topic, given what is potentially at stake. For the environment, for the economy, and more. There is no place for idealism, or very little.
 
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Frankfooter

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Obviously
2) I have come to conclusions about what to do about it, and have offered possible alternatives
The only 'alternative' I've read from you is do nothing and then say every option presented won't do anything.
Go ahead and list your 'alternative' actions.
 

Not getting younger

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The only 'alternative' I've read from you is do nothing and then say every option presented won't do anything.
Go ahead and list your 'alternative' actions.
I am not sure I’ve ever met a person as dim, so prone to brainfarts, so obtuse, and so interested in sticking their feet in their mouth as you.

While I could quote or link numerous examples. See just a handle of post ago. #761. I could link that, but let’s see if you can at least think your way through finding it.there might be some hope, and something functioning properly in there yet.

How many times Franky, do you really want to make yourself look so, incompetent between brainfarts and more.
 

Frankfooter

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I am not sure I’ve ever met a person as dim, so prone to brainfarts, so obtuse, and so interested in sticking their feet in their mouth as you.

While I could quote or link numerous examples. See just a handle of post ago. #761. I could link that, but let’s see if you can at least think your way through finding it.there might be some hope, and something functioning properly in there yet.

How many times Franky, do you really want to make yourself look so, incompetent between brainfarts and more.
Post #761 is toguy replying to K douglas.
That would qualify as a brain fart, wouldn't it?

Of course, the sentence you typed is a brain fart of its own.
See just a handle of post ago. #761.
 

oil&gas

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Apr 16, 2002
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Ghawar
While I admire your idealism its just not rooted in reality.
There is this disconnect between belief in climate change being
an existential threat and reality I find inexplicable. If there is one
group of people who seems more genuinely affected by the threat
of climate change it is the children and youth suffering climate anxiety.
I've read reports telling how some of these victims are so fearful about
their future they are in need of therapy for real. Somehow you won't likely
see those most informed like majority of climate scientists (of whom
I crossed path with quite a few), politicians, activists and those supportive
of climate action suffering similar afflictions.

Let us face it, we can debate whether climate change is man-made
to no end and nothing could change the way we live. We will all turn
AC up to cool off this coming week, drive out of town over the long
weekend, plan our next holiday trip to Europe or Asia and accumulate
wealth for grand kids to be brought into a world of climate chaos. Our
climate leaders will find ways to denounce oil drillers to appease voters
who voted them on the promise of zero emission and yet they are the ones
in bed with the fossil fuel industry in the end. Trudeau and his team has
devised this concept of 'low carbon' and 'abated' oil that will guarantee
continued operation of oil explorers and developers in the most
environmentally fragile area. Biden has also allocated climate funds
in the billions to Big Oil so climate sheeple can continue using their carbon
polluting products with a clear conscience. If there is one accomplishment
the climate movement can point to it would be global increase in the
demand of oil amidst the rising of oil prices. Big Oil should thank world's
oil sheeple notwithstanding all the slandering from climate activists.


Even if climate change were an existential threat, which I don't believe it is, there is nothing we, as humans, can do about it. For instance, if we were to stop all global CO2 emissions by end of this decade, it wouldn't make a lick of difference to global temperatures.
 

canada-man

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canadianmale.wordpress.com
The Astonishingly Woke Australian Academy Of ‘Anti-Science’




The Australian Academy of Science (AAS) recently released a report Reef Futures Roundtable, which is ostensibly about the doomed Great Barrier Reef.

However, the report only demonstrates that the AAS, Australia’s peak science body, has become not just unscientific, but anti-scientific.

Perhaps unsurprisingly, it has also become astonishingly Woke. [emphasis, links added]



The AAS report predictably concluded that the Great Barrier Reef could already be ‘irreversibly’ damaged.

The fact that UNESCO has just declared it not endangered did not rate a mention, and neither did the latest two years of statistics showing the reef is at record high coral levels.

Remarkably, the report does not contain a single fact or figure to support any of its claims about the reef – except the area of the reef is 340,000 square kilometers. There are no figures, no percentages. Nowhere does it mention that coral grows 30 percent faster for every degree increase in water temperatures.


Or that there is 100 percent more coral on the reef today than in 2012. Or that just one percent of the reef has the potential to be impacted by farm sediment, fertilizer, or pesticides, even in the slightest way. Or that the sea level has fallen by one meter in the last 5,000 years.

