Sarin Bomb Explodes in Iraq!!

[johnnyhandsome]

OBL and his followers were trained and financed by 2 governments: USA

And this means he can just start flying airplanes into buildings??

Saddam Hussein had no relationships with OBL,

You dont know this for sure.

there isn't/wasn't any threat from Iraq

Iraq has been a threat to the entire Middle-East since he came to power.

and the potential payoff in oil revenues.......

If it was all about oil why would Bush stop at Iraq??? wouldnt he also invade Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, Qatar, Egypt...etc...etc???

 

[loaded]

And this means he can just start flying airplanes into buildings??

finish my qoute.... you created a monster and forgot about it... you did not recognize its threat.... you should have destroyed it long before.....

You dont know this for sure.

show me otherwise, the only facts relate OBL to his SAUDI and CIA financing, why aren't they held responsible, where they terrorist supporters, the CIA, oh no....

If it was all about oil why would Bush stop at Iraq??? wouldnt he also invade Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, Qatar, Egypt...etc...etc???

Well, tactically speaking no matter how big and strong the US is, you can not just go off invading all countries that you want without opposition and think of the oil supplies that will be disrupted and its effect on the world economy.....
And the countries you mentioned are controlled b**ches, no need to invade, they obey.

You have a lot to learn. your knowledge is very limited and blind

 

[johnnyhandsome]

If Saddam hadnt used chemical weapons on the Kurds, none of this would have happened.
If Saddam hadnt used chemical weapons on Iran, none of this would have happened.
If Saddam had left Kuwait alone, none of this would have happened.
If Saddam hadnt sheltered terrorist groups, none of this would have happened.
If Saddam hadnt flaunted UN rules, none of this would have happened.

Play by international rules and there's no need for any of this stuff.
But he had to be a problem child, now didnt he??

 

[loaded]

If Saddam hadnt used chemical weapons on the Kurds, none of this would have happened.

Who supplied him with these weapons, and why didn't the US care then ??

If Saddam hadnt used chemical weapons on Iran, none of this would have happened.

I think the US was more than encouraging saddam and arming him in his/American War against Iran

If Saddam had left Kuwait alone, none of this would have happened.

This is where he got greedy, but instead of calling it greed/oil/power, a whole scenario has to be developed

If Saddam hadnt sheltered terrorist groups, none of this would have happened.

you keep mentioned this lie as fact. Give it up man, it has allready been proven wrong. He was not sheltering any groups....

If Saddam hadnt flaunted UN rules, none of this would have happened.

Sometimes the UN matters, and sometimes it does not, do you care for the UN or dont you (only ONE answer) and if you do care, then please apply rules to all member nations of the UN...

Play by international rules and there's no need for any of this stuff.
But he had to be a problem child, now didnt he??

See above.

 

[The Shake]

If Saddam hadnt flaunted UN rules, none of this would have happened.

Thankfully for GWB, that last one doesn't count for much!!!!!!

 

[gala]

So I have heard a theory that Saddam "destroyed" a lot of his old WMDs, from the Iran war, by just digging a hole, dumping them in, and burying them. I heard that some of the soldiers who did that job may now be part of the resistance and they just know where to dig.

So this doesn't prove that Iraq had any WMD programme, the shell was from 10 years ago, and probably buried in the ground and starting to rust, which may be why it didn't work properly. In Saddam's mind maybe they were "destroyed", but obviously not destroyed well enough to be put beyond use. Think about it--factories in third world countries often dispose of nasty waste by hiding them in ditches and hoping nobody notices. Maybe that's just the way they do things there.

Anyway, shells don't come in ones folks: they come in boxes, so that you can reload your artillery and fire another shot. That means whoever has this shell has at least a few more--maybe the rest of a crate, maybe the rest of a pallet, maybe a whole warehouse full. Only they know for sure.

 

[johnnyhandsome]

The reason why I dont think that the Iraqi's didnt know they had Sarin when they fired these shells is because they would have used them earlier in the game and not when the war is 'over".
They also would have used it on a larger congregation of soldiers and not on just 2 GI's.

 

[borg007]

As much of a supporter of this war as I am, one shell does not make a WMD threat. I don't think it addresses the justified concerns of, did this war need to be fought and did it need to be fought now.

OTB

Of course one shell does not make a WMD threat because whoever produced this shell only made one. There is no way they would have made another 5 or 6 thousand, would they

 

[onthebottom]

Of course one shell does not make a WMD threat because whoever produced this shell only made one. There is no way they would have made another 5 or 6 thousand, would they

I get the sarcasm, and you could add, and they would never make more when sanctions were lifted. I think that a "few" remaining shells don't indicated an urgent threat, which is what my post was about.

OTB

 

[Drunken Master]

Have you been attending the Papasmerf English classes again?

OTB

Ouch! OTB, that really hits below the belt. You might be subject to a ban.

Call me crazy, but if Saddam had had WMDs, wouldn't he have used them? He surely couldn't have believed international opinion mattered...

Saddam's security procedures may have been no more secure than many of the countries who have WMDs. The shell was from the First Gulf War - perhaps there are still a few shells "unaccounted for" from that era floating around...

At any rate, as I said this shell doesn't prove - or disprove - anything. What is certain is that the war effort just became a lot more expensive - and dangerous.

 

[onthebottom]

Ouch! OTB, that really hits below the belt. You might be subject to a ban.

Call me crazy, but if Saddam had had WMDs, wouldn't he have used them? He surely couldn't have believed international opinion mattered...

Saddam's security procedures may have been no more secure than many of the countries who have WMDs. The shell was from the First Gulf War - perhaps there are still a few shells "unaccounted for" from that era floating around...

At any rate, as I said this shell doesn't prove - or disprove - anything. What is certain is that the war effort just became a lot more expensive - and dangerous.

