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Most recent articles on prostitution related laws, opinions, comments

Fallsguy

New member
Dec 3, 2010
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So if this swedish guy used his right to remain silent, could they give him a ticket ? There is no proof against him, just visiting an apartment of an escort, he could remained silent when they asked him what he was doing there or just say that he won't answer any question before talking to a lawyer
Oh my God, when since did Sweden become a police state? All that trouble to arrest one poor schmuck for daring to see an escort. Did any of you catch that the younger cop in the car estimated that 10% of men still see sex workers in Sweden. That's pretty high for a law that's been in effect for fifteen years.
I guess real crime is pretty low in Sweden, and the police have to do something.
 

wilbur

Active member
Jan 19, 2004
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So if this swedish guy used his right to remain silent, could they give him a ticket ? There is no proof against him, just visiting an apartment of an escort, he could remained silent when they asked him what he was doing there or just say that he won't answer any question before talking to a lawyer
I saw the video in question after my previous post.

He admitted while he was being interviewed to buying sex. The cop then stated that since he admitted to it, he's going to receive a fine. The implication is that if he did not admit to it, he could face some jail time if prosecuted in court.

I find the whole operation hypocritical. They are actually using the sex-worker as bait to nail more clients. So much for protecting sex-workers from violence (since radical feminists claim that prostitution is always against one's will, hence an assault, hence why all men who buy sex are criminals). The other issue is that the cop reveals that 10% of men in Sweden buy sex, and they come from all walks of life and professions: clergymen, police officers, teachers etc etc.; in other words, they are attempting to criminalize 10% of the Swedish population. Maybe one way men-hating radical feminists can get at men at large. I guess logic is not a form of reasoning very popular in Sweden.
 

GPIDEAL

Prolific User
Jun 27, 2010
23,359
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Consideration is basically something of value. The law prohibits sex for consideration (the actual act) *and* communicating for the purpose of exchanging sex for consideration. Consideration and communication are two separate things. Item #1 and #3 would be illegal under C-36. Item #2 above would be illegal if you communicated with the prostitute about the exchange of sex for money, which would likely be the case.
Item #3 would only be illegal IF it mentions consideration, no? (Communicating meeting for sex alone can't be illegal).
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
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Inflated stats and lumping everything under trafficking in my humble opinion. It's all a smear campaign to try and change public opinion which so far has been obviously against them.
 

squeezer

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Jan 8, 2010
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http://www.saultstar.com/2014/07/12/stop-the-talk-legalize-prostitution

Stop the talk, legalize prostitution


There have been calls for the Conservative government to refer its prostitution bill pre-emptively to the Supreme Court of Canada but Justice Minister Peter McKay, who has been quoted as saying the bill is compliant with the Charter of Rights and Freedoms even though no outside legal opinions were sought, continues to refuse to do so.

I think he is making a mistake.

Surely it would be better to get the Supreme Court to offer an opinion on the bill now so that it can be ruled constitutionally OK with some certainty or receive suggested amendments that would make it so, rather than simply pushing the bill through Parliament and having it eventually go to the Supreme Court through a Charter challenge that is sure to come.

Last December the Supreme Court threw out existing prostitution laws that, among other things, had made it illegal to communicate to sell or buy sex even though prostitution in and of itself was not illegal. The court said the laws violated the Charter and it gave the government a year to bring in new legislation.

In response, the government has come up with new legislation, Bill C-36, that makes it legal to sell sex but not to buy it.

As Parliamentary hearings resumed on the bill this week, Donald Piragoff, the senior assistant deputy minister in the Department of Justice's policy section, defended the bill, telling MPs, "The bill specifically deals with the safety deficiencies the Supreme Court found in the existing law."

But Leonardo S. Russomanno, speaking on behalf of Canada's Criminal Lawyers' Association, told the committee the bill is vulnerable to a challenge.

"It really comes down to whether C-36 would survive a section one Charter challenge. And, in my view, it would fail to do so on the basis it's not proportionate at all," Mr. Russomanno told MPs, adding the bill will drive sex workers underground and "utterly fails" to protect them.

I agree with the lawyers.

I don't see how this bill does anything more to protect those in the sex trade any more than what was in place.

And I can't see how it can be constitutional for it to be a crime to buy something that it is legal to sell.

As well, although this bill purportedly lets prostitutes off the hook, it really doesn't go all the way since solicitation by either party is still a crime.

The proposed amendment to Sec. 213 (1.1) of the Criminal Code of Canada says:

"Everyone is guilty of an offence punishable on summary conviction who communicates with any person--for the purpose of offering or providing sexual services for consideration --in a public place, or in any place open to public view, that is or is next to a place where persons under the age of 18 can reasonably be expected to be present."

