End the Lockdown

[Malibuk]

The irrational and ignorant ones are the ones saying we just have to follow the Swedish method and things will be ok. Look at them. They're doing great. (Thank you for not repeating this message ad nauseum anymore bytheway...once is enough/too much). They've followed a lax approach like other countries who've got their asses kicked. Sweden's numbers are beginning to look bleak. They may be in for a world of hurt. Nobody knows. So the people saying we should be following their lead are ignorant because nobody knows how it will end up for them. But, I am one of the 15% on here who don't have a PHD in epidemiology so what do I know?

Of course the Sweden approach is not going to be for everybody, as cultural differences are immense.
How many people follow the rules?

I suspect that one of our biggest problems is that there were likely numerous selfish ignorant assholes who travelled to Canada and didn`t quarantine for 14 days.
They felt perfectly fine so there is no way they were going to miss 2 weeks of work, and lose the pay or waste the vacation time.
Asymptomatic spreaders may have made a brutal situation much worse.

We truly are in unprecedented uncharted waters and as you say, nobody knows.

 

[black booty lover]

Nope . Hasn't happen yet . I'm a lover not a fighter but I'm not afraid to give my opinion on any subject on here or in public . That's why when I read bullshit I call it as it is . Bullshit .

Don't know what brought on having my ass kicked . Are you a violent person . Looks like you resolve difference of opinions with violence .

Ever solve a difference of opinion or discussion with out resorting to violence . Sure looks like you don't . Nice way to live .

You have a nice day sport . Maybe do some volunteer work at the local seniors center to calm you down .

I'm well aware of your idea of love. It's to force women down on their luck to fuck you for a cheap price. Yeah, your a real lover alright....


If you and Tee Jay want a fist class trip to Wuhan I'd be more then happy to pay for it.

 

[John Henry]

I'm well aware of your idea of love. It's to force women down on their luck to fuck you for a cheap price. Yeah, your a real lover alright....

Are you some kind of idiot . Offering her a choice is what the landlord is doing . There is no force or rape involved . They make a deal . She would be out on the street if she had no choice and that's the Law . Many people make choices in life that they don't want to do . I made a bad choice in responding to your ignorant posts . I can tell that you are a very violent person . You have to bring up violence in settling a difference of opinion . I'm done with your stupidity and violence references .

Thank you for recognizing that I'm a real lover . As soon as this virus crap ends I'll be going back to my 2 favourite ladies . They LOVE the way I LOVE them . Even the married one .

You take care sport. Relax a bit . Maybe go volunteer at a seniors home or start a go fund me page for ladies who can't afford their rent . Yapping to me is not helping anyone . It does frustrates you and raises your blood pressure . The world is not a perfect place . It's filled with people like you .

What does Wuhan have to do with anything . You wish the virus on me ? See what I mean . You are a nasty person in wishing that someone get sick .

 

[black booty lover]

Are you some kind of idiot . Offering her a choice is what the landlord is doing . There is no force or rape involved . They make a deal . She would be out on the street if she had no choice and that's the Law . Many people make choices in life that they don't want to do . I made a bad choice in responding to your ignorant posts . I can tell that you are a very violent person . You have to bring up violence in settling a difference of opinion . I'm done with your stupidity and violence references .

Thank you for recognizing that I'm a real lover . As soon as this virus crap ends I'll be going back to my 2 favourite ladies . They LOVE the way I LOVE them . Even the married one .

You take care sport. Relax a bit . Maybe go volunteer at a seniors home or start a go fund me page for ladies who can't afford their rent . Yapping to me is not helping anyone . It does frustrates you and raises your blood pressure . The world is not a perfect place . It's filled with people like you .

What does Wuhan have to do with anything . You wish the virus on me ? See what I mean . You are a nasty person in wishing that someone get sick .

Okay SPORT. (you living in the 80's?) Hey SPORT, my blood pressure is just fine FYI. Just because I call spade a spade on escort chat board doesn't make me violent person. But take care as well SPORT!

 

[SchlongConery]

... But, I am one of the 15% on here who don't have a PHD in epidemiology so what do I know?

Will go down in TERB History as The Post of the Pandemic!

 

[squeezer]

https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2020/03...ponse-anti-trump-mass-hysteria-dies-covid-19/

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...st-weeks-saying-God-larger-dreaded-virus.html

Karma is a bitch!

 

[doggystyle99]

Canada is thousand of miles away from Sweden. And yet it is the only country you select for comparison while ignoring the fact Sweden, without a lock down, is faring much better than locked down countries Italy, Spain, France, Belgium, Netherlands and Switzerland on the same continent. Who is the irrational, misinformed and the ignorant here? Who?

