The Science is Settled: Big Oil Openly admits Climate change was real.

[JohnLarue]

]We do have the science and it is happening.

ah no we do not
not even close

the only real question is will it happen fast enough.

No actually, the question is when will green enery policy fall competely apart ?

1. this winter in Europe or
2. when EV market penitration hits 10-15% and the grids fail

yes we are dependent upon fossil fuels but even though demand for oil is increasing it is also the case that the transition is accelerating

accelerating to 4-5% is not at all impresive , certainly not considering the develoment costs and worst the cost to the taxpayer/ consumer
any further acceleration destroy the economy

and it is now an unstoppable wave

.
It will self implode

This is in spite of the best efforts of the deniers to derail it.

I see, those deniers are comitting blasphemy by questioning your new religion

 

[toguy5252]

If we had the technology, we would be there already. The deniers have no power. All the nations leaders have the power, but at COP 26, had to accept failure to get India and China, the two biggest burners of coal, on board.

It takes more than technology. It takes political and social will and the willingness to pay more for energy on the short run. Regrettably none of those factors are present in todays world. At least not in the US or China or other industrialized nations. A few countries in Scandinavia perhaps.

 

[Frankfooter]

Greenland ice sheet melt will raise the oceans 10 inches regardless of what we do now.

Greenland ice sheet climate disequilibrium and committed sea-level rise - Nature Climate Change

Greenland ice sheet melt is currently the largest single contributor to sea-level rise. This work combines observations and theory to show that Greenland ice sheet imbalance with recent climate (2000–2019) has already committed at least 3.3% ice volume loss, equivalent to 274 mm of global...

www.nature.com

 

[Charlie_]

It takes more than technology. It takes political and social will and the willingness to pay more for energy on the short run. Regrettably none of those factors are present in todays world. At least not in the US or China or other industrialized nations. A few countries in Scandinavia perhaps.

I agree, with have none of these. However, if the technology was cheap and efficient, we would all get on board. As it is, wind turbines and solar panels are super expensive.

 

[poker]

 

[oil&gas]

Do you think flooding and intense heat are a bigger
concern to people in Pakistan than poverty? I don't know
if they have set a net zero emission target but I suspect
they will be happy to import more oil at low cost so farmers
there don't have to plough their fields with cows but use
diesel-powered tractors instead.

I am not being insensitive to suffering of people hit
by natural disaster. But such reports of severe flooding
and rains are no more horrific than the death tolls of
hurricanes in Philippines reported every once in a while
I was exposed to while growing up in the 1970's (in a region
nearby). Life is indeed tough there in south east Asia but
people will adapt.

 

[JohnLarue]

View attachment 167611 View attachment 167612 View attachment 167613

Natural disasters are not on the rise
Media coverage is...
Gee who could have predicted the internet would increased the quantity (not quality) of media coverage ?

You have been duped with an intentional barage of UNPRECEDENTED propaganda

Here is a more realistic view based on data collected by the International Disaster Database (About | EM-DAT (emdat.be))

Why Disasters Have Declined (forbes.com)



meanwhile

oops, thats a fly in your ointment

 

[toguy5252]

I agree, with have none of these. However, if the technology was cheap and efficient, we would all get on board. As it is, wind turbines and solar panels are super expensive.

The cost of renewable energy is falling but it must fall further to promote large scale adoption. The will will follow the price.

 

[jcpro]

Natural disasters are not on the rise
Media coverage is...
Gee who could have predicted the internet would increased the quantity (not quality) of media coverage ?

You have been duped with an intentional barage of UNPRECEDENTED propaganda

Here is a more realistic view based on data collected by the International Disaster Database (About | EM-DAT (emdat.be))

Why Disasters Have Declined (forbes.com)

View attachment 167661

meanwhile

opps, thats a fly in your ointment

Quit with your damned numbers! You suppose to use your emotions.

 

[oil&gas]

The cost of renewable energy is falling but it must fall further to promote large scale adoption. The will will follow the price.

Possible only if the cost of extraction of fossil fuel along with
the mining of copper, iron, cobalt, nickel, aluminum and other
key metals fall from their current level to where they were
decades ago.

Conversion of fossil fuel infrastructure to renewable energy on a
global scale is possible only at low energy cost. It also requires
abundance of a variety of minerals which are no longer cheap. Ore
grade of iron, copper and pretty much all industrial metals are
way poorer than they were decades ago even if their resource
base is still huge. Looking to the near future transition to renewable
energy may still be possible for China. For they will have easier access
to the vast undeveloped natural gas resources in Russia and Iran which they
can use as the bridge fuel to phase out oil. Besides China will continue
burning coal without worrying about climate change to lower the cost
of manufacturing of renewable energy products. China also will likely
be more welcomed by Afghanistan to develop their lithium and resources
of other rare minerals which will make their exports of Tesla more price-
-competitive. We will have to export our oil, gas and coal to China in exchange
for their overpriced but still cheaper solar panels and EVs in our transition
away from fossil fuel.