I guess we agree on that, and yes that was harsh. I'm surprised there was no retaliation from the Goobmister.

OTB

 

[*d*]

One old sarin bomb is the least of the coalition force's problems. A bigger problem comes in the form of depleted uranium dust and the large number of live US cluster bomb fragments that now litter the Iraqi countryside. These hidden killers will haunt the Iraqis for years to come.

 

[onthebottom]

One old sarin bomb is the least of the coalition force's problems. A bigger problem comes in the form of depleted uranium dust and the large number of live US cluster bomb fragments that now litter the Iraqi countryside. These hidden killers will haunt the Iraqis for years to come.

I didn't know that, I thought only anti-tank shells had depleted uranium. Amazing what you can learn on TERB.

OTB

 

[*d*]

I didn't know that, I thought only anti-tank shells had depleted uranium. Amazing what you can learn on TERB.

OTB

The DU dust comes from the detonation of anti-tank shells. Cluster bombs are separate weapons all together and do not contain DU.

 

[onthebottom]

The DU dust comes from the detonation of anti-tank shells. Cluster bombs are separate weapons all together and do not contain DU.

Got it, read your post too fast, I was right on the anti-tank shells. Does the US have teams cleaning up unexploded ordinance? I would hope so.

OTB

 

[tompeepin]

I didn't know that, I thought only anti-tank shells had depleted uranium. Amazing what you can learn on TERB.

OTB

Not only from shells but also off of armor on US tanks that took a hit. See what you can learn from http://www.sacbee.com/content/opini...-10241546c.html. and http://www.iacenter.org/depleted/du.htm But I am sure that the US army has a spin for DU and other war scraps. DU is harmless I am sure. It will maybe be Iraq's agent orange. Why use a nuke? Do the job slowly with DU. Iraq the "hot" zone, watch it glow. But now ... hazard? What hazard? We know nothing about it. Gulf war syndrome? It does not exist. It is only in the minds of hypochondriac soldiers who want a pension and don't want to work.

 

[*d*]

Got it, read your post too fast, I was right on the anti-tank shells. Does the US have teams cleaning up unexploded ordinance? I would hope so.

OTB

Actually I think the US does have some kind of UXO clean up program on the go in Iraq. Most likely contracted out. I believe its a 3 year program, but I don't know how complete it will be after only 3 years when they're still cleaning up the UXO mess in Kosovo.

 

[onthebottom]

Not only from shells but also off of armor on US tanks that took a hit. See what you can learn from http://www.sacbee.com/content/opini...-10241546c.html. and http://www.iacenter.org/depleted/du.htm But I am sure that the US army has a spin for DU and other war scraps. DU is harmless I am sure. It will maybe be Iraq's agent orange. Why use a nuke? Do the job slowly with DU. Iraq the "hot" zone, watch it glow. But now ... hazard? What hazard? We know nothing about it. Gulf war syndrome? It does not exist. It is only in the minds of hypochondriac soldiers who want a pension and don't want to work.

Apart from the anti army propaganda (where are the hehehe's in this post?) I hadn't thought about the armor. I'm assuming (have not as yet read your links) that DU is used because it's very strong and thus can be armor or pierce armor.

What countires use DU, does anyone know?

OTB

 

[tompeepin]

Apart from the anti army propaganda ...
OTB

Propaganda??? Or facts???

I'm assuming (have not as yet read your links) that DU is used because it's very strong and thus can be armor or pierce armor.

OTB

Exactly but at what price? Is any price acceptable? And then a monster is created, because other coutries see a need to aquire it and use it. Thus it has become the defacto standard (like nukes) where henceforth it will always be required. Ah the devil of war.

"In the 1950's the United States Department of Defense became interested in using depleted uranium metal in weapons because of its extremely dense, pyrophoric qualities and because it was cheap and available in huge quantities. It is now given practically free of charge to the military and arms manufacturers and is used both as tank armour, and in armour-piercing shells known as depleted uranium penetrators."

" ... This pocess produces a large amount of radioactive depleted uranium waste, thus named because it is mainly formed by the other non-fissionable uranium isotope, U-238 and a minimum proportion of U-235. ... having characteristics making it highly attractive for military technology: firstly, it is extremely dense and heavy ... , such that projectiles with a depleted uranium head can penetrate the armoured steel of military vehicles and buildings; secondly, it is a spontaneous pyrophoric material, i.e., it inflames when reaching its target generating such heat that it explodes. ... When a projectile hits a target, 70% of its depleted uranium burns and oxidizes, bursting into highly toxic, radioactive micro particles. Being so tiny, these particles can be ingested or inhaled after being deposited on the ground or carried kilometres away by the wind, the food chain or water."

What countires use DU, does anyone know?

OTB

"Over 15 countries are known to have depleted uranium weapons in their militaray arsenals - UK, US, France, Russia, Greece, Turkey, Israel, Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, Egypt, Kuwait, Pakistan, Thailand, Iraq and Taiwan - with depleted uranium rapidly spreading to other countries."

Quotes from http://www.cadu.org.uk/intro.htm

and http://www.web-light.nl/VISIE/depleted_uranium1.html

 

[onthebottom]

Exactly but at what price? Is any price acceptable? And then a monster is created, because other coutries see a need to aquire it and use it. Thus it has become the defacto standard (like nukes) where henceforth it will always be required. Ah the devil of war.

Perhaps this should be part of another US Bashing thread but it's a valid subject. I didn't read Canada on your list, that's interesting given that Thailand has the technology.....

I guess one would make certain assumptions about the state of priorities if one needs to use armor piercing shells or is at risk of its armor being pierced. I don't think there is any weapon without unintended consequences.

OTB