Repeal of Obamacare crashes and burns

Baller Time

I can't remembe..Romnesla
Dec 13, 2011
2,108
1
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I just saw this on reddit (don't ask) and if true Stone Cold McCain just really fucked over the GOP congress royally for this fiscal year.

I'm not sure if it's really being appreciated just how comprehensively the Republicans were just fucked over.

See, the Republicans have been trying to pass these godawful healthcare bills through a process called budget reconciliation, which, among other things, protects the bill from being filibustered in the Senate and only requires a simple majority of 50 votes (rather than 60, which the Republicans don't have).

The thing is, the Senate can only consider one budget reconciliation bill per topic per year. Of course, if the bill dies in committee and never comes to an official vote, it doesn't count- which is why they've been able to keep hammering away at the issue.

This bill, though, was allowed to come to the Senate floor, because the Republicans thought they'd secured the votes. Collins, Murkowski and the Democrats would vote no, everyone else would vote yes, and Pence would break the tie. And then McCain completely fucked them. And it was almost certainly a calculated move; he voted to allow the bill to come to the floor. Had McCain allowed it to die in committee, McConnell could have come back with yet another repeal bill; but he let it come to a vote, and now they can't consider another budget reconciliation bill for the rest of the fiscal year. The Senate needs 60 votes to pass any kind of healthcare reform now.

So now they're caught between a rock and a hard place. Either they concede defeat on the issue and try again later (causing a big, unpopular stink that could damage elections if they try it before the midterms, or risking losing the slim majority they already have if they wait) or they actually sit down with the democrats like adults and write a halfway decent healthcare bill.

This is amazing.
 

fuji

Banned
Jan 31, 2005
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¯\_(ツ)_/¯
is.gd
I just saw this on reddit (don't ask) and if true Stone Cold McCain just really fucked over the GOP congress royally for this fiscal year.
I'm not sure, I think they can only PASS one reconciliation bill, so having it defeated doesn't use it up.

However it makes clowns out of Trump, McConnell, and Ryan and it's likely that they are getting tired of losing so badly and may want to move on to something they can actually get done.

Trump's now in office six months and still he's got fuck all accomplished. Bashing his head against the wall another time won't help his slumping approval rating nor McConnell's so my guess is they move on.
 

Baller Time

I can't remembe..Romnesla
Dec 13, 2011
2,108
1
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Trump's now in office six months and still he's got fuck all accomplished.

NOT TRUE!!!! FAKE NEWS ALERT!!!!!!!!!!!!
:wink:

He'll be signing the Russian Sanctions bill which effectively adds sanctions and limits his own ability to remove or reduce them. Excelsior!!!
 

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
24,478
12
38
Ah. Feel free to discuss with ol' Oagre who can't get passed the fact the House is responsible for passing legislation.

For some reason my auto correct does the small case O and won't change.
•Step One: Turn off the auto-correct that only makes people look stupid and lazy; keep the auto-suggest if you want a machine to help you.
•Step Two: Find and use the 'Add to dictionary/ Learn spelling' option in your browser the next time you type it right, and the machine gets it wrong.
•Step Three: Use a different browser if there is no such option

But I bet you won't need Step Three.
 

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
24,478
12
38
Bullshit. The GoP campaigned on this. Are you saying there was a single GoP nominee who DIDN'T campaign on Repeal and Replace? That was the cornerstone of the GoP campaign since it's inception.

And it WAS up to both Ryan and McConnell to shepherd Repeal through. That's what House and Senate majority leaders are supposed to do. Are you now saying it isn't their fault when legislation they created doesn't pass?

That, sorry to say, the just shows how stupidly obsessed you are with pinning every failure on one man.

This is a SYSTEMIC issue with Washington. Dems who passed this piece of crap. GoP who can repeal it. And a President can't herd cats.
Somewhere the American voters have to shoulder responsibility for the people they elected who never in seven years offered even a hint that they might one day come up with a plan to replace ObamaCare. Give Trump all the credit in the world for his efforts, the sad truth was obvious before he announced his candidacy: The Republicans had no plan, no platform and no program except to grab power.

And to get it, the GOP didn't care what lowlife outsider they had to bend over for. Still don't.

I watched their first Candidates Debate: To call that party a herd of cats is an insult to house-cats and mousers everywhere and gives the GOP far more credit for common purpose than they ever showed. "Repeal ObamaCare" were the only words they all uttered, over and over. "Replace", they only whispered, and only now and then. Anyone who actually believed they would (or wanted them to) repeal, and could leave it at that, returning the USA to Third World healthcare, deserves the current mess.

They voted for it.
 

jcpro

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2014
24,558
6,763
113
Somewhere the American voters have to shoulder responsibility for the people they elected who never in seven years offered even a hint that they might one day come up with a plan to replace ObamaCare. Give Trump all the credit in the world for his efforts, the sad truth was obvious before he announced his candidacy: The Republicans had no plan, no platform and no program except to grab power. And they didn't care who they had to bend over for to get it.

