As a native English speaker knowing what they are saying it is next to impossible to understand. Less than convincing that Russian pilots should have been able to understand them.
Turkey downs Russian plane over Syria
- Thread starter Twister
- Start date
That would not be wise on Turkey's part the Russian Air Force would attack the Turkish fighter-bombers. Turkey wouldn't have the shield of the North Atlantic Treaty, and things would rapidly go to Hell in a hand cart!
Sounds to me like an airport limo being dispatched. What an appallingly useless warning. Is their radio equipment from the Ottoman emplire? Aso I heard at most 2 warnings vs the 10 the Turks claim they made. Surely there must be more sources that heard this..
Yes, is that true? I saw a pic on CNN of a pilot face down on the ground and dead from gun fire (was bloodied).
The Nazis did that to parachuting allied pilots or bomb crews.
Racist bullshit. The Turkmen aren't savages.
And as for the actual savages, ISIS, it isn't clear that Russia is actually even targeting them. Certainly they weren't targeting ISIS when they were shot down, they were bombing Turkmen civilians.
So maybe the Russians are the savages in this case...
Don't use big words you don't understand. Proportionality refers to civilian casualties that are incidental to an attack on a military target. The concept has no bearing whatsoever on shooting down a military plane.
Russia attacked ethnic Turk civilians and flew over Turkish territory to do it. While certainly the Turkish response isn't going to deescalate anything, Turkey was well onside the lawful use of force in armed conflict.
Russia can't project force into Syria nearly as well as Turkey can. Turkey can easily turn Syria into Afghan 2 for Putin. Having a big border with Syria is a huge advantage.
Unless Putin invades Turkey this is unwinnable for Russia, the way Pakistan made Afghanistan unwinnable for the US.
Putin really fucked this up.
The "Democratic Opposition" were the ones who released the video of their fighters screaming Allah Akbar over the body of the Russian Officer and talking about how they had shot at him and the co-pilot.
In 1949 there was a new Geneva Convention signed, and one of the issues it specifically addressed stemming from World War II, was that shooting at parachuting aircrew was a War Crime. It also specifically said that this did not cover paratroopers.
Respectfully Fuji I disagree. Not unless Turkey wants to declare war on Russia. In which case things would probably go well for Turkey for the first few weeks. . . but after that it would be an entirely different story.
Turks would have to have a death wish to declare war on Russia. There's now way NATO would back them up. Not with this president, not with the Muslims flooding Europe and putting pressure on the Union. The Eastern European NATO members will never support Turkey in a conflict with Russia.
This is pretty key to my view of the incident. Russia has been bombing all of Assad's enemies and according to the news, ISIS was not operating anywhere near the area the plane was. There were Turkmen rebels backed by Turkey operating there though and Russia has bombed them before. Seems to me like Turkey used the brief violation as a justification for the shooting down.
Worth mentioning though is that since Syria is an active war zone, Turkey wouldn't have waited until the Russian planes crossed the border to warn them off.
Hypocrite Turkey violate Greek Airspace
A formation of six Turkish fighter jets violated Greek national air space in the northeastern, central and southeastern Aegean on Wednesday, defense officials said.
The Turkish jets, which were flanked on one side by another aircraft that was not a part of the formation, carried out a total of 20 transgressions, the defense officials said, adding that two of the aircraft were armed and that one dogfight occurred.
In all cases, the Turkish jets were chased off by Greek aircraft.
http://www.ekathimerini.com/199572/article/ekathimerini/news/turkish-jets-violate-greek-air-space
A formation of six Turkish fighter jets violated Greek national air space in the northeastern, central and southeastern Aegean on Wednesday, defense officials said.
The Turkish jets, which were flanked on one side by another aircraft that was not a part of the formation, carried out a total of 20 transgressions, the defense officials said, adding that two of the aircraft were armed and that one dogfight occurred.
In all cases, the Turkish jets were chased off by Greek aircraft.
http://www.ekathimerini.com/199572/article/ekathimerini/news/turkish-jets-violate-greek-air-space
The image speaks for itself.
Aardie, how accurate is this SAM?
Can decoy flares confuse targeting?
Nonsense. The area they were bombing is where the illegal oil trade occurs. These Turkmen are part of that trade and therefore facilitate ISIS. The Americans have ZERO credibility on ANYTHING to do with Syria. Their lies are becoming more and more obvious. Even your beloved Israel said it was obvious form the flight profile there was no intention to attack Turkey. Are you again calling the Israelis liars and morally bankrupt?
By many accounts of analysts this is a pretty damn accurate system. It also CAN target F-22 and B-2 with the new Big Bird radar system (if that is deployed) flares are useless against this system as the missiles have active radar terminal guidance. As I said before I expect Putin will ask all "partners" politely to communicate their operations within S400 kill zone to prevent any tragic accidents. He has no choice but to protect his assets and would wish to avoid any incidents with French and American planes. (which is actually true) but will force them to provide him with their targets and flight paths before hand.
