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Trudeau says he doesn't understand why NDP is pulling back from carbon price support

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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So what is "fair share" when you refer to "rich people" paying it?
And then explain why someone owes you money just because they make more of it than you do without sounding like a Communist?
You should start with stating at what point do people not want to eat the rich.
Massive divide between rich and poor usually leads to rebellion.

Why do you keep defending the people who take your money?
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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Their companies pay taxes and so do they. Feeling entitled to someone else's wealth is simply socialist greed.
You must be the guy at the big party table at the restaurant who pays only the price of his entree, not the tax, not the tip and not the shared appetizers.
Right wingers always want other people to pay the bill.

The idea of fair share is just foreign to you.
 
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Skoob

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2022
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I said the fact that they pay 0 is unacceptable. Their companies are a different entity. Basically the fact that billionaires exist amongst us is in and of itself an aberration. As such most of what they earn should be given back to the public.
Why should innovators who have taken risks and made good decisions be punished?
Does anyone force you to buy their products and services?

Have you taken a moment to reflect on why they are wealthy in the first place or are you just skipping that part and moving directly to socialist entitlement to someone else's money?
 

Skoob

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2022
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You must be the guy at the big party table at the restaurant who pays only the price of his entree, not the tax, not the tip and not the shared appetizers.
Right wingers always want other people to pay the bill.

The idea of fair share is just foreign to you.
And you still can't explain what you mean by "fair share".
You know why?
Because that would only have you admit to be the Communist we all know you are.

Think I'm wrong?

Go ahead...explain what "fair share" is. Not conceptually...mathematically in financial terms. Then justify your answer.

I'll wait for your inevitable distraction comrade.
 

bver_hunter

Well-known member
Nov 5, 2005
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And you still can't explain what you mean by "fair share".
You know why?
Because that would only have you admit to be the Communist we all know you are.

Think I'm wrong?

Go ahead...explain what "fair share" is. Not conceptually...mathematically in financial terms. Then justify your answer.

I'll wait for your inevitable distraction comrade.
Let's take this example:
Food retailers earned net income of almost $6 billion in 2022, compared to $2.4 billion in 2019, and an average of $1.8 billion per year in the five years before COVID. In the first nine months of 2023, food retailers earned $4.6 billion; year-total profits for 2023 at that rate will exceed $6 billion.
.

Now in your opinion is this fine as long as it is a Food Giant doing it while the average Canadian is really struggling to put some food on the table?

In Europe including the UK there is what is known as a "Windfall" Tax on Corporations that reaped the rewards from Covid Pandemic and also the war in Ukraine:

What European Countries Are Doing about Windfall Profit Taxes


In other words does that make all those EU nations "Communist"?

How about Corporate Tax difference between The USA and Canada:

In Canada, most small businesses operate a C Corporations. This is surprising to Americans who are double taxed at at very high rates when using C Corps.

There are two reasons C Corps work in Canada:

  1. The federal corporate tax rate is much lower (15% in Canada vs 34-35% in the US - yes, only 15% - you American read that correctly)
  2. The small business deduction reduces the federal corporate tax rate to 11% on the first $500,000 in taxable income
Provinces also have a regular rate and small business deduction rate. In Alberta, for example, the rate is 3% on the first $500,000 (14% combined federal and provincial) and 12% above that (27% combined federal and provincial). Provincial rates in Canada are higher than state rates in the US, but the combined rates are still much lower in Canada.

Wow, then the USA is also considered to be "Communist" by the alt right wingers!!
 

roddermac

Well-known member
Sep 17, 2023
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You should start with stating at what point do people not want to eat the rich.
Massive divide between rich and poor usually leads to rebellion.

Why do you keep defending the people who take your money?
Those Pharma companies you defend also make billions off of the so called science you choose to believe. Why aren't you attacking them as well.
 

JohnLarue

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2005
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You should start with stating at what point do people not want to eat the rich.
Massive divide between rich and poor usually leads to rebellion.

Why do you keep defending the people who take your money?
because they offer something in return , something you demand.
and there is always competition
if you feel Starbucks is ripping you off , go to Tim Hortons for the warm water strained through imported beans you crave but do not really need.

Massive divide between rich and poor usually leads to rebellion.
no, rebellions start when people are unable to afford to feed, or shelter, cloth their families
rebellions start when dead bodies start piling up from starvation
jeff bezoes making more money does not cause that, ,,,, you do not need amazon, but choose to make him richer if you choose to use amazon

govt taking 50% via payroll taxes, sales taxes & hidden taxes & then wasting a lot of it is the real villain
they are taxing you on the basic building block of life CO2, for christ sake and you seem quite pleased about that


1713436010164.png
 

JohnLarue

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2005
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I think the primary gripe is with the super rich. Like Elon Musk, paying very low taxes. Like Jeff Bezos paying 0 in income taxes.
don't buy their products / services then

if Elon makes an extra billion, does it affect your std of living ?
No it does not
if you expect to share in his success, buy tesla stock


envy/ spite is not a foundation for any policy let alone taxation policy
time to grow up
 
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JohnLarue

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2005
16,438
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I said the fact that they pay 0 is unacceptable. Their companies are a different entity. Basically the fact that billionaires exist amongst us is in and of itself an aberration. As such most of what they earn should be given back to the public.

the fact that billionaires exist amongst us is a result of the innovations that provide you with the std of living you enjoy

how many of the great innovations you enjoy originated from the Soviet Union?
are you a fan of the Lada?
 

