SCOC--- No Consecutive Sentences

[mandrill]

Long story short. Why don't you just admit you agree consecutive sentences is cruel and unusual punishment and is unconstitutional and parole eligibility should be no more than 25 years?

I haven't read the decision, but I have no reason why I wouldn't go along with the court's view on that point.

If the justices want to tell me that life without parole doesn't sit with contemporary Canadian values, I'm probably going to go along with that.

 

[Darts]

Like it or not, the underlying philosophy of our corrections system in Canada is really rehabilitation rather than punishment. With this in mind, the SCC ruled that consecutive 25y without parole was cruel and unusual- there would be no opportunity for an inmate to demonstrate that he had rehabilitated.
Yes, that is what the SCOC ruled. My question is do we agree with the SCOC?

Now 25 years is just the time to be eligible to apply. Parole would still have to be approved and for many of these mass killers, serial sexual predators/ killers, they won’t stand a chance and the bar (pun intended) will be very high for them to demonstrate that they have rehabilitated to a point that they have an extremely low chance of recidivism and no longer pose a thread to society.[/QUOTE]
I'm also thinking of the stress it places on the families of the victims. I think Bernardo gets a hearing every two years.

 

[Darts]

I haven't read the decision, but I have no reason why I wouldn't go along with the court's view on that point.

If the justices want to tell me that life without parole doesn't sit with contemporary Canadian values, I'm probably going to go along with that.

Ok, that is cutting to the chase. Do you think that the majority of mainstream Canadians agree with the SCOC? (The left versus right argument is a red herring.)

 

[Darts]

appoint judges with mainstream, current Canadian views and attitudes

Are their polls and/or surveys that support the above statement?

 

[onomatopoeia]

...The Liberals and NDP usually collect over 50% of the popular votes. The Conservatives usually under 40%....

Someone who votes NDP or Green is very likely to be on the Left, politically. Someone who votes for the Liberals or Conservatives does not necessarily support that Party; they might be voting against the other.

Both the Left and the Right are minority positions among all adults. The biggest demographic is those who don't care about politics, so they don't bother to vote.

In the 2018 Ontario General Election, the Conservatives won a majority government with 40.5% of the popular vote. 56.67% of eligible voters cared enough to cast a ballot, so 22.95% of eligible voters, (40.5% of 56.67%), voted Tory, or slightly more than 50% of the non-votes not received by the Don't Give a Shit party,representing 43.33% of the eligible voters. A fair percentage of the Conservatives' 22.95% support was citizens voting against the lesbian who looks like Orville Reddenbacher, whose name escapes me at the moment.

Some people vote for the NDP because they want the Party to have some presence in the Parliamentary House, if only to provide a social conscience to the legislative procedure, but like the majority of citizens, they shudder at the concept of what happens when those naive idealists actually wield power.

 

[onomatopoeia]

Really, this Supreme Court decision is non-news, click bait fodder. All this ruling does is allow any inmate convicted of 1st degree murder to apply for parole after serving a minimum of 25 years from a life sentence. In effect, it affirms that all first degree murder victims are equal in the eyes of Canadian law, so you can't give a convicted murderer a longer mandatory sentence because he/she/they killed an LGBTQ person, or an Asian, or a Muslim, as opposed to a White person born in Canada who was baptised in some Christian faith.

Just because a prison inmate is eligible to apply for parole, doesn't mean that they will be granted parole. This SCoC decision does not have any effect on parole board hearings.

 

[Darts]

Don't they add a little extra when the murder(s) is a hate crime?

 

[mandrill]

Ok, that is cutting to the chase. Do you think that the majority of mainstream Canadians agree with the SCOC? (The left versus right argument is a red herring.)

Probably, if they thought about it. 25 years to have basic eligibility is a long time. Most people will initially react by saying the convict is garbage and thinking he deserved worse. But if they think through what the Court is actually trying to explain, most would agree in the end.

 

[mandrill]

Don't they add a little extra when the murder(s) is a hate crime?

Not when it's Murder One. You can't tack on to life.

 

[mandrill]

Are their polls and/or surveys that support the above statement?

Wouldn't you have to do it on an issue-by-issue basis using recent cases as a testing point?

 

[Darts]

Not when it's Murder One. You can't tack on to life.

I was actually thinking about parole eligibility. Tack something more to the 25 years.

 

[mandrill]

I was actually thinking about parole eligibility. Tack something more to the 25 years.

No. You can't now anyway.

 

[Darts]

No. You can't now anyway.

Change the law. But, activist judges will repeal such law anyway.

 

[Darts]

The people most affected (Mosque) said in TV interviews they are disappointed with the SCOC judgment.
Article from the "pink" Toronto Star.
Supreme Court ruling devalues lives of most of mosque shooter’s victims | The Star

 

[mandrill]

Change the law. But, activist judges will repeal such law anyway.

What just happened.

I'm going to answer the question I asked you earlier. There are gadzillions of right wing lawyers in Canada. Most of them are tax lawyers and corporate lawyers.

Canadian criminal law isn't politically polarized, like in the US. Sentencing has to contain at least a nod to rehabilitation of the convict. That nod can be huge, with a 19 year old first offender with a drug habit who was led astray by bad friends. Or it can be minute with a 35 year old multi-repeat fraudster. But there has to be some consideration. That's the law. It's been restated many times over the last century or so.

But there's no faction of rightie judges trying to roll that back. That's an American thing. Most lawyers who do any sort of litigation know how sentencing law is structured and what's "against the rules". I understand that the Quebec CA also struck down the Harper provision.

 

[Nathan 88]

For those of you worrying about a mass murderer getting out of jail after 25 years you don’t have to worry. We still have a thing called a dangerous offender, this designation is applied to anybody who is still deemed to be a threat to society. Once this has been applied to you you will most likely never get out of jail.

 

[mandrill]

The people most affected (Mosque) said in TV interviews they are disappointed with the SCOC judgment.
Article from the "pink" Toronto Star.
Supreme Court ruling devalues lives of most of mosque shooter’s victims | The Star

Pretty standard off-the-cuff first reaction from people who haven't read the decision and who don't know what the law is on the issue.

 

[Darts]

We will see what sentences are given to the "Incel Murderer" and the "London Car Attacker".

Next up? Has or will Justin Bourque appeal his sentence?
Supreme Court ruling could affect Bourque’s sentence: lawyer | CTV News

 

[Anbarandy]

Unconstitutional or too expensive to house?
There’s always some economical motivation behind everything they do. I don’t believe for a single second they give a Damn about the rights of inmates when they don’t even care about the people who are victimized by those who receive the consecutive sentence.

I’ll be waiting to hear the true motivation for this… ugh.

Read the SCOC decision and inform thyself.

 

[mandrill]

We will see what sentences are given to the "Incel Murderer" and the "London Car Attacker".

Next up? Has or will Justin Bourque appeal his sentence?
Supreme Court ruling could affect Bourque’s sentence: lawyer | CTV News

You know already. Life, wo parole eligibility for 25 years.