Work from home opinions, the good, the bad or scam?

[explorerzip]

This is utter nonsense. "People working form home are just coasting" - how do you know? How are you measuring productivity? For example, you are working in an office right now I presume. Yet here you are on TERB. So here is an example of someone coasting from the office

What exactly do you mean people in office are able to "work with each other"? Are they sitting at each other's desks pointing at their computers or are they sitting in their cubicles doing their jobs? If so, why cant that desk be moved to the home and the same thing be done from home?

What do you mean quality of work is noticeably worse? Again I ask - what is this line of work where quality is better if done from the office? If they are writing a word document do you mean to say that working from home they tend to make grammatical errors as opposed to working in a cubicle in an office?

I have worked remote for the past 10 years. I have worked at home and signed SOWs worth millions with clients, just presenting everything via zoom. Not once have I had any issues with quality, communication or collaboration. Our entire firm works on that basis and we are global.

This is just your political nonsense. Not the truth.

If you work in manufacturing then measuring prodcutivity and quality is quite easy. You have to build a specific number of widgets in a month to specifications. You either make that number or not.

If you work in an office then measuring is more difficult because you're often working on projects. You can be busy for weeks if not months and sit on the bench for just as long.

 

[krealtarron]

If you work in manufacturing then measuring prodcutivity and quality is quite easy. You have to build a specific number of widgets in a month to specifications. You either make that number or not.

If you work in an office then measuring is more difficult because you're often working on projects. You can be busy for weeks if not months and sit on the bench for just as long.

Exactly and sitting on bench is totally okay as long as the employee meets their required billable hours, provided the people who are supposed to bring in the projects do their job properly and the economy is also conducive.

 

[krealtarron]

If you're not doing that already, you're not doing your job.

Note that other countries consider Toronto talent to be cheap, so be careful what you wish for.

Toronto IS cheap if you compare with US salaries. We literally pay 50% of what the same job fetches you in the US.

 

[Valcazar]

Hybrid is the way to go.

This is what many places will end up as, I think.
There are benefits to the office and the face to face collaboration - but it depends on the job and it does not need to be everyday.
Some people work better from home, others in an office environment.
Some jobs are more amenable to remote work than others.

Most companies are not going to want to be flexible because that's complicated and also because lots of management don't trust workers, but "one-right-way" is pretty obviously wrong.

 

[krealtarron]

This is what many places will end up as, I think.
There are benefits to the office and the face to face collaboration - but it depends on the job and it does not need to be everyday.
Some people work better from home, others in an office environment.
Some jobs are more amenable to remote work than others.

Most companies are not going to want to be flexible because that's complicated and also because lots of management don't trust workers, but "one-right-way" is pretty obviously wrong.

Many industries have always been hybrid. Even before the pandemic. Tech, consulting are a couple of examples as these have always been more progressive about their work places because they are industries where change and being nimble is the norm - so they try to make their worker's lives as easy as possible by offering hybrid arrangements or workplace comfort as perks. It is the more conservative industries, that dont give anything for free, who have a good old boy culture, for whom this is a big cultural change.

 

[Mr.lover]

See healthy discussion and we are all circling the elusive fact that we need to acknowledge... we are human beings.. there are hard working motivated people and then there are others..

the hybrid environment eventually impacts the hard working individuals leading them to under perform because they are placed in an environment where they have the opportunity to not work.. it's that simple.

The people who tout the benefits of work life balance, no traffic time, etc. are not spending that time saving on company work..

It can be argued that the salary paid factors in for the clothes required for the office, travel time, travel costs, proximity living costs. As one of the CEO of the investment bank said why am I paying the person NY state wages when they live in Ohio? Are they going to take a pay cut? No.

 

[krealtarron]

See healthy discussion and we are all circling the elusive fact that we need to acknowledge... we are human beings.. there are hard working motivated people and then there are others..

the hybrid environment eventually impacts the hard working individuals leading them to under perform because they are placed in an environment where they have the opportunity to not work.. it's that simple.

The people who tout the benefits of work life balance, no traffic time, etc. are not spending that time saving on company work..

It can be argued that the salary paid factors in for the clothes required for the office, travel time, travel costs, proximity living costs. As one of the CEO of the investment bank said why am I paying the person NY state wages when they live in Ohio? Are they going to take a pay cut? No.

Based on what do you definitively state that hard working motivated individuals will eventually underperform? If they underperform their deliverables will suffer, and they will eventually be managed out. Do hard working motivated employees not underperform in a cubicle? Motivation, working hard etc are not dependent on which building you work, but they are factors influenced by how happy you are at work. People are happier WFH, and therefore will perform better is just as much a reasonable conclusion.

And so what if someone can save a few hours of their lives? If instead of working 8 hours, they complete the work in 5, and then enjoy the rest of their day, what is it to you as long as work is already delivered?

And so what if someone pays NY state wages and the employee lives in Ohio? You are paying them for their skills and for their deliverables.

