Trump gets a $355 million kick to the crotch, will he pay up?

[Butler1000]

I guess you never heard of mortgage fraud? Yup, it is amazing what we can and can't do eh? LOL

Watch Out for Mortgage Fraud | Financial Services Regulatory Authority of Ontario

Watch Out for Mortgage Fraud Knowingly misrepresenting facts on an application, whether with or without the knowledge of your home buying team, is mortgage fraud. And the consequences may be severe. Providing accurate information on your mortgage application and using a licensed mortgage agent...

www.fsrao.ca

Squeezer the point is the banks send out people to do their own due diligence. And twll the client, or negotiate the value. Then a loan is issued in the 40%-50% of value range. And in this case the bank testified they were satisfied with the deal, and all monies paid.

As well the city also would have done their own assessments for taxes and fees, and told them what it was worth. If they didn't its on them. Real estate value is fluid, that's why its done this way. And has been done this way BY EVERYONE IN NY for a century.

If the prosecutor only goes after Trump, leaving aside all politics, its a targeted witch hunt and imo grounds for appeal.

 

[squeezer]

Squeezer the point is the banks send out people to do their own due diligence. And twll the client, or negotiate the value. Then a loan is issued in the 40%-50% of value range. And in this case the bank testified they were satisfied with the deal, and all monies paid.

As well the city also would have done their own assessments for taxes and fees, and told them what it was worth. If they didn't its on them. Real estate value is fluid, that's why its done this way. And has been done this way BY EVERYONE IN NY for a century.

If the prosecutor only goes after Trump, leaving aside all politics, its a targeted witch hunt and imo grounds for appeal.

So, therefore, you can lie on a mortgage application and not risk being charged for fraud is what you're telling me?

 

[squeezer]

Can't be fraud when legal steps by the bank has to be taken before accepting said deal. Everyone has a legal right to value their own assets at whatever price they like.

I guess you didn't read what I provided you, here, let me help

Knowingly misrepresenting facts on an application, whether with or without the knowledge of your home buying team, is mortgage fraud. And the consequences may be severe. Providing accurate information on your mortgage application and using a licensed mortgage agent or broker can help you avoid being involved in mortgage fraud. But there are some red flags that should alert you that something isn’t right and it’s your responsibility to be aware.

 

[Butler1000]

So, therefore, you can lie on a mortgage application and not risk being charged for fraud is what you're telling me?

He didn't lie on a mortgage application. It was loans on owned properties. Banks do their own assessments. From what I read in the trial the bank was satisfied with the loan terms.

We are talking about the difference in what the different entities value real estate at.

In the case of my house, the city says its worth X for taxes, the insurance company worth Y for rates, the Bank worth Z for a credit line, and then finally a buyer says AA for what they want to pay. And every single one is different. And the differnce is $100,000s

So who is right? Does this mean the city/province can come back to me(or you) after you sell, say "hey, we assessed wrong, you are going to be fined $200,000." Plus back taxes? Or even 20 years from now?

And like I said, this is the standard, the entities are the ones who establish value, not the owner. Its basic due diligence.

 

[jalimon]

by the way, speaking of insurance, make sure you guys double check the reconstruction value of your house. I rent a house i own which had a small fire recently. The insurance representative told me my house was insured for completed reconstruction up to 250k. He told me it was easily 50 to 75k under current reconstruction price. I adjusted that for 16$ more per year!!!!

 

[squeezer]

He didn't lie on a mortgage application. It was loans on owned properties. Banks do their own assessments. From what I read in the trial the bank was satisfied with the loan terms.

We are talking about the difference in what the different entities value real estate at.

In the case of my house, the city says its worth X for taxes, the insurance company worth Y for rates, the Bank worth Z for a credit line, and then finally a buyer says AA for what they want to pay. And every single one is different. And the differnce is $100,000s

So who is right? Does this mean the city/province can come back to me(or you) after you sell, say "hey, we assessed wrong, you are going to be fined $200,000." Plus back taxes? Or even 20 years from now?

And like I said, this is the standard, the entities are the ones who establish value, not the owner. Its basic due diligence.

Your home has a market value. If it is appraised it is so at today's market value. You do not get to tell a lender your home is worth 5M while in reality, it is worth only 1.2M. If you do so on an application it can be looked at as an attempt to garner more funds, in other words, a FRAUD.

 

[carvesg]

I'm still trying to figure out a crime here.

He gave a valuation for property to a bank. They agreed and loaned him money based on that. And he paid all the money back. The Bank testified as much in the trial. It's pretty much what every single real estate investor in the world does.

I see, with the prosecutor's comments leading up, a pretty good appeal case.

But trump gave a much lower value evaluation for tax purposes.

Would you like to have your property taxes at 75% of it value tomorrow morning?

The value of his buildings were valued below market for taxation but over valued for loan and insurance purposes.

Allowed trump to save on tax but gain leverage with a higher equity to do business. No American bank wanted to lend him money after the bankruptcy with his 2 Atlantic city casinos , so he went to Europe the get his backing.

Who in hell can bankrupt a casino which is a printing machine ? Only building to go belly up in Toronto after the 2008 financial crisis in the US was managed by .... ? Only Hotel in Vancouver to go down in decades in one of the highest touristic city in Canada ? Trump international Hotel . And the list goes on and on and on

 

[jalimon]

Which is, again, something every single real estate investor does. Hell my house is undervalued by the city for tax purposes, BY THEM. And insurance companies send out people, just like banks, to make their own assessments, just like they did to my house.

As real estate pricing is fluid, this is just common practice. I'm trying to see a victim here, when all parties were paid in full, according to their own assessments, and on time.