I watched their first Candidates Debate: To call that party a herd of cats is an insult to house-cats and mousers everywhere and gives the GOP far more credit for common purpose than they deserve. "Repeal ObamaCare" were the only words they all uttered, over and over. Replace, they only whispered, now and then. Anyone who actually believed they would (or wanted them to) repeal, and could leave it at that, returning the USA to Third World healthcare, deserves the current mess.

They voted for it.
That may be, mostly because the pre election smart money was not on the Republicans. However, they did win and there's no excuse for the legislative failure.
 

MattRoxx

Call me anti-fascist
Nov 13, 2011
6,743
3
0
I get around.
Bullshit. The GoP campaigned on this. Are you saying there was a single GoP nominee who DIDN'T campaign on Repeal and Replace? That was the cornerstone of the GoP campaign since it's inception.

And it WAS up to both Ryan and McConnell to shepherd Repeal through. That's what House and Senate majority leaders are supposed to do. Are you now saying it isn't their fault when legislation they created doesn't pass?

That, sorry to say, the just shows how stupidly obsessed you are with pinning every failure on one man.

This is a SYSTEMIC issue with Washington. Dems who passed this piece of crap. GoP who can repeal it. And a President can't herd cats.
You are lying. I don't know why you are lying to prop up Trump, but you are.

http://www.cnn.com/videos/politics/2017/06/24/president-trump-healthcare-promises-jpm-orig.cnn

It was Trump's campaign promise. It was Trump making the claims about having a better health care plan.
"I am going to take care of everybody..." . Complete bullshit spewing from Trump's mouth.

"The government's going to pay for it. But we're going to save so much money on the other side" WHAT THE FUCK IS HE EVEN TALKING ABOUT

"I'm not gonna cut Social Security...I'm not gonna cut medicare or medicaid, like every other Republican..." Trump is again saying this is his plan, not the GOP plan.

These are words from Trump. One man, speaking for himself and about himself He doesn't mention Ryan or McConnell. He was the one on tv, giving interviews, bellowing at rallies.

This was Trump's failure. He owns it.
 

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
24,478
12
38
That may be, mostly because the pre election smart money was not on the Republicans. However, they did win and there's no excuse for the legislative failure.
The post election smart money wasn't on them either, and it looks dumber to bet on them with every passing day.

The rising question is what an American coup d'étât will look like, and whether the FSB might 'help out' the way the CIA did in Chile.
-----------
PS: I speak in jest about that last. I hope.
 

jcpro

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2014
24,558
6,763
113
The post election smart money wasn't on them either, and it looks dumber to bet on them with every passing day.

The rising question is what an American coup d'étât will look like, and whether the FSB might 'help out' the way the CIA did in Chile.
-----------
PS: I speak in jest about that last. I hope.
Sorry, but for whatever reason, I'm not in the mood for jokes, today.
 

fuji

Banned
Jan 31, 2005
79,957
8
0
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
is.gd
That may be, mostly because the pre election smart money was not on the Republicans. However, they did win and there's no excuse for the legislative failure.
I agree with you on this. But it takes leadership from the Whitehouse to get these things done, Trump owed everyone as plan, some idea of what he thought would be better: that's what he actually promised.

His job in this situation is to be an opinion leader, to use the publicity the presidency gets to rally the public behind an idea and then push Congress to back it.

Yet he didn't provide ANY direction. None.

He could have at least hired somebody with an idea if he had no idea himself. There are lots of right wing think tanks with visions of how healthcare could be made affordable to everyone. There are even some good ideas there.

I recall one proposal was a universal healthcare that only covered catastrophic health costs, like healthcare with a $10,000 deductable, that only covered life saving treatment, leaving people to buy products in the open unregulated market for everything else. That was proposed by the GOP once upon a time. That at least prevents people losing their entire life savings to a health issue.

And there are other ideas not saying he had to run with that one, but he had to run with SOMETHING.
 

oldjones

CanBarelyRe Member
Aug 18, 2001
24,478
12
38
Trouble is and was that the Republicans cared only about getting power, and had no plan for what to do when they got it. That's what we've seen separately in the White House, in the Senate and in the House. Collectively, they're even worse, with each branch hoping one of the others will shine a light into the darkness and show them a path.

The saddest and silliest part was the Majority Leader blaming their bill's failure on Democrats not coming on board and co-operating in a bi-partisan way to support healthcare. He wanted the Party that passed the ACA to help destroy it, because his own Party wouldn't?

"What is your title again, Senator? What was it that stopped you and your majority from keeping their campaign promise?"

And Trump's dusted his hands of it saying it's the Party's seven-year mess; nothing to do with him.
 

Baller Time

I can't remembe..Romnesla
Dec 13, 2011
2,108
1
38
The post election smart money wasn't on them either, and it looks dumber to bet on them with every passing day.

