I am so tired of people who say Canadian troops don't belong in Afghanistan or Iraq and most likely soon Iran, wanna be Jack Layton does not help either, I realize we have men and women killed and that it sucks, that we were always a peace keeping nation but things have changed people, we need to stand up and be counted with the others in this world that can clearly see that there are some real nutbars that are willing to destroy the world if they can, and if we turn a blind eye to these nutbars they almost can and will surely soon build and use nuclear bombs, for the men and ladies that are fighting for my worlds freedom, let it be known I have the greatest respect and honor for you and realize that we are and must be in the fight against those who would kill us all
our troops
- Thread starter rgkv
- Start date
I wish Jack Layton would personally lead the peace mission with the terrorists.
That way, I can watch his stupid reaction when 10 guys behind him yell out Allah Akbar right before they hand him his own head on the end of the a nice curved sword.
Farking moron.
That way, I can watch his stupid reaction when 10 guys behind him yell out Allah Akbar right before they hand him his own head on the end of the a nice curved sword.
Farking moron.
Being a member of the Canadian Forces (CF) for the past 16 years, I have seen the regard of our military go from a look of disdain (Somalia-Airborne Fiasco) to where we are at today. Constant years of neglect have left us as a ragtag type of military. We were beginning to lose all credibility with other nations within NATO (North Atlantic Treaty Organization). But things are beginning to shift with us.
I had a deep discussion with a family member on Tuesday after the latest casualties and the question was posed to me, why the hell are we there, what are we trying to accomplish. And in keeping with the polls where it seems there is a very close separation where Canadians support or do not support our troops being over there, I offered the following.
Do we, as Canadians have to wait until some fanatic flies a plane into the heart of the financial district in Toronto before we take notice. Do we, as Canadians have to wait until some fanatic with a suicide bomb strapped around his/her waist in the middle of Union Station during rush hour before we notice?
We as a peace loving nation, along with our allies must take the fight to these countries which support this line of thinking. Afghanistan was one of the top breeding grounds for these Terrorist groups we hear about constantly. After stability is imposed (hopefullY) in Afghanistan, the free world will move on to the next country that supports this line of thought.
Enough ranting. I am proud that our troops are there. I am proud that I am a member of the CF. And I am proud that the majority of Canadians see things in a rational light, and realize that we are overseas for a valid reason. We must bring the fight to them, before they bring it to us.
BBF
Sorry I just realized that perhaps this belongs in the Politics/International Affairs Forum
I had a deep discussion with a family member on Tuesday after the latest casualties and the question was posed to me, why the hell are we there, what are we trying to accomplish. And in keeping with the polls where it seems there is a very close separation where Canadians support or do not support our troops being over there, I offered the following.
Do we, as Canadians have to wait until some fanatic flies a plane into the heart of the financial district in Toronto before we take notice. Do we, as Canadians have to wait until some fanatic with a suicide bomb strapped around his/her waist in the middle of Union Station during rush hour before we notice?
We as a peace loving nation, along with our allies must take the fight to these countries which support this line of thinking. Afghanistan was one of the top breeding grounds for these Terrorist groups we hear about constantly. After stability is imposed (hopefullY) in Afghanistan, the free world will move on to the next country that supports this line of thought.
Enough ranting. I am proud that our troops are there. I am proud that I am a member of the CF. And I am proud that the majority of Canadians see things in a rational light, and realize that we are overseas for a valid reason. We must bring the fight to them, before they bring it to us.
BBF
Sorry I just realized that perhaps this belongs in the Politics/International Affairs Forum
The lefties like Layton and most others in the NDP fancy themselves a tolerant lot and would no doubt think it possible to sit down with a bunch of Islamo facists and talk peace and come away with a better understanding of each other's core needs and values.
Sigh....
Ironically, those they would be sitting down with would be anything BUT tolerant and would love nothing more than to separate their heads from their torsos.
Sigh....
Ironically, those they would be sitting down with would be anything BUT tolerant and would love nothing more than to separate their heads from their torsos.
The Afghani's want their country back. They do not want to be ruled by the Taliban and similar fanatics... they want what most people want, to make money, get married, have kids, and have a nice peaceful prosperous life.
That doesn't mean they want to be "western", or want an "Kabul Escort Review Board" set up anytime soon mind you
The only way to stop the Taliban from taking over the country again and turning into a base for fanatics requires the use of force unfortunately. But even putting our own interests aside, the Afghans need our help, and I think they should have it.
The question is not should our troops be fighting the Taliban... the question is can we construct a peaceful stable afghanistan with the Americans running the show, or will the efforts of our troops and aid organizations be undermined in the long term?
That doesn't mean they want to be "western", or want an "Kabul Escort Review Board" set up anytime soon mind you
The only way to stop the Taliban from taking over the country again and turning into a base for fanatics requires the use of force unfortunately. But even putting our own interests aside, the Afghans need our help, and I think they should have it.
The question is not should our troops be fighting the Taliban... the question is can we construct a peaceful stable afghanistan with the Americans running the show, or will the efforts of our troops and aid organizations be undermined in the long term?
The truth hurts, eh?
No foreign troops belong in Afghanistan.
There's a maxim that those who neglect history are doomed to repeat it and this is so much the case in Afghanistan. They've been victoriously fighting off invaders since Alexander the Great. Just ask the British and Soviets. And when they're not fighting off invaders, they're fighting among themselves. Fighting is their national sport.