The people who make these types of arguments are the horrible managers, slave drivers who have no consideration for employees, their lives or even have any idea of what productive work really is. To them they simply need to squeeze everything out of an employee to make sure they are getting their money's worth. These are also the types of work places where employees wont see any growth.

 

[bver_hunter]

Well if you work in something like a Research / Laboratory or Pilot / Production environment, then it is impossible to work from home. The salaries of such individuals should be raised as they will continue to incur higher expenses on commuting to work on a daily basis, as well as generally to shell out more bucks for their car maintenance and service. Their colleagues in the marketing, or administrative departments will have the luxury of working from home at lesser hours. To me the bonuses should be higher for those in the Research sector and eventually more vacation / sick days for such individuals makes it a level playing field.

 

[joetheman]

I can see the benefits of both sides. Right now I'm going into the office about 3 times a week cause we're required. If it wasn't required, I'd probably still be there 2-3 days.

I work hard and I am productive even from home. I like wfh since I avoid traffic and I can wake up late. But I do miss the social interaction at work. That's the thing, if you're a single person, you may feel crazy being alone all the time. People with families I get would rather stay home.

The other thing I've noticed is the new grads and junior employees really struggle working from home. They waste a lot of time and think I don't notice but I do. These guys don't understand what our office culture is like. They don't understand how to talk to people, ask for help, socialize. They waste hours cause they're afraid it'll look bad if they can't do something on their own. In the office it's different. They just lean over and talk to me. We can shoot the shit and they get comfortable and casually mention stuff about work problems. I can just sometimes walk by and keep an eye on em or ask how they're doing.

I don't need to be at the office, but I feel like young/new employees do until they get the hang of things.

 

[krealtarron]

I can see the benefits of both sides. Right now I'm going into the office about 3 times a week cause we're required. If it wasn't required, I'd probably still be there 2-3 days.

I work hard and I am productive even from home. I like wfh since I avoid traffic and I can wake up late. But I do miss the social interaction at work. That's the thing, if you're a single person, you may feel crazy being alone all the time. People with families I get would rather stay home.

The other thing I've noticed is the new grads and junior employees really struggle working from home. They waste a lot of time and think I don't notice but I do. These guys don't understand what our office culture is like. They don't understand how to talk to people, ask for help, socialize. They waste hours cause they're afraid it'll look bad if they can't do something on their own. In the office it's different. They just lean over and talk to me. We can shoot the shit and they get comfortable and casually mention stuff about work problems. I can just sometimes walk by and keep an eye on em or ask how they're doing.

I don't need to be at the office, but I feel like young/new employees do until they get the hang of things.

I am single too, but I actually prefer as less interaction as possible. For me the benefits of not having to put up with assholes at work, and the distraction free environment at home is super productive. Something I get done in 5 hours at work in the office, I get done in 2 hours at home, because everything is quiet.

 

[joetheman]

I am single too, but I actually prefer as less interaction as possible. For me the benefits of not having to put up with assholes at work, and the distraction free environment at home is super productive. Something I get done in 5 hours at work in the office, I get done in 2 hours at home, because everything is quiet.

Yeah I guess some people are like that. I'm close friends with my colleagues and we all hang out together all the time.

 

[shack]

This is not true at all.

As I mentioned I have and my entire firm, works from home. We have for over 10 years. Not once has productivity or coasting been a problem. I have however seen many coast their jobs at the work place. Coasting and working from home are unrelated.

Also it is not true that co-workers will be motivated seeing how hard others are working - this is just a naive assumption at best. People work as hard as they want to. A boss looking over your shoulder is very bad work culture, and is slave driving and micro managing, which should be actively discouraged.

Blah, blah, blah. If people are watching you, you're less likely to slack off.

Does this apply to every person? I didn't say that and you'd have to be a moron to think so. So you can come up with exceptions to my explanation, but it doesn't change my above statement.

 

[krealtarron]

Blah, blah, blah. If people are watching you, you're less likely to slack off.

Does this apply to every person? I didn't say that and you'd have to be a moron to think so. So you can come up with exceptions to my explanation, but it doesn't change my above statement.

What do you mean people are watching you? Are people standing behind you at your cubicle? Are people in cubicles fearfully and feverishly doing their jobs all the time? Heck people do the same thing in cubicles that they do at home. Is your goal to keep bums on seats instead of actually doing some work? Can't people's productivity be tracked if they work from home?

Your comment lacks thought.

You are just as likely to work hard and just as likely to slack off whether or not you work at home or in the office.

 

[shack]

What do you mean people are watching you? Are people standing behind you at your cubicle? Are people in cubicles fearfully and feverishly doing their jobs all the time? Heck people do the same thing in cubicles that they do at home. Is your goal to keep bums on seats instead of actually doing some work? Can't people's productivity be tracked if they work from home?

Your comment lacks thought.

