Need help: Knocked a girl up, need to know my rights

[hatztowork]

I'll remember to double bag it the next time I'm out having fun!! LOL..well...hell..can't do anything about the past may as well laugh about it!

 

[SynFolly]

It just sucks that if she decides to keep the baby and it is yours -- that the odds are you BOTH have created another potential problem child and ruined everybody's life and the people around you.

I think several pages ago he said it's the same situation she came from, so yeah, sounds like the kids in for a rough life if born. On the child side I have to say, and i do not say this lightly, some children growing up in shitty stiuations have high desires of suicides and constantly wish they had never been born. Those thoughts come through of "why am I here", "what point is there to live", brings people down very bad paths.

.

 

[5hummer]

I think several pages ago he said it's the same situation she came from, so yeah, sounds like the kids in for a rough life if born. On the child side I have to say, and i do not say this lightly, some children growing up in shitty stiuations have high desires of suicides and constantly wish they had never been born. Those thoughts come through of why am I here, what point is there to live, brings people down very bad paths.

.

Don't make excuses.
You have the opportunity now to do whatever you want.

Life is what you make it.

 

[genintoronto]

Well this is where you and a few other people will not like me, because I find it horribly manipulative when a woman takes what is an equal mistake, kicks the man out of the castle, ignores his every protestation, and for her own reasons, and without any input or discussion, decides to have a baby entirely on her own terms. Until you are on the other end of this, and at the mercy of someone you just slept with, you will never understand incredible frustration. But you are a woman, so you don't have to experience this.

I'm not saying abortion is a simple thing for a woman, or that there aren't profound decisions, implications for the women, but in the end, SHE is the DECIDER, not you, and that is very, very frustrating to men. It is the price we pay to have safe and legal abortions and for woman to choose their body's course without being threatened by men, but we can't pretend it's not a very, very unfair reality for the men involved.

See, I totally empathize with your frustration.

Yes, it must be extremely frustrating to feel like you have no say in such a decision that will potentially hugely impact your life. Even though you had your say in it: when you made the decision to use a condom or not.

But it is equally (if differently) frustrating to be the one who is invaded by a growing organism in her body, and who has to deal with the consequence of that 2 minutes mistake in a very visceral way. She can't just walk away. That option is not there for her. And depending on her situation, it may very well be the case that none of the options in front of her is a good option for her. So that whatever she chooses to do, she's going to have to deal with long term consequences of her choice.

Is it fair for you? No. But it ain't fair for her either.

 

[STASH]

I find it horribly manipulative when a woman takes what is an equal mistake, kicks the man out of the castle, ignores his every protestation, and for her own reasons, and without any input or discussion, decides to have a baby entirely on her own terms.

for woman to choose their body's course without being threatened by men, but we can't pretend it's not a very, very unfair reality for the men involved.

Yes


Mao you are being taught one of natures lessons. This same lesson has been taught to Men through out the ages. You not alone brother. They are woman ...you are a man. This is exactly how it works dude. Once we give them our sperm, it's theirs. and you can do nothing to alter their goals and beliefs. Mother hood is a womans game. Fucking them is a man's game, but then our team withdraws from the tournament.

Sucks doesn't it.

No way to avoid this lesson unless we castrate ourselves at age 10.....otherwise your in the army now.

 

[SynFolly]

Don't make excuses.
You have the opportunity now to do whatever you want.

Life is what you make it.

Try and explain that to preteen and teenagers in that situation who no one notices because they keep to themselves, shadows no one sees.

Adults different situation.

 

[genintoronto]

Oh, and you want to talk about unfair?

Try being a healthy woman below 35 and trying to get your tube tied. It's close to impossible. Apparently, a woman under 35 is not an adult yet with a mind of her own, and she can't know herself well enough to know that she doesn't want to make babies.

 

[Mao Tse Tongue]

See, I totally empathize with your frustration.

Yes, it must be extremely frustrating to feel like you have no say in such a decision that will potentially hugely impact your life. Even though you had your say in it: when you made the decision to use a condom or not.