Kautilya

It Doesn't Matter What You Think!
May 12, 2023
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the fact that billionaires exist amongst us is a result of the innovations that provide you with the std of living you enjoy

how many of the great innovations you enjoy originated from the Soviet Union?
are you a fan of the Lada?
No. It has nothing to do with innovations but everything to do with predatory business practices.
don't buy their products / services then

if Elon makes an extra billion, does it affect your std of living ?
No it does not
if you expect to share in his success, buy tesla stock


envy/ spite is not a foundation for any policy let alone taxation policy
time to grow up
Why not? I can buy their products/services, but I can also demand they pay their taxes that every citizen is supposed to pay. Nothing to do with envy or spite.
 

Skoob

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2022
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Let's take this example:


.

Now in your opinion is this fine as long as it is a Food Giant doing it while the average Canadian is really struggling to put some food on the table?

In Europe including the UK there is what is known as a "Windfall" Tax on Corporations that reaped the rewards from Covid Pandemic and also the war in Ukraine:

What European Countries Are Doing about Windfall Profit Taxes


In other words does that make all those EU nations "Communist"?

How about Corporate Tax difference between The USA and Canada:




Wow, then the USA is also considered to be "Communist" by the alt right wingers!!
That's nice. But doesn't explain what "fair share" means in terms of wealthier people having to pay more taxes. What is considered "fair share"?

In Ontario if someone makes more than $220k their income tax rate is 46% (federal: 33% Prov: 13%). So right off the bat, the government is taking almost half your earned income. Is that fair or unfair?
Middle class is taxed at roughly 35%. Is that a "fair share" in comparison?
Should wealthier people pay more than half of what they earn just because they earn more? If you think yes, then explain how that is fair?

As far as companies...they are in business to make money for their shareholders. As part of that, they need to employ people to support their business otherwise they go under. You can choose to buy their products or not. No one is forcing you. So complaining about profits without taking everything into consideration as a big picture is naive.
If for example Loblaws would shut down tomorrow, 200,000+ people would be unemployed. Think about the effects on the economy that would have.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
81,373
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no, rebellions start when people are unable to afford to feed, or shelter, cloth their families
Have you seen the amounts of tents in parks over the last few years?
Have you read the stats on food bank useage?


.

The US is debating whether its illegal to be poor and homeless.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
81,373
18,077
113
That's nice. But doesn't explain what "fair share" means in terms of wealthier people having to pay more taxes. What is considered "fair share"?

In Ontario if someone makes more than $220k their income tax rate is 46% (federal: 33% Prov: 13%). So right off the bat, the government is taking almost half your earned income. Is that fair or unfair?
Middle class is taxed at roughly 35%. Is that a "fair share" in comparison?
Should wealthier people pay more than half of what they earn just because they earn more? If you think yes, then explain how that is fair?

As far as companies...they are in business to make money for their shareholders. As part of that, they need to employ people to support their business otherwise they go under. You can choose to buy their products or not. No one is forcing you. So complaining about profits without taking everything into consideration as a big picture is naive.
If for example Loblaws would shut down tomorrow, 200,000+ people would be unemployed. Think about the effects on the economy that would have.
Yes, we get it.
You are a sociopath unable to understand the concept of 'fair share', 'public good' or the 'the commons'.

The debate about what makes an equitable society is real, but you have to not try to be a right wing troll if you want to discuss it.

Start from this point:
If you have a full time job in Canada do you think your salary should be enough to pay for housing, food, transportation and basic needs?
 

Skoob

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2022
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Yes, we get it.
You are a sociopath unable to understand the concept of 'fair share', 'public good' or the 'the commons'.

The debate about what makes an equitable society is real, but you have to not try to be a right wing troll if you want to discuss it.

Start from this point:
If you have a full time job in Canada do you think your salary should be enough to pay for housing, food, transportation and basic needs?
Sounds like you can't explain what "fair share" means.

You can stop distracting by calling people names anytime...it's not working for you.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
81,373
18,077
113
Sounds like you can't explain what "fair share" means.

You can stop distracting by calling people names anytime...it's not working for you.
Start from this point:
If you have a full time job in Canada do you think your salary should be enough to pay for housing, food, transportation and basic needs?
 

Skoob

Well-known member
Jun 1, 2022
3,532
1,649
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Start from this point:
If you have a full time job in Canada do you think your salary should be enough to pay for housing, food, transportation and basic needs?
Let's try one more time...what does "fair share" mean? Mathematically in financial terms. i.e. Someone making over $220k currently pays half of their earnings in taxes. What does "fair share" mean?
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
81,373
18,077
113
Let's try one more time...what does "fair share" mean? Mathematically in financial terms. i.e. Someone making over $220k currently pays half of their earnings in taxes. What does "fair share" mean?
You want a number instead of a concept.
You're trolling because you refuse to accept the concept of 'fair share'.
 

roddermac

Well-known member
Sep 17, 2023
559
302
63
don't buy their products / services then

if Elon makes an extra billion, does it affect your std of living ?
No it does not
if you expect to share in his success, buy tesla stock


envy/ spite is not a foundation for any policy let alone taxation policy
time to grow up
Ironic that the people defending a carbon tax and bitching about climate changer are the same people bitching about a man who's made his wealth building EVs
 
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