Israel boards activist flotilla, shots fired, reports of dead and wounded
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Israel is in a no win. If they sank the ships, the Palestinians get a PR victory (evil Israelis). If they attempt to peacefully intervene and fail, the Palestinians get a PR victory (weak Israelis). Attempting a peaceful intervention that turns violent, the Palestinians get a PR victory (evil Israelis). If they let them through, the Palestinians get a PR victory (weak Israelis). If they stop blockading Gaza with violent Hamas still in control, the Palestinians get a PR victory (weak Israelis). If they continue the blockade, the Palestinians get a PR victory (evil Israelis).And that is why they f**ked up. Israel, of all countries, to come unprepared like this is shocking. They should have known that physical resistance was almost guaranteed.
Since the Palestinians don't seem to be subjected to or care about negative press, the best Israel can accomplish is not getting screwed to bad.
Because the Arab states tend to be anti-western? If they didn't have Israel as a scapegoat, they would be left just blaming the US for everything.Why would you nuke so many countries in the ME when nuking just one would solve all the problems?
Greater ROI.
Have you considered the option, that the EU has been calling for, namely to lift this blakade of Gaza?Israel is in a no win. If they sank the ships, the Palestinians get a PR victory (evil Israelis). If they attempt to peacefully intervene and fail, the Palestinians get a PR victory (weak Israelis). Attempting a peaceful intervention that turns violent, the Palestinians get a PR victory (evil Israelis). If they let them through, the Palestinians get a PR victory (weak Israelis). If they stop blockading Gaza with violent Hamas still in control, the Palestinians get a PR victory (weak Israelis). If they continue the blockade, the Palestinians get a PR victory (evil Israelis).
Since the Palestinians don't seem to be subjected to or care about negative press, the best Israel can accomplish is not getting screwed to bad.
I hate Israel's tactics. They are scum for destroying Palestinian villages and expanding their settlements. Their wars are over-reactions and grossly disproportionate, and should result in numerous war-crimes charges.
But they are there and they are surrounded by people who want to kill them and they are fighting for their survival. As much as I hate their behaviour, I cannot condemn them for stopping a flotilla of ships which could very well have been transporting arms into Gaza which would later be used to kill Israeli civilians. It was their moral duty to protect their people from this (very real) potential. They were right to board the ships. They offered the flotilla the opportunity to deliver their humanitarian supplies to the needy and innocent people in Gaza. They were right to defend their soldiers and sailors when they were attacked. The people on the flotilla were 100% wrong.
But they are there and they are surrounded by people who want to kill them and they are fighting for their survival. As much as I hate their behaviour, I cannot condemn them for stopping a flotilla of ships which could very well have been transporting arms into Gaza which would later be used to kill Israeli civilians. It was their moral duty to protect their people from this (very real) potential. They were right to board the ships. They offered the flotilla the opportunity to deliver their humanitarian supplies to the needy and innocent people in Gaza. They were right to defend their soldiers and sailors when they were attacked. The people on the flotilla were 100% wrong.
Someone on TV said that Israel could have "disable" the ships. Is that true? I think these "activists" are simply pawns of the terrorists and too naive to know they are being played.If they sank the ships,
Fuji just said that there is a valid reason for the blockade (keep weapons from entering Gaza).namely to lift this blakade of Gaza?
If Israel is backed into a corner and is going down, they will take an awful lot of Arabs with them. Is that what the "international community" and the "activists" wants?Pray that America supports Israel forever, because the instant that it stops, the charade is over.
Please re-read what I wrote. That's in there. Lifting the blockade would be claimed as a victory of the armed resistance and only encourage further violence just like Israel pulling out of Gaza did.Have you considered the option, that the EU has been calling for, namely to lift this blakade of Gaza?
They were fooled into thinking that pro-Palestinian protesters could be peaceful, whereas in fact probably all pro-Palestinian protesters should be treated as terrorist fighters.WTF happened to the IDF? This has to be the most inept raid ever performed by anybody. If they had been as inept on July 4, 1976, not a single passenger on that jet in Entebbe would have survived.
Reports are saying that Isreali soldiers were firing before boarding ships.
We haven't heard the full story yet, though I expect the Israeli propaganda team is going full out (you must be getting tired now, Fuji).
The blockade is collective punishment, which is against the Geneva Conventions.
According to the UN, only one quarter of the necessary food is getting in.