 

[basketcase]

The science is anything but settled.
...

Yet none of that unsettledness is whether or not human produced greenhouse gases are negatively impacting our environment.

The only unsettled questions are about the exact amount human impact has and how much damage has already been done.

 

[basketcase]

Do you think flooding and intense heat are a bigger
concern to people in Pakistan than poverty?...

Yes. generally not drowning is more important than whether you will have enough food next week.

And I know it's complicated but that flooding has just created a whole shitload more poverty.

 

[oil&gas]

Yes. generally not drowning is more important than whether you will have enough food next week.

Not dying is more important than having enough food too. Thankfully
I am living in the part of the world where I worry more about how
sumptuous my next meal is than my impending death.

Don't you think people there and the rest of the developing world will suffer
less from natural disasters if they are lifted out of poverty? Think the
difference between living in squatters and in concrete buildings. And
think how we here in Canada could survive the winter if living on the
same per capita GDP as people in Pakistan and Bangladesh. Go tell
them to cut back on the burning of fossil fuel and cow dung and they
will be spared from natural disaster next year.

And I know it's complicated but that flooding has just created a whole shitload more poverty.

 

[toguy5252]

Possible only if the cost of extraction of fossil fuel along with
the mining of copper, iron, cobalt, nickel, aluminum and other
key metals fall from their current level to where they were
decades ago.

Conversion of fossil fuel infrastructure to renewable energy on a
global scale is possible only at low energy cost. It also requires
abundance of a variety of minerals which are no longer cheap. Ore
grade of iron, copper and pretty much all industrial metals are
way poorer than they were decades ago even if their resource
base is still huge. Looking to the near future transition to renewable
energy may still be possible for China. For they will have easier access
to the vast undeveloped natural gas resources in Russia and Iran which they
can use as the bridge fuel to phase out oil. Besides China will continue
burning coal without worrying about climate change to lower the cost
of manufacturing of renewable energy products. China also will likely
be more welcomed by Afghanistan to develop their lithium and resources
of other rare minerals which will make their exports of Tesla more price-
-competitive. We will have to export our oil, gas and coal to China in exchange
for their overpriced but still cheaper solar panels and EVs in our transition
away from fossil fuel.

No one is suggesting that the conversion will be easy or cheap or fast but it is happening and inevitable. Even if there are cheaters like China there will be a net decline in carbon entering the atmosphere over time. Will it be too little, too late? Time will tell.

 

[bazokajoe]

Interesting that governments are now suing big oil for climate damage. What about all you drivers who have driven gas powered vehicles all these years? How come we don’t sue you? You’re the ones actually polluting our air with your choice of vehicles and how come it’s all about the money with these lawsuits? Why isn’t government shutting down these companies? It’s just a big money grab no different than the tobacco and pharmaceutical lawsuits.

My first car was a hybrid back in the 80's. It burned gas and oil,lol.

 

[basketcase]

Not dying is more important than having enough food too. Thankfully
I am living in the part of the world where I worry more about how
sumptuous my next meal is than my impending death.

Don't you think people there and the rest of the developing world will suffer
less from natural disasters if they are lifted out of poverty? Think the
difference between living in squatters and in concrete buildings. And
think how we here in Canada could survive the winter if living on the
same per capita GDP as people in Pakistan and Bangladesh. Go tell
them to cut back on the burning of fossil fuel and cow dung and they
will be spared from natural disaster next year.

Your post is word salad. Yes, poverty is bad. Dying is worse. This unheard of level of flooding has created a massive amount of poverty among those that didn't drown.

No idea what point you're trying to even argue here.

 

[oil&gas]

Your post is word salad. Yes, poverty is bad. Dying is worse. This unheard of level of flooding has created a massive amount of poverty among those that didn't drown.

No idea what point you're trying to even argue here.

If I understand correctly the natural disaster I commented
on was posted in the context of climate change caused by the
deception of Big Oil and buying its products. My comments
were accordingly made with that in mind.

 

[JohnLarue]

If I understand correctly the natural disaster I commented
on was posted in the context of climate change caused by the
deception of Big Oil and buying its products. My comments
were accordingly made with that in mind.

Why Disasters Have Declined (forbes.com)

 

[poker]

Why Disasters Have Declined (forbes.com)

View attachment 167688

Forbes is not a reliable source. Most of your numbers come from questionable sources actually.

 

[poker]

Natural disasters are not on the rise
Media coverage is...
Gee who could have predicted the internet would increased the quantity (not quality) of media coverage ?

You have been duped with an intentional barage of UNPRECEDENTED propaganda

Here is a more realistic view based on data collected by the International Disaster Database (About | EM-DAT (emdat.be))

Why Disasters Have Declined (forbes.com)

View attachment 167661

meanwhile

oops, thats a fly in your ointment