People don't have to be actually watching you. But as long as the potential is there, it serves as a deterrent to scratching your ass and having a nap.

My comment was totally logical.

 

[Mr.lover]

Based on what do you definitively state that hard working motivated individuals will eventually underperform? If they underperform their deliverables will suffer, and they will eventually be managed out. Do hard working motivated employees not underperform in a cubicle? Motivation, working hard etc are not dependent on which building you work, but they are factors influenced by how happy you are at work. People are happier WFH, and therefore will perform better is just as much a reasonable conclusion.

And so what if someone can save a few hours of their lives? If instead of working 8 hours, they complete the work in 5, and then enjoy the rest of their day, what is it to you as long as work is already delivered?

And so what if someone pays NY state wages and the employee lives in Ohio? You are paying them for their skills and for their deliverables.

The people who make these types of arguments are the horrible managers, slave drivers who have no consideration for employees, their lives or even have any idea of what productive work really is. To them they simply need to squeeze everything out of an employee to make sure they are getting their money's worth. These are also the types of work places where employees wont see any growth.

Yes, I agree with your point on happiness at work and that will translate into motivation and productivity. My point was, while at the office you do not have the distractions that you would have at home, family, kids, gaming, sleep etc.
And it's not someone watching you, but you can't take a nap at your desk, or do laundry.
So to clarify, the decline in productivity happens when that hard working individual decides, darn I'll take a few mins to fold laundry, or go wash my car because I am done with my deliverables. But at the office if you're done with your deliverables would you go home? No you start work on something else.
It's not being a slave driver, but just saying at the office a productive person will continue to work on other things.. At home less.likely.

 

[Jenesis]

I know some companies suffer while people WFH but my company has thrived. Productivity is up (except for the beginning of COVID when one employee couldn’t get things in on time but that is resolved) and I have less overhead. Maybe it helps that I pay well and my employees want to work for me.

I know COVID fucked up a lot of people so I don’t say it often but COVID was the best thing that could have happened to me and my business. Both of them. Escorting and my mainstream business.

I honestly wish I started having everyone WFH sooner but I got caught up in the idea that you need an office.

 

[Nathan 88]

I've often said to the youngsters who work for me and all want to work "remotely", "well if your job can be done entirely from home, why am I paying you a hundred grand a year when I can just hire some guy in Nicaragua for 4 bucks an hour?"

This is a great point.
People who insist on working from home, should realize that they could end up competing against people from other parts of the world who will work for a fraction of the salary that they are making.
Believe me when I tell you that a lot of companies are considering this right now.

 

[krealtarron]

Yes, I agree with your point on happiness at work and that will translate into motivation and productivity. My point was, while at the office you do not have the distractions that you would have at home, family, kids, gaming, sleep etc.
And it's not someone watching you, but you can't take a nap at your desk, or do laundry.
So to clarify, the decline in productivity happens when that hard working individual decides, darn I'll take a few mins to fold laundry, or go wash my car because I am done with my deliverables. But at the office if you're done with your deliverables would you go home? No you start work on something else.
It's not being a slave driver, but just saying at the office a productive person will continue to work on other things.. At home less.likely.

This is not true. If they are not doing laundry, they are watching youtube videos, faceebooking or some such.

At work if your deliverable is done of course you leave work. Which modern workplace expects employees to punch in and punch out at specific times?

Even if they have 2 projects lined up, then they would do the same thing at home. They would start work on the 2nd, but maybe after they do laundry or taking a break. As long as deliverables are on time, you havent lost productivity.

 

[krealtarron]

People don't have to be actually watching you. But as long as the potential is there, it serves as a deterrent to scratching your ass and having a nap.

My comment was totally logical.

There is no potential for someone to watch you. That would be workplace harrasment. You can however be "watched" even while working from home. Essentially its a follow up and it happens regardless of where you work.

 

[explorerzip]

Yes, I agree with your point on happiness at work and that will translate into motivation and productivity. My point was, while at the office you do not have the distractions that you would have at home, family, kids, gaming, sleep etc.
And it's not someone watching you, but you can't take a nap at your desk, or do laundry.
So to clarify, the decline in productivity happens when that hard working individual decides, darn I'll take a few mins to fold laundry, or go wash my car because I am done with my deliverables. But at the office if you're done with your deliverables would you go home? No you start work on something else.
It's not being a slave driver, but just saying at the office a productive person will continue to work on other things.. At home less.likely.

There are plenty of distractions in the office: peope miling about or chatting, noises from the inside and outside the building, fire alarms, events going on in the building lobby or in the neighborhood, etc. There's no way to completely eliminate these unless you work in a windowless office or the basement. Even then, people naturally get distracted and play with their phones, chat with each other, etc.

It's already been said many times on this thread that working from home effectively depends on your specific job function and industry. You can't put a blanket statement that applies across all businesses. It's totally fine if you don't like it, but don't impose that belief on everyone.