The blockade targets food, childrens toys, cloths and cement.
10% of the children in Gaza are stunted, are malformed to do continuing malnutrition from this blockade.
What I hope, is that this act of piracy will help publicize the crimes Israel are committing to the people of Gaza.
No more Apartheid.
We haven't heard the full story yet, though I expect the Israeli propaganda team is going full out (you must be getting tired now, Fuji).
The blockade is collective punishment, which is against the Geneva Conventions.
According to the UN, only one quarter of the necessary food is getting in.
The blockade targets food, childrens toys, cloths and cement.
10% of the children in Gaza are stunted, are malformed to do continuing malnutrition from this blockade.
What I hope, is that this act of piracy will help publicize the crimes Israel are committing to the people of Gaza.
No more Apartheid.
Oh lickspittle, you share the Zionist addiction to violence. That's the only solution Zionism has to anything.They were fooled into thinking that pro-Palestinian protesters could be peaceful, whereas in fact probably all pro-Palestinian protesters should be treated as terrorist fighters.
Universal human rights scares zionists to the core. It is contrary to the fundamental ethos of Zionism.
Reports from the organizers of the flotilla say that. Video of the event says different. The organizers lied to you.Reports are saying that Isreali soldiers were firing before boarding ships.
Their OWN video shows different.
Since when? Citation needed.The blockade is collective punishment, which is against the Geneva Conventions.
According to WHICH part of the UN? Not according to the UNSC. Maybe according to some biased lickspittle like UNRWA.According to the UN, only one quarter of the necessary food is getting in.
Bullshit. Utter bullshit. You CANNOT substantiate that with a valid reference. Maybe UNRWA :rollseyes:10% of the children in Gaza are stunted, are malformed to do continuing malnutrition from this blockade.
You seem like a reasonable guy who is simply unaware of the extent to which agencies of the UN general assembly that relate to Israel are stacked with Arab nations bent on Israel's destruction. UNHCR, UNRWA, OHCHR: Check out their members sometime. OHCHR is the most pathetic--a bunch of abusive, dictatorial, brutal Arab states in which human rights are unheard of who do nothing all day but pass resolutions against Israel, while staying completely mum on the ongoing genocide in Arab Sudan. What a joke.
Unless it comes from the UNSC don't believe a word of it.
This was a PR victory for the Palestinians. Nasty IDF thugs storm ship and kill people. Israel knew these ships were coming for days if not weeks. As has been said, whatever Israel did, they would have lost on some level so it was a no-win for them.
Nobody can seriously say, whether side they take, that today wasn't a public black eye for Israel as far a world opinion goes. In this, the Palestinians got the press and support they wanted.
Politicians in Canada and the U.S. support Israel whatver they do as the Jewish political lobbyists in Canada and especially in the U.S. are well funded and very good at their jobs. The only time a rift occurs with the U.S. and Israel is when Israel slights the U.S. like in the VP Biden episode. That had nothing to do with Palestinian policy and everything to do with an offended Obama using diplomatic unpleasantries as payback for a snub. If the IDF started mass executions of Palestinians I wouldn't be surprised if Harper issued a message of Canadian-Israeli solidarity LOL. In the EU and elsewhere where the lobbyists do not have the money and clout they have in the U.S. and Canada, reaction to Israel's handling of the Gaza issue is negative towards Israel.
Anyway, I knew days ago this flotila was a no-win for Israel whatever action it took - it was a PR stunt.
Boycotting fruit in the EU isn't going to make Israel change their policy. Only two things: internal dissent of Jewish voters at government policy, and U.S. ceasing support, would make Israel change its ways. Since the lobbyists have ensured U.S. political support will remain, it is up to Israel's own voters to ask for a change in policy. Of course if they lift the blockade and Hamas starts firing rockets again, why would Israel want to not have a blockade? The voter's main concern is their not wanting rockets to fall on their towns/cities...that is more important than what the EU thinks of them
Nobody can seriously say, whether side they take, that today wasn't a public black eye for Israel as far a world opinion goes. In this, the Palestinians got the press and support they wanted.