But it is equally (if differently) frustrating to be the one who is invaded by a growing organism in her body, and who has to deal with the consequence of that 2 minutes mistake in a very visceral way. She can't just walk away. That option is not there for here. And depending on her situation, it may very well be the case that none of the options in front of her is a good option for her. So that whatever she chooses to do, she's going to have to deal with long term consequences of her choice.

Is it fair for you? No. But it ain't fair for her either.

No, I'm sorry I don't agree. She has a ten minute procedure that may leave some emotional scars here and there. A man spends the next 18 years in hard labour to pay for his mistake. Not the same shit by a longshot.

BTW, she kept telling me how difficult the decision is for her, and I'm like "Yeah, except when we're talking about the other guy and then it's easy, right?" Did you miss that part of the story gen?

I just got a PM by a member here who told me of paying child support for that amount of time and never being able to see his child. That is hell to me.

 

[Kyra.Graves]

I think that's the point Mao brought up at the begining. The understanding coming accross is that if it's not Mao, she's likely to abort the pregnancy, but if it is his she won't because he has support money. So, if she's manipulating that way, I'd have to say it's fair for him to manipulate back, until they hit the date were there's no turning back.

Doesn't sound like a case where she's come out and said "I want this child, am keeping it, and you may be the father" it sounds more like
"I'm pregnant, can't support a child, but if it turns out to be yours, then yeah, I'll have a kid"

Just what I've observerd of the thread, manipulation happening both sides.

Since the mother is not here to explain herself we cannot know what is going on in her mind, we only have Mao's side of it and I hate to say it but I don't think he's impartial.

It's possible that she might actually want a baby, however is not financially able to care for a baby alone. So she is afraid to go it alone without a parent that will be supportive. If the one potential father has said he will not be supportive and from what Mao has said that father will fight her she may have reached the decision that having a baby with him would not be feasable. Since she's had lengthy discussions with Mao who has told us he's said he'd be supportive in all ways (not just financially) if she really does want a baby it's reasonable to assume that she believes that having his child is possible.
It's only reasonable logic that having a baby with 2 parents would be easier than having a baby with one. So is that her being manipulative or is that her making a decision based on the facts as Mao has presented them to us?
Heck that's not even her side of it that's just the facts as he presented them but looked at from a different perspective (one not his) imagine what it might be like if we actually had witness to the discussions.

Oh and MichaelZzzz as usual wonderful post, thank you.

 

[Mao Tse Tongue]

Oh, and you want to talk about unfair?

Try being a healthy woman below 35 and trying to get your tube tied. It's close to impossible. Apparently, a woman under 35 is not an adult yet with a mind of her own, and she can't know herself well enough to know that she doesn't want to make babies.

Maybe you need some protection then?

 

[Kyra.Graves]

Oh, and you want to talk about unfair?

Try being a healthy woman below 35 and trying to get your tube tied. It's close to impossible. Apparently, a woman under 35 is not an adult yet with a mind of her own, and she can't know herself well enough to know that she doesn't want to make babies.

Got denied 5 times, I'm not an adult yet. I'm surprised they let me vote!

 

[Mao Tse Tongue]

Since the mother is not here to explain herself we cannot know what is going on in her mind, we only have Mao's side of it and I hate to say it but I don't think he's impartial. :

It's possible that she might actually want a baby, however is not financially able to care for a baby alone. So she is afraid to go it alone without a parent that will be supportive. If the one potential father has said he will not be supportive and from what Mao has said that father will fight her she may have reached the decision that having a baby with him would not be feasable. Since she's had lengthy discussions with Mao who has told us he's said he'd be supportive in all ways (not just financially) if she really does want a baby it's reasonable to assume that she believes that having his child is possible.
It's only reasonable logic that having a baby with 2 parents would be easier than having a baby with one. So is that her being manipulative or is that her making a decision based on the facts as Mao has presented them to us?
Heck that's not even her side of it that's just the facts as he presented them but looked at from a different perspective (one not his) imagine what it might be like if we actually had witness to the discussions.

I couldn't agree with you more. Mao is just a series of words on the screen. Reality is entirely subjective. Maybe I'm the good guy and she's the she-devil after all.

But I started the thread to get some specific advice. I only continued to post because of lunacy of the snap judgements. Maybe time to go to bed.