The rising question is what an American coup d'étât will look like, and whether the FSB might 'help out' the way the CIA did in Chile.
-----------
PS: I speak in jest about that last. I hope.
I don't think the jest part was accurate. Some white hat hackers are at some nerdfest called DefCon and they just finished their "Voter Machine Hackerama" and the results are astounding.
 

mandrill

monkey
Aug 23, 2001
82,959
116,048
113
Trump threatens to end ObamaCare payments unless repeal passes

President Trump on Saturday threatened to end key payments to insurance companies made under Obamacare**if a repeal and replace bill is not passed.

"After seven years of 'talking' Repeal & Replace, the people of our great country are still being forced to live with imploding ObamaCare!" the president wrote**in a tweet.

"If a new HealthCare Bill is not approved quickly, BAILOUTS for Insurance Companies and BAILOUTS for Members of Congress will end very soon!" he added.

Senate Minority Leader Charles**Schumer (D-N.Y.) fired back Saturday, saying**Trump should "stop playing politics with people's lives and health care, start leading, and finally begin acting presidential."
"If the president refuses to make the cost sharing reduction payments, every expert agrees that premiums will go up and health care will be more expensive for millions of Americans," Schumer**said in a statement.
Trump has previously threatened to withhold the payments, known as**Cost Sharing Reduction (CSR) payments, which lower the amount individuals have to pay for deductibles, copayments and insurance.
The White House announced earlier this month that key ObamaCare subsidies to insurers would be paid this month, however**the administration did not make a commitment beyond July.
Trump's comments come after Senate Republican efforts to repeal and replace ObamaCare failed in the early hours of Friday morning after three Republicans and all 48 Democrats rejected pared-down repeal legislation, known as a "skinny" bill.
The issue is of critical importance to Republicans in all three branches of government because the party campaigned for seven years to repeal former President Barack Obama's signature**healthcare law.


The true GOP platform is now out in the open. We will screw you over health care whether you go along with it or not.

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...-passes/ar-AAp1dLH?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartandhp
 

Aardvark154

New member
Jan 19, 2006
53,749
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I watched their first Candidates Debate. . . .
Those were candidates for President, the one who was elected never submitted any proposed legislation to Congress.

For what reason should a Republican Senator or Member of Congress, be bound by what candidates for President have to say.
 

jcpro

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2014
24,558
6,763
113
It is time for the President to use his office to complete the take over of the Republican Party. We are witnessing but the latest chapter in the struggle between the RNC and the President Trump. Their defeat, obviously, was not as complete as once thought after the Primaries trashing issued by Trump to the Republican establishment. He needs to call out to the Republican grass roots to primary the incumbent Republicans who are too timid to carry out his election promises.Letting the Priebus go was a good first step, but the message must be sent that this is no longer the party of the Bush family or Boehner or Ryan. The President must assert his traditional position as the party leader or the Republicans will end up like the current edition of the Democratic party.
 

fuji

Banned
Jan 31, 2005
79,957
8
0
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
is.gd
It is time for the President to use his office to complete the take over of the Republican Party. We are witnessing but the latest chapter in the struggle between the RNC and the President Trump. Their defeat, obviously, was not as complete as once thought after the Primaries trashing issued by Trump to the Republican establishment. He needs to call out to the Republican grass roots to primary the incumbent Republicans who are too timid to carry out his election promises.Letting the Priebus go was a good first step, but the message must be sent that this is no longer the party of the Bush family or Boehner or Ryan. The President must assert his traditional position as the party leader or the Republicans will end up like the current edition of the Democratic party.
First his own popularity would have to climb above 38%...
 

Aardvark154

New member
Jan 19, 2006
53,749
3
0
President Trump on Saturday threatened to end key payments to insurance companies made under Obamacare**if a repeal and replace bill is not passed.

"After seven years of 'talking' Repeal & Replace, the people of our great country are still being forced to live with imploding ObamaCare!" the president wrote**in a tweet.

"If a new HealthCare Bill is not approved quickly, BAILOUTS for Insurance Companies and BAILOUTS for Members of Congress will end very soon!"
If he carries through this is the end of the Trump Presidency.
 

Aardvark154

New member
Jan 19, 2006
53,749
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If he can't get major legislation passed it's effectively over already.
As said that is because there was no well thought out proposed legislation which met campaign promises.

The remaining chance is for the moderate wing of the Party to work across the isle with the moderates on the other side.
 

fuji

Banned
Jan 31, 2005
79,957
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As said that is because there was no well thought out proposed legislation which met campaign promises.

The remaining chance is for the moderate wing of the Party to work across the isle with the moderates on the other side.
There are many Republicans who agree with you:

House Republican blames Trump for healthcare failure: He ‘never laid out a plan’

http://thehill.com/policy/healthcar...mp-for-healthcare-failure-he-never-laid-out-a

Some members of President Trump's own party are laying the blame on the White House for allowing the GOP effort to repeal and replace ObamaCare to fail.

Rep. Charlie Dent (R-Pa.), chairman of the moderate Tuesday Group, told The Associated Press that the White House did little to sell the GOP health plan to the American people.

“One of the failures was the president never laid out a plan or his core principles and never sold them to the American people,” Dent said. “[He] outsourced the whole issue to Congress.”

..
 
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