The same sort of worldwide sanctions imposed upon the previous National Party government of South Africa imposed upon the ANC government of South Africa ifso try to come up with another plan to help the white farmers.
How many white supremacists are there in USA and Europe? Probably not enough to have much of an impact.The same sort of worldwide sanctions imposed upon the previous National Party government of South Africa imposed upon the ANC government of South Africa if
they seize private property without compensation at fair market value prices paid in full over months not decades. Further without limits on exporting and converting those funds.
Plenty of people around the world though are concerned that the government may steal their property based simply on their race.How many white supremacists are there in USA and Europe? Probably not enough to have much of an impact.
Yes that happens a lot in some countries, doesn't it?Plenty of people around the world though are concerned that the government may steal their property based simply on their race.
No you do not get itI think you should check up on the valuations of South African Government bonds. You will be surprised.
DO NOT imply you know what I would rather support or what I would rather not supportAs surprised as I am that you would rather confiscate the white farmers land without compensation than pay them fair value in Government bonds.
???I will take your word for it that you are not a communist, but you are in line with the most leftists of the ANC.
??????I think there is little chance of the Marines being sent in to save the whites, so try to come up with another plan to help the white farmers.
Oh so you are admitting that the anti-apartheid movement wasn't about justice, but about loathing of Afrikaners?How many white supremacists are there in USA and Europe? Probably not enough to have much of an impact.
I suspect you will get your wish of the South African Government confiscating the land without compensation. I was merely trying to suggest a better deal for the White landowners, but I will accept your decision.No you do not get it
A governments credit worth is only as good as it ability to repay and its good faith record of respecting & enforcing the rule of law.
A bond is a legal contract, as is a land title
If the government does not respect the legal land title contract, investors expectations for them to respect the bond contract are zero
Nobody would bid on the bonds, if there is no bid , the bond holder can not sell them.
Therefore they are worthless
expropriation would also ensure South Africa is unable to borrow money for imports, You know medicine, oil etc and no company will invest capital there if the government is changing the rules on property rights
As I pointed out earlier
expropriation of the farm land will lead to an economic and humanitarian disaster
DO NOT imply you know what I would rather support or what I would rather not support
You will get it wrong
You imply that one of only those two choices is the best path forward
And that's the problem, because both of those two choices are one and the same. The current legal land title holder gets nothing
Any expropriation will end in disaster
???
Ha Ha
again you assume any path forward includes expropriation
I am not in line with anyone who thinks stealing from a legal title holder is acceptable or will end well
??????
Start with not taking their land from them
The best route forward??
Its a mess. Probably improve the populations education is job one
Maybe the government can slowly start buying up listed properties with fungible currency or gold & see if some small scale transfers work well
Imagine the nightmare if they do this mass expropriation and food output significantly declines because the skills to manage modern farms are lacking in the new owners ??
Let alone the lack of new machinery , fertilizers and fuel because the expropriation destroyed the countries credit and devalues the currency to pennies on the dollar (Rand??)???
Can you say "Famine" ?
look at the state of Venezuela's expropriated oil industry
Any instant stroke of the pen which transfers mass property to right a social wrong will end in disaster
Especially if paid for in worthless paper
A 3% bond for 30 years ???? Backed by the good faith of a government which just expropriated the land ?????
If it were not so frightening it would be funny
The anti-apartheid movement, as would be obvious to everybody but you, was about ending apartheid.Oh so you are admitting that the anti-apartheid movement wasn't about justice, but about loathing of Afrikaners?
One otherwise would expect those truly interested in social justice to apply it equally.
And when land is seized without compensation and nothing is said by those who previously were protesting about ending apartheid, for those of us who haven't been drinking the Koolaid it shows that it wasn't about social justice but about Afrikaners bad, ANC good.The anti-apartheid movement, as would be obvious to everybody but you, was about ending apartheid.
Your post was and is in conflict with logic. The anti-apartheid movement was about ending apartheid. I am not at all surprised that you supported Apartheid and subsequently support the white minority.And when land is seized without compensation and nothing is said by those who previously were protesting about ending apartheid, for those of us who haven't been drinking the Koolaid it shows that it wasn't about social justice but about Afrikaners bad, ANC good.
It is appalling but not surprising that seemingly you are untroubled, over the South African Parliament voting to seize property without compensation, and that your "solution" is to seize the property but incrementally pay for it over a 30 year period.
Perhaps you would be happy but I rather doubt that your neighbors would be if the Ministry of Transportation exercised a right of expropriation / compulsory purchase and instead of saying here is the cheque for fair market value for the property we have taken, said here is your first payment of a thirty year installment. Good luck purchasing a comparable property elsewhere tomorrow but perhaps if you are really lucky in thirty years. . . .
???I suspect you will get your wish of the South African Government confiscating the land without compensation.
My decision???I was merely trying to suggest a better deal for the White landowners, but I will accept your decision.
You gave it away??????Because I foresaw this happening, I gave away my property in South Africa, so I don't really care.
I guess divesting your self of property can be accomplished by giving it awayThat is why I divested myself of my property in South Africa
Oh Come onso I don't really care.
Does that also apply to Afrikaaners who seized farms in South Africa through colonization?And when land is seized without compensation and nothing is said by those who previously were ...
Silliness. Would this apply to Canada and the United States? What about Australia?Does that also apply to Afrikaaners who seized farms in South Africa through colonization?
If the majority of the population here was native and we were still in a democracy, then quite possibly yes.Silliness. Would this apply to Canada and the United States? What about Australia?
Aardie and laRue are just venting their frustrations that Apartheid fell. They are not doing anything about it.If the majority of the population here was native and we were still in a democracy, then quite possibly yes.
Same with the other two examples.
What are you doing about it? Except whining about making South Africa Great again?How would you know?
My larger issues are:
When an Afrikaner family has been in South Africa since 1660 how is that any different than a New Netherlands family who have been in New York since 1660? How are they any less an integral part of South Africa than the other family is part of the United States (or if they were later U.E.L. part of Canada)?
It is aberrant to the rule of law to seize property without fair market value compensation.
It is disgusting that people who campaigned against apartheid, after a number of years have gone by and the shoe is on the other foot, don't see this as likewise a serious moral issue.
Which sounds like you are saying that the anti-apartheid movement were a pack of hypocrites. If "anybody with half a brain has known that this would happen," but yet knowing that they forcefully pushed for it.Anybody with half a brain has known that this would happen.
You fail to understand logic. There is no equivalence between being anti-Apartheid and wanting the white farmers to hang on to their land. The blacks and coloured were severely repressed during Apartheid. There is no history of the white farmers being repressed by the black population.Which sounds like you are saying that the anti-apartheid movement were a pack of hypocrites. If "anybody with half a brain has known that this would happen," but yet knowing that they forcefully pushed for it.
You still choose to ignore:
When an Afrikaner family has been in South Africa since 1660 how is that any different than a New Netherlands family who have been in New York since 1660? How are they any less an integral part of South Africa than the other family is part of the United States (or if they were later U.E.L. part of Canada)?
It is aberrant to the rule of law to seize property without fair market value compensation.
It is disgusting that people who campaigned against apartheid, after a number of years have gone by and the shoe is on the other foot, don't see this as likewise a serious moral issue.