The problem with this completely unanalytical approach is seen in the ‘interventions’ it recommends to fix the reef. Their impracticality is breathtaking.

For example, it suggests ‘solar radiation management’ – shading the reef from the sun with man-made fog and clouds to prevent the water from heating up and causing coral bleaching.

The only number cited in the entire report – the area of the reef, which is as big as Germany – should have given them a hint that this is crazy. How are you going to make a cloud as big as Germany and keep it anchored over the reef for the whole summer over the next few hundred years?

And you will also have to stop hot water flowing into the reef from the Coral Sea at the same time. That would require a dam 2,000 kilometers long and 100 meters high.

While a simple calculation is all that is required to reveal the absurdity of this idea, modern science is full of people who are almost completely non-quantitative and, as such, impractical and virtually useless as scientists.

Next, there is rubble stabilization. The supposed experts worry that the Great Barrier Reef will break up from climate change.

Each of the 3,000 reefs is an almost solid lump of calcium carbonate rock (fragments of coral glued together over eons) a few kilometers wide and 100 meters high.

How this is going to be broken up by some climate change magic is unexplained. But even if that were to happen, are they seriously suggesting we can wire it back together with steel reinforcing and concrete? Just do the calculation on how much concrete and steel this would entail.

The unscientific nature of the AAS report is largely a result of its anti-scientific approach. The report is actually a parody of wokeness and romantic mythology.

This starts with the way the roundtable committees of ‘experts’, whom they questioned about the reef, were formed.

Each roundtable had two chairs, a non-Indigenous chair, and a specially selected Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander chair. The romantic mythology about the special knowledge of any person with Indigenous heritage pervades the entire document and starts in the foreword by the head of the AAS.

As the Academy approached the task of planning this project it became immediately obvious that there was no separating nature and culture when it comes to the GBR.
Land and sea cannot be separated. No priority can be selected on an ecological basis alone. Having a Traditional Knowledges co-Chair in each roundtable allowed for different sources of knowledge to be shared and to form a basis for a number of the observations featured in this report.
Having a diversity of ideas and scientific thought would have gone some of the way to curing the AAS of groupthink that renders its report risible.

The views and experiences of people from the coral islands of the Torres Straits and northern Great Barrier Reef could have been used to great effect.

These people tend to be deeply practical about the reef – like almost all seafaring people who live and work on the reef. And practical people know you cannot bolt the reef, which is the size of Germany, down to the seafloor.

But selecting people for their ‘roundtables’ on the basis of their ethnicity rather than their scientific or real-world experience is a fundamentally anti-scientific approach.

But it gets worse. The dearth of statistics about the reef is made up for by an abundance of data on the gender identification of all those who participated in the ‘roundtables’.

There is also the Indigenous percentage. And not just of those who participated, but also of those who were invited to participate but did not.

One could quibble and point out that those claiming to be male or female added up to exactly 100 percent in all categories, indicating a terrifying lack of diversity on the LGBQTI+++ spectrum.

But there is no question, on the important matters for the Woke brigade, that this report is brimming with instructive statistics.

The AAS ascribes such importance to facts and figures on gender and race, but not to scientific facts. This demonstrates it is anti-science.

Science is about evidence and logic. It does not matter whether one is male or female or whatever else, it is still impossible to make clouds as big as Germany for the next hundred years.

That is called a fact, and facts do not vary with race, gender, or any ideology.

I have been saying for some time that many of our science institutions have become totally untrustworthy. By its wilful abandonment of quantitative analysis, the AAS has destroyed its reputation as a source of useful scientific advice.

The media loves a bad news story – they should focus on what has happened to a once-esteemed organization.

The Australian Academy of Science is now a joke.

Read more at Spectator AU

The Astonishingly Woke Australian Academy Of 'Anti-Science' - Climate Change Dispatch
 

Not getting younger

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For the sake of arguement let’s all just agree it’s as dire as they are warning. Let’s all just agree various points of no return are just a few years away and not all that far as they say…

Translated in plain English. It’s urgent!!!!!!!
Let’s piss around playing games trying to buy a few years..

Rather than taking action…doing the things they should be doing. We could rhyme of a few dozen things I’m thinking…electric grids? Any action there? Can’t imagine that’s going to be accomplished anytime fast.
 
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