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Blue Jays: 2015 edition

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shack

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AK-47 said:
How do you know its 3-5 minutes per game??
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Because I watch the games and even if they show him 50 times a game at approx 5 seconds each time that is just over 4 minutes. So not exact but a reasonably educated guess.

Just by watching TV, one has absolutely no idea how much time he stands and sits because he is on screen so little compared to the total time of the game.

You'll need to try harder to prove my claims totally wrong.

And it wasn't pedantic on my part as nad was using this insignificant detail as some kind of proof that Gibby is a poor manager. I was just calling him on it.
 
S

shack

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Nad Smith said:
I attend most of the home games. I sit on the first base side and can see the BJ dugout clearly. The manager gets up when a replay is being considered or to shake hands with a pitcher who has done a good job and is being taken out.
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So I guess you can't see how much time the opposing manager stands and sits for comparison.
 
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Nad Smith

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Nov 23, 2004
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Actually you can usually see the head of the visiting manager standing at the steps. Look Eddie...you and I want the Jays to win......I think the Jays could use a more energetic better manager - I think Tulowitzki should be moved out of the lead off spot...I think it was wrong to play Martin last nite rather than Navarro....I think Price was left in a couple of batters too long against the Yankees.......so please don't make it personal, these are just my opinions based on my observations. As for the sitting thing, I always see Joe Girardi at the top of the dugout, Joe Madden the same, Terry Francona too and I think most managers. Heck I managed kids teams and I never sat down during the game and no more more than once or twice between innings. It is a sign (how important is debatable) of energy and caring and wanting to win.
 
S

shack

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Nad Smith said:
Actually you can usually see the head of the visiting manager standing at the steps. Look Eddie...you and I want the Jays to win......I think the Jays could use a more energetic better manager - I think Tulowitzki should be moved out of the lead off spot...I think it was wrong to play Martin last nite rather than Navarro....I think Price was left in a couple of batters too long against the Yankees.......so please don't make it personal, these are just my opinions based on my observations. As for the sitting thing, I always see Joe Girardi at the top of the dugout, Joe Madden the same, Terry Francona too and I think most managers. Heck I managed kids teams and I never sat down during the game and no more more than once or twice between innings. It is a sign (how important is debatable) of energy and caring and wanting to win.
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You think standing vs. sitting is an important determinant, I don't.

Which of those other managers has had two double digit winning streaks even with all of their standing (around)? Or is it the the players win in spite of the manager but lose because of the manager.
 
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AK-47

Armed to the tits
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In the 6
Yankees are losing 3-1 going into the 9th
 
S

shack

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continuation...

It is well accepted that baseball is a sport of controlled emotions, very unlike football, hockey and other sports. It seems to me that his calmness indicates a quiet confidence in his team, just as you want your players to play with confidence but to stay within themselves.

Tell me, what is he like in the locker room with the players? How is he with the players pre-game, around the batting cage, practices, team meetings, flights? Is during a game the only time a manager has an influence on his team? Maybe having a heart to heart with a struggling player is more effective than rooting for him from the top step of the dugout.

Sorry, and don't think this is personal, but whether he stands or sits means shit. You are entitled to not like him as a manager but to try to justify it by his lack of vertical time is hard to take seriously.
 
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gcostanza

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Jul 24, 2010
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shack said:
continuation...

It is well accepted that baseball is a sport of controlled emotions, very unlike football, hockey and other sports. It seems to me that his calmness indicates a quiet confidence in his team, just as you want your players to play with confidence but to stay within themselves.

Tell me, what is he like in the locker room with the players? How is he with the players pre-game, around the batting cage, practices, team meetings, flights? Is during a game the only time a manager has an influence on his team? Maybe having a heart to heart with a struggling player is more effective than rooting for him from the top step of the dugout.

Sorry, and don't think this is personal, but whether he stands or sits means shit. You are entitled to not like him as a manager but to try to justify it by his lack of vertical time is hard to take seriously.
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Cito Gaston was often criticized for being too unemotional, for sitting in the corner of the dugout watching, doing seemingly very little talking/coaching/leading.
Of course, after a while, he couldn't hear the complaints.
He had his 2 World Series Championship rings plugging his ears.
 
R

red

you must be fk'n kid'g me
Nov 13, 2001
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shack said:
Clearly a prime indication of whether a manger is doing a good job or not.

I really get some good laughs out of some of the comments posted.

BTW, what stats do you have on standing vs. sitting time for Gibbons in a game? You do realize he may be on camera a total of 3-5 minutes during a 2.5-3 hour game.
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If you check elias- no manager who sits more than five minutes each inning has ever won a world series
 
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AK-47

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In the 6
YES!!!!!!!!!

Jays 1.5 back now
 
S

shack

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Nad Smith said:
As for the sitting thing, I always see Joe Girardi at the top of the dugout, Joe Madden the same, Terry Francona too and I think most managers. Heck I managed kids teams and I never sat down during the game and no more more than once or twice between innings. It is a sign (how important is debatable) of energy and caring and wanting to win.
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Girardi staged a nice tantrum in the 8th to get thrown out. Yanks lose.
 
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Nad Smith

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Nov 23, 2004
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I do not necessarily think that the sitting issue is a big determinant. I would say it is part of a pattern and I find it unusual. I also gave several concrete Gibbons decisions which I think were and are wrong.

Just watched the last few innings of the Indians Yankees game....Francona standing all the time, girardi too until he got tossed showing emotion.

Eddie, you are right that I do not KNOW that Gibbons is a bad manager....my observations as a long time baseball fan make me THINK he is a bad manager.......and I think the Jays could have done better when they hired him...and he has no track record to speak of.

And it does seem that the players are ignoring him..or at least don`t shake his hand when they homer. Great thing about baseball...arguments can be fun.
 
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AK-47

Armed to the tits
Mar 6, 2009
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Nad is right about one thing, Gibby doesnt gave a very good lifetime managerial record. Its barely over .500
 
S

shack

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Magic # is 44.

Maybe in a few weeks people will finally be able take my year long countdown seriously.
 
I

Ironhead

Son of the First Nation
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.... in addition to the Yankees, the Orioles and Angels lost also.
 
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