And will she now go after all the rest?

the difference is the scale. There will always be differences from value tax wise to the cities versus insurance versus market resell value.

A big quebec fast food chain got caught a few years ago because they were fraudulently reporting 4 times more hot dog buns buying then sausages… At some point your lying in values still needs to make sense.

 

[mandrill]

He didn't lie on a mortgage application. It was loans on owned properties. Banks do their own assessments. From what I read in the trial the bank was satisfied with the loan terms.

We are talking about the difference in what the different entities value real estate at.

In the case of my house, the city says its worth X for taxes, the insurance company worth Y for rates, the Bank worth Z for a credit line, and then finally a buyer says AA for what they want to pay. And every single one is different. And the differnce is $100,000s

So who is right? Does this mean the city/province can come back to me(or you) after you sell, say "hey, we assessed wrong, you are going to be fined $200,000." Plus back taxes? Or even 20 years from now?

And like I said, this is the standard, the entities are the ones who establish value, not the owner. Its basic due diligence.

Due diligence is beside the point. Trump was grossly inflating values to obtain better deals at better rates.

And the banks did not always get paid back.

 

[mandrill]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1759622903832723486

Giuliani is himself going down with massive civil judgments. He needs Trump to get elected to save his own ass.

 

[Not getting younger]

Squeezer the point is the banks send out people to do their own due diligence. And twll the client, or negotiate the value. Then a loan is issued in the 40%-50% of value range. And in this case the bank testified they were satisfied with the deal, and all monies paid.

As well the city also would have done their own assessments for taxes and fees, and told them what it was worth. If they didn't its on them. Real estate value is fluid, that's why its done this way. And has been done this way BY EVERYONE IN NY for a century.

If the prosecutor only goes after Trump, leaving aside all politics, its a targeted witch hunt and imo grounds for appeal.

ask people what happens when they get into a bidding war and sign legal documents to pay the seller 1,400,000. Then ask a bank for 1,000,000 mtg with 40% down.

And the bank says um, no, that house is only worth 1,150,000. Not sure how people think things work.

 

[jalimon]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1759605746394714434

Never ever politicize your work because it will come and haunt you one day. Politics, religion and your sexual life should stay at home.

 

[Phatazluvr123]

Trump has it to pay and when he takes the White House again he will just line his pockets just like the Dems robbing people blind now

 

[madappl3s]

That thought cost rump half a billion.
You should definitely try it in court some day.

I will, and use the precedent that will be set when the slam dunk appeal happens. But seriously, how mad are you going to be when this was all for naught?

 

[JuanGoodman]

But seriously, how mad are you going to be when this was all for naught?

I'm sure he won't be mad at all

just like after so many other charges that proved to be nothing

by then, MSM will have another headline for lefties to follow

just like a cat chasing the red dot laser light

 

[y2kmark]

I will, and use the precedent that will be set when the slam dunk appeal happens. But seriously, how mad are you going to be when this was all for naught?

You might see that in your dreams. There is a new word out there, errogant. It's when someone is seriously wrong, but are to wrapped up in themselves to admit it. Smelvis and his crowd fit that definition...

 

[Butler1000]

But trump gave a much lower value evaluation for tax purposes.

Would you like to have your property taxes at 75% of it value tomorrow morning?

The value of his buildings and does this. valued below market for taxation but over valued for loan and insurance purposes.

Allowed trump to save on tax but gain leverage with a higher equity to do business. No American bank wanted to lend him money after the bankruptcy with his 2 Atlantic city casinos , so he went to Europe the get his backing.

Who in hell can bankrupt a casino which is a printing machine ? Only building to go belly up in Toronto after the 2008 financial crisis in the US was managed by .... ? Only Hotel in Vancouver to go down in decades in one of the highest touristic city in Canada ? Trump international Hotel . And the list goes on and on and on

The city did its own valuation and accepted the number. My own house is way undervalued as well for taxes. If you own look at yours, Its the same. In fact it's about 60% last I looked. My insurance has a different value. My bank a third for a credit line. And my real estate agent a fourth for when I sell.

Which is correct?

As to his business acumen, sure he fucked up. So what? I personally don't care about whether he has money. But there is no victim, no one was actually defrauded. All parties agreed to the valuations. Seriously all these large entities have assessors who do due diligence and give their own numbers. Especially with large loans. Its just common practice. Every single real estate investor goes through this.

 

[Butler1000]

the difference is the scale. There will always be differences from value tax wise to the cities versus insurance versus market resell value.

A big quebec fast food chain got caught a few years ago because they were fraudulently reporting 4 times more hot dog buns buying then sausages… At some point your lying in values still needs to make sense.

The scale in this case is meaningless because all parties do their own valuation. Seriously you think the city just accepts an owner’s numbers? A bank? An insurance company? And if a valuation is agreed upon by these entities then where is the problem?

 

[Butler1000]

Your home has a market value. If it is appraised it is so at today's market value. You do not get to tell a lender your home is worth 5M while in reality, it is worth only 1.2M. If you do so on an application it can be looked at as an attempt to garner more funds, in other words, a FRAUD.

What lender ever accepts an owner’s valuation? And remember he PAID BACK THE LOAN. So where is the fraud? The lender decides the value. Not the owner.

 

[squeezer]

What lender ever accepts an owner’s valuation? And remember he PAID BACK THE LOAN. So where is the fraud? The lender decides the value. Not the owner.

Once again you are applying BUTLER logic instead of reality. IF YOU misrepresent and lie on a mortgage application, YOU CAN be charged with FRAUD!!! That's it, case closed, that is reality. Sure in most cases the bank requires an appraisal but that has nothing to do with if you lie on an application you can be charged with fraud.