Reverie

Trump gets a $355 million kick to the crotch, will he pay up?

mandrill

monkey
Aug 23, 2001
79,688
102,217
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What lender ever accepts an owner’s valuation? And remember he PAID BACK THE LOAN. So where is the fraud? The lender decides the value. Not the owner.
But he got a lower interest rate - or access to the loan $. And some of the debts were not paid back. He went bankrupt and screwed creditors a lot.
 

madappl3s

Active member
Oct 6, 2022
138
126
43
Buffalo New York
You might see that in your dreams. There is a new word out there, errogant. It's when someone is seriously wrong, but are to wrapped up in themselves to admit it. Smelvis and his crowd fit that definition🤡...
Your opinion is noted but answer my question. When this gets overturned how mad will you people be?
 
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Butler1000

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2011
31,415
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Once again you are applying BUTLER logic instead of reality. IF YOU misrepresent and lie on a mortgage application, YOU CAN be charged with FRAUD!!! That's it, case closed, that is reality. Sure in most cases the bank requires an appraisal but that has nothing to do with if you lie on an application you can be charged with fraud.
What's the lie? Real estate value is fluid. And the bank testified the were just fine.
 
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y2kmark

Class of 69...
May 19, 2002
18,995
5,409
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Lewiston, NY
What lender ever accepts an owner’s valuation? And remember he PAID BACK THE LOAN. So where is the fraud? The lender decides the value. Not the owner.
Wow! Like to see details on where Trump ever "paid back" a loan - rolled over, maybe...
 

rhuarc29

Well-known member
Apr 15, 2009
9,682
1,367
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Except doesn't he have to come up with the cash in order to appeal?
If he doesn't appeal he can declare bankruptcy again or try to cheat the judge watching his business.
But if he appeals...
When has Trump ever declared bankruptcy?
 

WyattEarp

Well-known member
May 17, 2017
7,983
2,512
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But devalued his properties to the city and insurer to pay as little as possible.
I'm kind of surprised to see this comment from you. From our MERB days, you seemed to fashion yourself as a successful business person. By the way you got very chummy with the girls, I suspect you might have been focused on the sales and marketing side. So perhaps you can be pardoned if you weren't directly engaged in the financial and accounting side.

As Butler noted, there are routinely different appraisals for different purposes. There is never any legal requirement they all reconcile. When this charge was first announced, some members were trying to make the case that Trump was defrauding the city and county on his real estate tax basis. This would be very difficult to do. There might be different perspectives on value, but County Appraisers make the determination not the property owner and his appraisers. The county appraisal will be subject to all sorts of mechanisms/limitations and not directly reflect market values. When a property is sold, the property will be re-assessed.

Bank appraisals, insurance appraisals and all down the line will all have different methodologies based on their varying business objectives.

This Judge sounded to me like an anti-Trump avenger who simply decided to throw out the business principles in a case regarding private business transactions.

Jalimon, you are a world class monger and you represent the values of TERB. That's a good thing...... a fair thing. Others just come to TERB to carry their political torch to more and more social media sites.
 

WyattEarp

Well-known member
May 17, 2017
7,983
2,512
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A big quebec fast food chain got caught a few years ago because they were fraudulently reporting 4 times more hot dog buns buying then sausages… At some point your lying in values still needs to make sense.
No offense, but I think you're trying to shoehorn an analogy here.

Palm Beach real estate isn't even in the same universe as hot dog buns.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
95,818
24,509
113
I'm kind of surprised to see this comment from you. From our MERB days, you seemed to fashion yourself as a successful business person. By the way you got very chummy with the girls, I suspect you might have been focused on the sales and marketing side. So perhaps you can be pardoned if you weren't directly engaged in the financial and accounting side.

As Butler noted, there are routinely different appraisals for different purposes. There is never any legal requirement they all reconcile. When this charge was first announced, some members were trying to make the case that Trump was defrauding the city and county on his real estate tax basis. This would be very difficult to do. There might be different perspectives on value, but County Appraisers make the determination not the property owner and his appraisers. The county appraisal will be subject to all sorts of mechanisms/limitations and not directly reflect market values. When a property is sold, the property will be re-assessed.

Bank appraisals, insurance appraisals and all down the line will all have different methodologies based on their varying business objectives.

This Judge sounded to me like an anti-Trump avenger who simply decided to throw out the business principles in a case regarding private business transactions.

Jalimon, you are a world class monger and you represent the values of TERB. That's a good thing...... a fair thing. Others just come to TERB to carry their political torch to more and more social media sites.
Trump broke the law.
The law is clear, you can't lie to banks, insurance companies and IRS giving different valuations of your property to avoid paying interest, insurance and taxes.

The evidence has been publicly known for years, its just taken this long to hit the courts.

Why would you be against elitists having to abide by the same rules and laws as the rest of us?
 

jalimon

Well-known member
Jan 10, 2016
7,753
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No offense, but I think you're trying to shoehorn an analogy here.

Palm Beach real estate isn't even in the same universe as hot dog buns.
Just trying to point out you can play a bit in a grey zone with your accountants, banks, etc... But if you overdo it you will eventually get caught.

Trump has fraud everything he could for years and years...

If Trump was really rich he would have been so dangerous. Imagine a Bezos or Gates with the mental disorder of Trump :(
 

WyattEarp

Well-known member
May 17, 2017
7,983
2,512
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Just trying to point out you can play a bit in a grey zone with your accountants, banks, etc... But if you overdo it you will eventually get caught.

Trump has fraud everything he could for years and years...

If Trump was really rich he would have been so dangerous. Imagine a Bezos or Gates with the mental disorder of Trump :(
No offense again, but you are not saying anything specifically. Yeah, there are grey zones and most of them don't amount to illegality.

Another prominent member recently made the almost child-like argument I'm fine with going after Trump people because rich people get away with too much. This is the age-old many rich people are bad sentiment. Clearly, this about getting Trump as this case is unprecedented. In other words, no other "rich" people are being prosecuted for such matters. It would be naive to think that these situations don't exist elsewhere. We also know this Trump appraisal situation existed before Trump was President.

In any event, it doesn't matter how any of us feel about this. The court decision will likely be overturned or retried. The large fine will not stand.
 
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