The One State Solution Resource

gryfin

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Since Universal Human Rights is the only solution to the Palestinian/Israeli conflict, I thought it useful to provide a resource to access materials that explain the One State solution. I know there are those who oppose a solution that largely replicates Canadian values and we've heard from them ad nauseum. Let's start with what I regard as one of the best expositions of why the One State is already here and that the only solution is equal rights for all. Hardly controversial, right? Rest assured it will be for some on this board.

Here's the Two State Illusion by Ian Lustick

"History offers many such lessons. Britain ruled Ireland for centuries, annexing it in 1801. By the mid-19th century the entire British political class treated Ireland’s permanent incorporation as a fact of life. But bottled-up Irish fury produced repeated revolts. By the 1880s, the Irish question was the greatest issue facing the country; it led to mutiny in the army and near civil war before World War I. Once the war ended, it took only a few years until the establishment of an independent Ireland. What was inconceivable became a fact.

France ruled Algeria for 130 years and never questioned the future of Algeria as an integral part of France. But enormous pressures accumulated, exploding into a revolution that left hundreds of thousands dead. Despite France’s military victory over the rebels in 1959, Algeria soon became independent, and Europeans were evacuated from the country.

And when Mikhail S. Gorbachev sought to save Soviet Communism by reforming it with the policies of glasnost and perestroika, he relied on the people’s continuing belief in the permanence of the Soviet structure. But the forces for change that had already accumulated were overwhelming. Unable to separate freedom of expression and market reforms from the rest of the Soviet state project, Mr. Gorbachev’s policies pushed the system beyond its breaking point. Within a few years, both the Soviet Union and the Communist regime were gone."

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/15/opinion/sunday/two-state-illusion.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
 
A no state solution is better. The Palestinians have shown that have no intention of ever making peace or ever accepting the existence of Israel.

Time to start negotiations to return Gaza to Egypt, and the West Bank to Jordan.
 
Here is what was a ground breaking article at the time. Back in 2003, Tony Judt penned this prescient view of the road Zionism was taking Israel down.

"The time has come to think the unthinkable. The two-state solution—the core of the Oslo process and the present “road map”—is probably already doomed. With every passing year we are postponing an inevitable, harder choice that only the far right and far left have so far acknowledged, each for its own reasons. The true alternative facing the Middle East in coming years will be between an ethnically cleansed Greater Israel and a single, integrated, binational state of Jews and Arabs, Israelis and Palestinians. That is indeed how the hard-liners in Sharon’s cabinet see the choice; and that is why they anticipate the removal of the Arabs as the ineluctable condition for the survival of a Jewish state.

But what if there were no place in the world today for a “Jewish state”? What if the binational solution were not just increasingly likely, but actually a desirable outcome? It is not such a very odd thought. Most of the readers of this essay live in pluralist states which have long since become multiethnic and multicultural. “Christian Europe,” pace M. Valéry Giscard d’Estaing, is a dead letter; Western civilization today is a patchwork of colors and religions and languages, of Christians, Jews, Muslims, Arabs, Indians, and many others—as any visitor to London or Paris or Geneva will know.4

Israel itself is a multicultural society in all but name; yet it remains distinctive among democratic states in its resort to ethnoreligious criteria with which to denominate and rank its citizens. It is an oddity among modern nations not—as its more paranoid supporters assert—because it is a Jewish state and no one wants the Jews to have a state; but because it is a Jewish state in which one community—Jews—is set above others, in an age when that sort of state has no place."

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/2003/10/23/israel-the-alternative/
 
Let's not forget the truly beautiful get together at Temple Israel that featured the wonderful speech from Jonathan Kuttab. Who says there is not Palestinian leadership?

"I did not say non-Jewish. I said it has to be both Jewish and Arab and I wanted to know what do you need for that state to be Jewish enough for you without negating my identity and my rights as an Arab? I hear what you’re saying. And I want to say, make this my dream as well. Make me go along with that. Make this be part of the new state that I want to be a part of. I will know upfront that one of the attributes of this new state is the openness to any Jew anywhere to come– not only to be able to defend himself but to no longer need to defend himself because he is secure.