The U.S. paid big bucks to the drug lords to get rid of the Taliban and then turned on these tribal leaders. Now the Taliban and drug lords have banded together to fight off the U.S., which has buggered off from the Kandahar area to leave the fighting to the Canadian and only occasionally appear to pepper our troops with cannon balls.
Once the West wisens up and leaves, the drug lords and Taliban will go back to fighting among themselves. And, by the way, the Taliban did more to get rid of poppy growing in Afghanistan than the U.S. ever did ... or will be able to do.
Leave these people alone and I bet they'll leave us alone. They'll be too busy fighting among themselves. Canada can make better use of its troops elsewhere.
No foreign troops belong in Afghanistan.
There's a maxim that those who neglect history are doomed to repeat it and this is so much the case in Afghanistan. They've been victoriously fighting off invaders since Alexander the Great. Just ask the British and Soviets. And when they're not fighting off invaders, they're fighting among themselves. Fighting is their national sport.
The U.S. paid big bucks to the drug lords to get rid of the Taliban and then turned on these tribal leaders. Now the Taliban and drug lords have banded together to fight off the U.S., which has buggered off from the Kandahar area to leave the fighting to the Canadian and only occasionally appear to pepper our troops with cannon balls.
Once the West wisens up and leaves, the drug lords and Taliban will go back to fighting among themselves. And, by the way, the Taliban did more to get rid of poppy growing in Afghanistan than the U.S. ever did ... or will be able to do.
Leave these people alone and I bet they'll leave us alone. They'll be too busy fighting among themselves. Canada can make better use of its troops elsewhere.
rgkv said:
peteeey said:
And where would propose to send our troops where they wouldn't be "foreign"?
What "better" use would you propose?
The Taliban will not go away because we ignore it... and historically, when we left the taliban alone the taliban, or more accurately the people they supported and sheltered, did not leave "us" in the west alone ... even assuming that your implication that afghanis are incapable of anything other than continuous fratricide and don't deserve help to achieve something more is correct.
Our troops are volunteers. They aren't stupid. They know there is a price to paid and that they will pay the worst of it. Is a (relatively) peaceful and stable Afghanistan - as has existed in the past - worth that price? I think so and I think most Canadians would agree.
Can we acheive that goal? Yes ... but one of the big factors involved in that yes is American policy, which is beyond our control, and which most Canadians do not trust.
The question is do we commit to Afghanistan in hopes we can do enough good to outweigh the costs or do we abandon the Afghani's to chaos because we don't trust the Americans?
For me, so far, the answer to that question is that we should try and do the right thing even if in the end it comes to nothing... because it is the right thing and because it is important to try ... and because however dubious I am of the powers that be south of the border I have been greatly impressed by the afghan people, so that while I have my doubts, I still have hope.
rgkv said:
Really? So nothing to do with interest, simply world and our security? Interesting how the Janajaweed is then allowed to do what theyre doing, virtually the same if not worse than the Taliban, and a future threat to World peace, yet it's being allowed to grow....I hear people talk about Darfur, but no urgent rush by Canada....go figure....
http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/cdnmilitary/peacekeeping.html
Throw a dart at most any country in Africa and I'm sure they'd be happy to receive our help. Of course the West won't help there because the continent has little economic value.
The Taliban has left us alone. This whole thing began with U.S. meddling in places it shouldn't be. We're more at risk for a terrorist attack now that we're in Afghanistan then we've ever been.
Throw a dart at most any country in Africa and I'm sure they'd be happy to receive our help. Of course the West won't help there because the continent has little economic value.
The Taliban has left us alone. This whole thing began with U.S. meddling in places it shouldn't be. We're more at risk for a terrorist attack now that we're in Afghanistan then we've ever been.
grendleaxe said:
peteeey said:
Really, throw a dart at any country in africa and they'd be happy to have us send troops?
Like Somalia perhaps?
Please. There are some good arguments to made for isolationism. The nature and merits of our involvement in Afghanistan is open to sensible reasoned debate, should you care to make the effort. But your argument is nihlist in nature and blames everything on the U.S. And while I myself heap a very great deal of the blame for what's wrong with the world at the feet of american foreign policy, that doesn't absolve us of our responsibilities.
It may ery well be that those responsibilities to ourselves and the world are not best served by our current involvement in afghanistan... but I hear very little from those demanding the at we "get out" on exactly how we can better meet those responsibilites. Lots of fuzzy platitudes, but no detail.
fantasiafan said:
No oil or economic benefit to be had in Aghanistan and nowadays (unlike the time of the "great game",) not a very strategic location either. On the other hand their IS oil in Sudan and money to be made (remember Talisman Energy anyone? ) Can't blame this one on money and oil.
The American leadership would gladly cut and run in Afghanistan if they could explain it to the american public I think. Iraq is their war and the one they planning on before 9/11.
The difference between Sudan (also a haven for Osama before he moved to afghanistan... and I wouldn't be suprised if he was back there,) now and afghanistan now is that however precarious Afghanistan has a government, as well as people, that whant our help. In the Sudan it is the government and that would be the enemy.
Though the worlds apathy towards what is happening in Dafur is reprehensible , Afghanistan holds the promise, real or not, of a satisfactory end being in sight, albeit a long way off.
rgkv said:
so now we have to go and police the world like the US eh...but of course we only police those that we think we can take or has some sort of economic benefit? oh yeah thats justice alright.
Like it was said... there are lot of countries that need "salvation from tyranny"...but are they being helped? no. A million people got slaughtered in Rwanda what did we do about that? Make a movie...What are we doing about Darfur???
there are other countries that are a much bigger threat but do we try to do something about them? no. Doesnt look like "the greater good" to me
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