That to me says those on the offering side, the prostitutes, might be Ok to actually sell sex, all right, but they can still go down for talking about it with a John.

The Canadian Press quoted Bob Dechert, the parliamentary secretary to MacKay, as saying the new law allows prostitutes to rent apartments, screen clients, hire a receptionist or security guard, and advertise what they are offering.

But in regard to advertising the bill actually amends Sec. 286.4 of the Criminal Code to say, "Everyone who knowingly advertises an offer to provide sexual services for consideration is guilty of (a) an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for a term of not more than five years; or (b) an offence punishable on summary conviction and liable to imprisonment for a term of not more than 18 months."

How are these kind of things supposed to help prostitutes? I can't see that the government has come up with anything better than what went before.

Actually, sex workers are on record as saying that because buying sex remains a criminal offence, the new law will drive them back into dark alleys and industrial zones, leaving them at risk.

They should also mention it will drive them back into neighbourhoods, such as was the case in the Sault where prostitutes sold their wares at the corner of Gore and Wellington streets until a police crackdown.

If sex workers can't set up shop indoors and advertise where they are and what they are selling, doesn't it just stand to reason that they will have to return to the streets or take their chances soliciting in bars?

They can't be expected to sit waiting in a room when nobody knows they are there and what they are selling.

Yet with soliciting still on the books, they are at risk of violating the law if they do anything else.

I think McKay's bill has taken us into the world of the bizarre.

On the other hand, I don't think there is a possibility that we will ever see a bill that makes sense because the intent in all will be to curb prostitution.

And folks, that just ain't (sic) going to happen.

Prime Minister Harper said this week that legalizing prostitution is "unacceptable to Canadians" but he didn't present any figures to back up that claim.

In fact, the claim flies in the face of an Angus Reid online survey of 1,007 Canadians, conducted June 6-7, that found 45 per cent of respondents believe buying sex should be legal, and an equal number opposed, while 11 per cent were not sure. A larger proportion, 51 per cent, believe selling sex should be legal.

Over time, these figures will change, more opting for legalization.

That's where I stand. Legalize it, regulate it and tax it so we can finally quit talking about it.

WELL, IT IS TIME for my yearly update on the cedar trees that have been planted along the solar farm on Black Road to form a buffer or, in more real terms, to hide the ugly panels from the motoring public passing by.

It ain't working, guys and gals.

It seems a majority of the cedars survived the harsh winter but the problem is the same as I reported last year, the grass in many areas is continuing to outgrow them.

I said then that they way things are going, by my calculation a tree buffer probably won't be in place until somewhere around 2020

That estimate probably holds. It certainly hasn't advanced.

But at least the majority of these trees, the planting in 2012 the third since the original effort in 2010 and being done in soil that had been raised a foot to give the trees a head start, are surviving, even if they don't seem to have any idea of what reach for the sky means.

.



Memo: Doug Millroy, editor emeritus of The Sault Star, can be reached at millroy@shaw.ca.


NOTE the ignorant comment of Rissa at the end of the article.
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
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Actually, Squeezer, the P.M. and MacKay probably want the issue back in Court before the next election. That way they will be off the hook: "Sorry, no comment. It's before the Courts". That's why they wrote such a bad bill in the first place, and that's why they're going to ram it through Parliament. (Remember, the government did not open this issue up of their own volition.) That's my take anyways. Who knows, maybe their strategy will even work to their advantage?
Exactly why we need to get rid of them before they try to pull off something even more wicked and mean spirited than this bill if they were ever to return with another majority.

The bottom line is they are dangerous to the well being of prostitutes and clients.
 
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canada-man

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Jun 16, 2007
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Toronto, Ontario
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Actually, Squeezer, the P.M. and MacKay probably want the issue back in Court before the next election. That way they will be off the hook: "Sorry, no comment. It's before the Courts". That's why they wrote such a bad bill in the first place, and that's why they're going to ram it through Parliament. (Remember, the government did not open this issue up of their own volition.) That's my take anyways. Who knows, maybe their strategy will even work to their advantage?

didn't they say they won't send bill c36 to the SCC? any news story saying they change their mind?
 

drlove

Ph.D. in Pussyology
Oct 14, 2001
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The doctor is in
It still sucks that I'll have to give up seeing escorts for literally years until the new law is finally struck down by the SCC...:frown:
 

Fallsguy

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Dec 3, 2010
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Exactly why we need to get rid of them before they try to pull of something even more wicked and mean spirited than this bill if they were ever to return with another majority.