Politicians in Canada and the U.S. support Israel whatver they do as the Jewish political lobbyists in Canada and especially in the U.S. are well funded and very good at their jobs. The only time a rift occurs with the U.S. and Israel is when Israel slights the U.S. like in the VP Biden episode. That had nothing to do with Palestinian policy and everything to do with an offended Obama using diplomatic unpleasantries as payback for a snub. If the IDF started mass executions of Palestinians I wouldn't be surprised if Harper issued a message of Canadian-Israeli solidarity LOL. In the EU and elsewhere where the lobbyists do not have the money and clout they have in the U.S. and Canada, reaction to Israel's handling of the Gaza issue is negative towards Israel.
Anyway, I knew days ago this flotila was a no-win for Israel whatever action it took - it was a PR stunt.
Boycotting fruit in the EU isn't going to make Israel change their policy. Only two things: internal dissent of Jewish voters at government policy, and U.S. ceasing support, would make Israel change its ways. Since the lobbyists have ensured U.S. political support will remain, it is up to Israel's own voters to ask for a change in policy. Of course if they lift the blockade and Hamas starts firing rockets again, why would Israel want to not have a blockade? The voter's main concern is their not wanting rockets to fall on their towns/cities...that is more important than what the EU thinks of them
The Hamas-linked sponsors of the flotilla want to break the blockade for a very simple reason: They want weapons.
How to break a blockade? Send in ships with controversial shipments that are just over the line. Keep it up until the blockade is untenable, despite Israel's offer to ferry the goods into Gaza by land after inspecting them.
Once you've successfully undermined the blockade start shipping in missiles and bombs.
That's their objective--only this time by packing the ship with hardened fighters and letting the world see it hopefully people will clue in.
How to break a blockade? Send in ships with controversial shipments that are just over the line. Keep it up until the blockade is untenable, despite Israel's offer to ferry the goods into Gaza by land after inspecting them.
Once you've successfully undermined the blockade start shipping in missiles and bombs.
That's their objective--only this time by packing the ship with hardened fighters and letting the world see it hopefully people will clue in.
http://unispal.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/0/CB9A27EF05BB52408525759F0061B366Since when? Citation needed.
According to WHICH part of the UN? Not according to the UNSC. Maybe according to some biased lickspittle like UNRWA.
Bullshit. Utter bullshit. You CANNOT substantiate that with a valid reference. Maybe UNRWA :rollseyes:
.
There you go.
WHO
UNICEF
Clearly enemies of Israel.
So you support the mass starvation of children?
Oh, here's another one from Haaretz.
http://www.haaretz.com/news/poll-10-of-palestinian-children-have-lasting-malnutrition-effects-1.217826
So, you support the mass starvation of children?
http://www.haaretz.com/news/poll-10-of-palestinian-children-have-lasting-malnutrition-effects-1.217826
So, you support the mass starvation of children?
And just for fun. What happens if Turkey calls on NATO and says, Israel has attacked one of our ships in International waters?
Turkey said the next round of ships will have military escorts.
Will Israel attack NATO next?
They might have metal bars and slingshots?
http://news.antiwar.com/2010/05/31/turkey-future-gaza-aid-ships-will-have-military-escorts/
Turkey said the next round of ships will have military escorts.
Will Israel attack NATO next?
They might have metal bars and slingshots?
http://news.antiwar.com/2010/05/31/turkey-future-gaza-aid-ships-will-have-military-escorts/
Well, as Aardvark 154 mentioned already, it has to be an attack on a state owned ship (warship) not a civilian ship registered in a NATO country.And just for fun. What happens if Turkey calls on NATO and says, Israel has attacked one of our ships in International waters?
Turkey said the next round of ships will have military escorts.
Will Israel attack NATO next?
They might have metal bars and slingshots?
http://news.antiwar.com/2010/05/31/turkey-future-gaza-aid-ships-will-have-military-escorts/
As for Turkey providing military escorts to a future flotilla to Gaza, well, that would indeed be interesting to track and see what happened. If Israel attacked a Turkish warship Turkey could complain to NATO. Last time I heard about naval escorts of blockade running cargo ships was in the Cuban Missile Crisis and involved a Soviet sub escorting Soviet freighters through a U.S. blockade. Wars can start this way.
You're argument of universal human rights is farcical. Give me one Islamic country where these exist? Not even close. You demonize Israel but their record on human rights is leagues higher than any of their Arab neighbours.Oh lickspittle, you share the Zionist addiction to violence. That's the only solution Zionism has to anything.
Universal human rights scares zionists to the core. It is contrary to the fundamental ethos of Zionism.