 

[genintoronto]

Got denied 5 times, I'm not an adult yet. I'm surprised they let me vote!

Me, 4 times.

I'm thinking of using the hooker angle next time. I'm assuming they will be more willing to sterilize me if they know I'm a dirty girl who fuck random men for money.

 

[Mao Tse Tongue]

Okay, night all. Get your flames in over night.

And if you do fuck someone bareback, don't forgive yourself, just get a good lawyer who can do that for you @ $500 an hour. Whoot.

 

[STASH]

Me, 4 times.

I'm a dirty girl who fuck random men for money.

Cleaning my cum off the ceiling now

 

[Keebler Elf]

There is a one in four chance this baby will be mine and be born. Until then, it's war.

Hard to have sympathy for someone who makes comments like this.

Bottom line is you fucked up. Trying to manipulate your way out of it is simply trying to weasel out of your responsibility.

What should you do? Sit down with her and tell her exactly how you feel.

What will you do? Go on the internet and declare "war" on her.

Sad.

And before you go on the, "if you were in my shoes" rant, yes, if I were in your shoes I might be weak enough to do the same thing you're doing. But that doesn't make it right.

 

[Aardvark154]

Well this is where you and a few other people will not like me, because I find it horribly manipulative when a woman takes what is an equal mistake, kicks the man out of the castle, ignores his every protestation, and for her own reasons, and without any input or discussion, decides to have a baby entirely on her own terms. Until you are on the other end of this, and at the mercy of someone you just slept with, you will never understand incredible frustration. But you are a woman, so you don't have to experience this.

I'm not saying abortion is a simple thing for a woman, or that there aren't profound decisions, implications for the women, but in the end, SHE is the DECIDER, not you, and that is very, very frustrating to men. It is the price we pay to have safe and legal abortions and for woman to choose their body's course without being threatened by men, but we can't pretend it's not a very, very unfair reality for the men involved.

I believe most if not all men in Canada or the U.S. would subscribe to the above.

 

[Mencken]

It seems possible that she may be setting you up because you do have the means to "provide" for her and her child.

Is it possible that she was already pregnant...by the loser...and was looking for someone with deeper pockets. If so, the last thing she will want is a paternity test.

You may know that this is "not" the case already. Just a thought.

 

[themexi]

The part about it being her body so she has 100% of the decision power to bring the child to term I agree with 100%

The part about her deciding to keep it AND enforce parenthood & financial responsibility on BOTH parents is total. bullshit. At this point if there was no binding relationship (marriage, commonlaw, etc) that would lead a reasonable person to expect tat the father would be there then she should be on her own if the father wishes it. If she can't hack it she should do the right thing; put the kid up for adoption.

As far as all this family law BS about the "best interests of the child" all I can say is bullshit. It is MUCH fairer to either up her government assistance OR take the kid & adopt it out.

Fuck the law. The laws are flawed & unjust in this situation. People who submit to unjust laws if there is way out are fools & those that would have you submit are unjust as well.


Bottom line dude, it's YOUR life & she want's a HUGE chunk of the next 18- 24 years of it. Do whatever it takes. Don't let the chumps in the "man up" crowd steer you wrong. If you have to make her life hell to avoid her doing it to you then do it. It is self defense & self defense is a natural right that trumps any & all others.

 

[Aardvark154]

Originally Posted by Mao Tse Tongue
There is a one in four chance this baby will be mine and be born. Until then, it's war.

Mao, Oagre and Michaelzzzz have given you sound specific legal advice. Now it is time for you to consider the larger legal landscape - yes, you hope the child isn't yours - but if it is, what kind of relationship are you going to have with this woman, and are you going to be able to have a relationship with the child?

There are of course different legal strategies in much matters, but I urge you to consider being supportive of the woman and her decisions and attempting to gently shade them. In many ways this is your best strategy. All guns blazing on the other hand, although it may be quite emotionally satisfying, and has a time and place in some circumstances, in this situation seems unlikely to get you positive results in the long-run.

Unfortunately in many ways you are along for the ride. Changing that fact is going to have to come from the Legislature.

If it's worth anything - sorry you find yourself in this situation.