The bottom line is they are dangerous to the well being of prostitutes and clients.
They're dangerous to our country and to our democracy. I hope voters aren't stupid enough to give them another majority.
 

Fallsguy

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Dec 3, 2010
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I think amazing age meant the new law will be challenged and goes before the court and NOT that this Harper regime is fair enough or smart enough to send the bill C36 to the SCC. It would be years before it is ruled upon and struck down again so not sure about his comment (the issue may be being back in court before the next election but the law would be in place until it is struck down for years after elections) as the next election is only a year and 3 months away.
445 days to be exact.
It won't take years. It will take one lower court judge to strike the law down as unconstitutional. The reason it took so long last time is because the courts kept giving the old laws a stay so that they were still on the books. I can't see a judge making that mistake again considering the mess the Cons came up with when they were given a year. Even if the law is stayed by a lower court, experience from the last time shows that LE doesn't put a lot of effort into enforcing laws that have been struck down, whether still in effect or not. The number of Bawdy House charges, for example, dropped to almost zero.
 

drlove

Ph.D. in Pussyology
Oct 14, 2001
4,734
74
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The doctor is in
445 days to be exact.
It won't take years. It will take one lower court judge to strike the law down as unconstitutional. The reason it took so long last time is because the courts kept giving the old laws a stay so that they were still on the books. I can't see a judge making that mistake again considering the mess the Cons came up with when they were given a year. Even if the law is stayed by a lower court, experience from the last time shows that LE doesn't put a lot of effort into enforcing laws that have been struck down, whether still in effect or not. The number of Bawdy House charges, for example, dropped to almost zero.
I could see the law being stayed by a lower court during the appeals process, as the government will undoubtedly do so to drag it out and prolong the inevitable for as long as possible. While I feel you're correct about LE not enforcing laws that have been struck down but still technically on the books, my concern is the chance - however minute, that I could be arrested and charged. I work in a field where criminal record checks are paramount, and even the publicity of an arrest (hypothetically speaking, of course) would not bode well for my career. I don't know if that's a chance/risk I'd be willing to take...
 

drlove

Ph.D. in Pussyology
Oct 14, 2001
4,734
74
48
The doctor is in
Well stated comments. There is no way. There is not enough rednecks in Alberta and feminazis in Manitoba religious fanatics in rest of Canada to even elect this corrupt dictators again. Latest poll showing under 30% support countrywide with liberals over 40%.
I hope you're right, CH but here's the irony of the situation:

1) The Cons got a "majority" through a very small percentage of the eligible voters actually taking the time to vote

2) As unbelievable as it sounds, there are hobbyists on this very board who voted for the Cons last time, and have no qualms about doing so again! - go figure...
 

squeezer

Well-known member
Jan 8, 2010
19,941
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I hope you're right, CH but here's the irony of the situation:

1) The Cons got a "majority" through a very small percentage of the eligible voters actually taking the time to vote

2) As unbelievable as it sounds, there are hobbyists on this very board who voted for the Cons last time, and have no qualms about doing so again! - go figure...
It really does boggle one's mind. I can't imagine voting for anyone who would call me a pervert for wanting to engage in adult consensual sex and setting the stage to have me arrested for it.

The last two articles are fantastic but of course it will fall on deaf ears.
 

TeasePlease

Cockasian Brother
Aug 3, 2010
7,738
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I hope you're right, CH but here's the irony of the situation:

1) The Cons got a "majority" through a very small percentage of the eligible voters actually taking the time to vote

2) As unbelievable as it sounds, there are hobbyists on this very board who voted for the Cons last time, and have no qualms about doing so again! - go figure...

Its not surprising at all. Look at the opinions in the lounge. We're mostly fiscal conservatives with above average income/wealth. That's why we can afford to hobby. The Cons appeal to our portfolios. Push come to shove, would we rather lose our stock broker or our cock broker?

More to the point, the wealthier you are, the less you think the law applies to you. You have political connections, or good lawyers. You pay for discretion. They can pass all the laws they want. It won't stop the real players. Why do you think hypocrisy is exclusive to the Cons leadership? Why wouldn't it also apply to their base? Lol. Take a look around. How many guys here think they're going to get caught? Ever?

No, the Cons will not lose their base because they're choking the chicken chokers. But they ARE losing their base because they are fucking up. They can't get the job done and the base is getting very annoyed. They can fuck up in private, but you don't air your dirty laundry in public. Ever. And harpers got his shit stained undies flapping on the flagpole on the Hill.
 
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