Right now he is not secure. Right now he is building so much ability to defend himself that he is in greater danger than ever before– if a 12 year old girl with a pair of scissors provides him with a threat."


http://mondoweiss.net/2016/11/historic-appearance-palestinian/
 
Egypt and Jordan don't want them. why do you expect those countries to solve Israel's problems?
PS: Would Israeli settlers in West Bank accept to become Jordanian citizens ?

Israel wants them even less. The Palestinians have had their chance to make peace, they failed. With appropriate diplomatic pressure and negotiation Egypt and Jordan can be persuaded to take them back again.
 
Thanks, gryfin.
Good articles.

Canadian values of equality and equal rights are really what Israel/Palestine needs.
 
As posted in the other thread gryf started...


Palestinian opinion from this September:
Q31`) Given the growing belief that the two-state solution is no longer viable,
the idea of one state for two people solution by which Palestinians and Jews
will be citizens of the same state and enjoy equal rights is gaining some
popularity. Do you support or oppose such a one-state solution?


Support: 30.6%
Oppose: 67.3%

http://www.pcpsr.org/sites/default/files/Poll-61-English Full Text desgine.pdf


But why would the anti-Israel crowd care about what Palestinians want?
 
Thanks, gryfin.
Good articles.

Canadian values of equality and equal rights are really what Israel/Palestine needs.

Canadians reject Hamas as a terrorist group and have denounced BDS as a hate group. Canadian values utterly reject you and your ilk.
 
As posted in the other thread gryf started...


Palestinian opinion from this September:
Q31`) Given the growing belief that the two-state solution is no longer viable,


Thanks for confirming that the Palestinians realize that the two state solution is dead.

This is also from the poll you linked to:
A majority of 56% believes that the two-state solution is no longer viable
due to settlement expansion while 40% believe that it is still viable.
 
Thanks for confirming that the Palestinians realize that the two state solution is dead.

This is also from the poll you linked to:

As I said in the other thread, you would only look for excuses.

Even though some Palestinians don't think a Two State peace will happen or don't support a Two state peace, 67% oppose a One State farce. But don't let the will of Palestinians interfere with your hatred of Israel.
 
Even Tom Freidman acknowledges the reality:

"That is, a one-state solution in Israel, a no-state solution in Syria, Yemen and Libya, a non-state solution offered by the Islamic caliphate and a rogue-state solution offered by Iran.

Start with Israel. The peace process is dead. It’s over, folks, so please stop sending the New York Times Op-Ed page editor your proposals for a two-state solution between Israelis and Palestinians. The next U.S. president will have to deal with an Israel determined to permanently occupy all the territory between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea, including where 2.5 million West Bank Palestinians live.

How did we get there? So many people stuck knives into the peace process it’s hard to know who delivered the mortal blow. Was it the fanatical Jewish settlers determined to keep expanding their footprint in the West Bank and able to sabotage any Israeli politician or army officer who opposed them? Was it right-wing Jewish billionaires, like Sheldon Adelson, who used their influence to blunt any U.S. congressional criticism of Bibi Netanyahu?

Or was it Netanyahu, whose lust to hold onto his seat of power is only surpassed by his lack of imagination to find a secure way to separate from the Palestinians? Bibi won: He’s now a historic figure — the founding father of the one-state solution."

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/10/opinion/the-many-mideast-solutions.html?_r=1
 
If the peace process is dead then there's no peace and obviously no chance at a one state solution. Death of the peace process is EVEN MORE of a blow to the one state notion.

Eventually that reality will sink in even to hate trolls like gryfin: the only way forward if the peace process is dead is to roll the Palestinian territories into Jordan and Egypt.

We will hear "but they don't want them" except:

1. Israel wants them EVEN LESS
2. Jordan and Egypt are to blame for the situation
3. It's the only thing that works in the absence of 2 state

Jordan and Egypt will come around with the right deal.
 
Here's another well reasoned piece that explores some of the mechanisms that reveal the real one state:

"It has not been formally proclaimed. It has no legal status. No one wants to acknowledge it. But it's hard to see Israeli control of the area of the pre-1967 state, the West Bank and Gaza as constituting anything other than one, de facto state.

First, look at control of territory, security and administration. The 1995 Oslo Accords divided the West Bank into three areas. On paper, Palestinians have full responsibility for civilian and security matters only in spaces designated as Area A. "The territorial space of Areas A and B is not contiguous," says the World Bank.

Everything in these areas "is surrounded by Area C, which covers the entire remaining area, is the only contiguous area of the West Bank, and includes most of the West Bank's key infrastructure, including the main road network. Area C is under full control of the Israeli military for both security and civilian affairs related to territory". As for Gaza, Israel continues to maintain complete control over the air and sea space of the Strip.

In terms of the size of the three areas, 59% of the West Bank is under Israeli civil and security control; 23% is under Palestinian civil control, but Israeli security control. The areas of Palestinian Authority (PA) control are mainly located in Palestinian urban areas – the population centres where much of the fast-growing population lives. These take up 8.5% of the West Bank."

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2009/apr/29/israel-palestine-one-state-solution
 
Israel clearly has defecto control over the area inside the security fence and that is clearly Israeli territory.

The PA clearly has control over Area A.

I agree that it's up for grabs what happens to Area B and C outside the security fence, whether parts of it become Palestinian, or parts of it become Israel, will depend on negotiation

As for the Palestine portion it's also up for negotiation whether that becomes an independent state or whether it reverts to Jordanian control.

You can quit right now dreaming that Daddy is going to make the evil Jews open up the gates so that your terrorist Hamas pals can go on a killing spree. Outside the imagination of anti-Semites that isn't a possibility. Israeli Jews will NEVER vote for it.
 
As I said in the other thread, you would only look for excuses.

Even though some Palestinians don't think a Two State peace will happen

Now that we've established that a two state won't happen its a moot point whether or not Israelis or Palestinians want a one state solution.
Because that's what they've got, and the two state solution won't happen.
Sure, Palestinians are really not happy about apartheid, and really don't trust Israel to ever give them equal rights, but that doesn't mean thats not the best way forward.

The two state solution is dead, as your poll confirms.
 
Now that we've established that a two state won't happen..

???? Where did you get that from? It is still the solution supported by the UN, The Quartet, The Arab League, Canada, and Israel.

We've discussed many times that the main stumbling block to peace is groups like Hamas who refuse to engage in negotiations and openly use terrorism. Of course your only response is that disarming those terrorists is 'subjugation'.


its a moot point whether or not Israelis or Palestinians want a one state solution.
So much for your support of democratic rights. I love it when you completely expose your views having nothing to do with protecting the rights of Palestinians.
 
???? Where did you get that from? It is still the solution supported by the UN, The Quartet, The Arab League, Canada, and Israel.

Your poll stated that only 50% of Palestinians support the two state solution and most think its not ever going to happen.
And you know why.
http://www.fosna.org/sites/default/files/FrontMap_2014_72.jpg

We've discussed many times that the main stumbling block to peace is groups like Hamas who refuse to engage in negotiations and openly use terrorism. Of course your only response is that disarming those terrorists is 'subjugation'.

So much for your support of democratic rights. I love it when you completely expose your views having nothing to do with protecting the rights of Palestinians.

Negotiations?
Hamas?

What a tired old record you are.
Netanyahu was elected on a promise to never allow the two state solution to happen while he was in power.
There are no negotiations now, and why would Palestinians bother negotiating with someone who keeps taking their land and promises to never give it back?

Meanwhile, you whine about Hamas, a poorly armed militia penned in inside the world's largest open air prison, surrounded by snipers who shoot to kill on the walls, watched continuously by drone and a group that still continues to stop rockets fired from inside their borders. And that's not enough for you. Despite the UN stating that Gaza will be unlivable in 3 years, despite only 10% of Gazans having enough water, that's still not enough for you.

And you refuse to note that roving gangs of Jewish supremacists are now regularly going around and beating and attacking anyone they suspect of being 'Arab'.
Jerusalem - Four youths in black T-shirts, bearing a distinctive yellow-flame insignia, approached "A" in July as he got out of a taxi in central Jerusalem to meet friends. They asked him the time. Suspicious of his accent, they confronted him directly: "Are you an Arab?"

"The moment I said, 'yes,' one of them punched me in the eye. The others jumped on me and started hitting me all over my body. There were many people in the area, but no one took any notice or tried to help."

"A" managed to break free and fled to a nearby restaurant, where a friend worked, and hid inside. "If I hadn't been able to run away, they would have killed me," he said.

His filmed testimony is one of several taken of Palestinians in Jerusalem who have been violently assaulted recently by far-right Jewish activists. Fearing reprisals, most of the victims agreed to testify only on condition that their real identities were not disclosed.

The attacks were carried out by a far-right group called Lehava, or Flame in Hebrew, an acronym for the Organisation for the Prevention of Miscegenation in the Holy Land. Run by a far-right rabbi, Ben-Zion Gopstein, Lehava rejects any interaction between Jews and Palestinians.
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/10/israel-lehava-stirs-anarchy-jerusalem-161025100901588.html

Israel exists as an apartheid, one state at present.
Its time for them to give Palestinians equal rights and join the 21st century.

The one state solution was a distant second choice to the two state solution, but now that the two state solution is dead its time to make the best of reality.
Give them equal rights.
 
LOl, Prevention of Miscegenation . It's exactly the same as Nuremberg Laws preventing Miscegenation between Aryans and non Aryans.

Exactly, and the AlJazeera article notes the supremacists are now part of the governing party.

Sheen said Lehava had created "an instantly recognisable brand that is all about racial purity. This is just a new version of Kach. They can't use the same slogans without breaking the law, but the similarities are unmistakable." He noted that both organisations used the same colours of black and yellow in their emblems - Kach's was a fist, while Lehava uses a flame.

"When Kach existed in the 1980s, it was seen as so racist that it was likened to the Nazis and boycotted by other parties in the parliament. It was seen as beyond the pale," said Sheen. "Now it's in the mainstream. It even has supporters in the Likud party [of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu] who are happy to whitewash it."

Yehuda Glick, a far-right activist close to Gopstein, who demands the replacement of al-Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem with a Jewish temple, became a Likud member of parliament in May. Lehava's ties with Kach were evident during the summer, when the group hosted a series of training camps in the southern West Bank to teach young people martial arts.

AlJazeera notes that the Israeli government is actually funding Lehava.
And to see how totally messed up, check the case of Gopstein, who attacked two Jewish activists and was tried for and let off. His excuse, he thought they were Palestinians. Apparently you're allowed to attack Palestinians.
http://www.haaretz.com/opinion/.premium-1.714130

That is the reality of the present one state, apartheid country.
 
Your poll stated that only 50% of Palestinians support the two state solution and most think its not ever going to happen.....

Funny that you choose to listen to the opinion of half of Palestinians but refuse to listen to the opinions of two thirds of Palestinians.


p.s. I am always amazed how you point out some fringe Israeli group that does get arrested and is under consideration for being banned and considered terrorists yet at the same time you choose to ignore the promotion of terrorism from the Palestinian government.
 
Funny that you choose to listen to the opinion of half of Palestinians but refuse to listen to the opinions of two thirds of Palestinians.

I hear them, the are afraid that roving gangs of Jewish supremacists and continuing racist, apartheid rules, would continue in one state, apartheid Israel.
Those are legit concerns.

But as the poll you referenced notes, the two state solution is dead.
So despite the preference for the two state solution, its no longer an option.
Israel took too much Palestinian land for that to happen now.