04-12-2020, 01:00 PM#54
khufu
" We do not have to go to Mars to tell us what to do. We only have to look to Sweden. Those over 70 have been advised to stay indoors with their needs cared for with deliveries of food and medicines. Anyone with a cough and/or fever is advised to stay at home and alert the authorities and medics will go and run a coronavirus test and determine next course of action.

The rates of infection and deaths in Sweden have been higher than in Canada. Yet, Sweden kept kindergartens, primary and secondary schools open. The sky hasn't caved in. Mass gatherings of over 500 are banned but restaurants, bars, cinemas, garden centers, corner shops are all open with patrons spaced reasonably apart. Over two consecutive 24-hour periods, the number of deaths in Sweden has declined from 17 to 12. Seems the curve has flattened precipitously in that country without a lockdown.

Sweden refused to be cowed into submission by the coronavirus. Rather, Sweden has given the finger to the coronavirus. Sweden says life must go on with some precautions. The only thing the rest of us seem to fear is fear itself - said by FDR."

https://terb.cc/vbulletin/showthrea...ll-this-last&p=6675788&viewfull=1#post6675788

The only reason I compare Sweden VS Canada is because people like yourself keep referencing that we (As Canadians) should look at what Sweden is using as a model to combat the Coronavirus, which clearly is not a method that is working.
The words you used are "We do not have to go to Mars to tell us what to do. We only have to look to Sweden"

Further the daily death numbers you referenced to that dropped from 77, to 17, and 12 on April 12th have been on the rise just like I told you they would be to 20, to 114, to 170, 160 yesterday and so far 67 more today. As well I posted that the daily number of confirmed cases would also be on the rise and so far they have gone from 544, 466, 332 on April 12th to 465, 497, 482, 613 and 676 so far today

This is why I keep telling you referring to one or even a couple of days in drop in the daily deaths or the confirmed cases is not proof that any curve is flattened. It's truly amazing that we've been told Billions of times since January that one of the contributing factor to spreading the Coronavirus is asymptomatic carriers can carry the virus for weeks without showing any signs and some people still haven't understood this simple fact.

As for comparing Sweden to Italy, Spain, France, Belgium, Netherland, or Switzerland I don't know on what basis do you claim they are doing better? Is it based on total confirmed cases, numbers of death, death rate or contraction rate of the virus?
Why are you not comparing Sweden with it's immediate neighbours that are only 100's of KM's away or right on their border like Germany, Denmark, Norway, Finland, Poland, and you compare it to countries that are 1000's of KM's away?

 

[Jasmine Raine]

Agreed.

The feds were:

1. Late to react and implement preventive measures, chief among them closing the US border.
2. Overcompensating now imo. The most vulnerable should be the ones that really need to be protected as much as possible.

Nah, throughout Trudeau’s tenure as PM the Canadian govt has always been imo too much of a suck up to the US. States says Huawei should be arrested yet were the dummies doing their dirty work for them. We didnt close our borders because Trudeau has always been afraid of pissing off Trump.

Why is South Korea, Taiwan, Singapore, Japan etc faring the best what do they all have in common? Competent govts. Western govts are generally slow to take action and while Canada hasnt been the worse, theres certainly much room for improvement.

I agree with both posts.

But having said that, I can understand why our government waiting until the WHO called it a pandemic. They should have called it much sooner and more countries would have acted sooner.

I, like others, started social distancing and isolating before any lockdown was called. Many called not the WHO to call it sooner. Just wish some of those people where among our governing members.

 

[Malibuk]

'Massive blindspot': Missing data in COVID pandemic leaves US vulnerable

While discussions about flattening the curve, passing the peak and plateauing have generated some optimism, public health professionals fear that a key factor in understanding the novel coronavirus pandemic has been forgotten: the missing data.
There are at least 671,000 confirmed cases of COVID-19 in the United States, according to data compiled by the Center for Systems Science and Engineering at Johns Hopkins University. However, experts have warned that the number is likely much higher because testing has been sparse.
"We, in the U.S., have a massive blindspot because of the lack of testing," Dr. John Brownstein, an epidemiologist at Boston Children's Hospital and an ABC News contributor who worked on a website to help bridge the data gap, told ABC News. "We've not really had a deep understanding of the amount of illness that happened in the community."
"Without knowing, it creates a real barrier to us to be able to effectively model and project out the epidemic in the U.S. because we need to understand how much infection has taken place," Brownstein added.
Brownstein believes the number of cases in the U.S. is more likely in the millions. He said through the website he helped create, which allows the public to self-report any symptoms, some 400 people who responded (out of the 400,000 who used it) said they tested positive for COVID. But 4,000 displayed all the symptoms of the disease. The most severe cases may include fever, heavy dry cough, and serious breathing issues that can lead to hospitalization or even death. While 80% of cases are believed to have mild or no symptoms at all.
"The majority of people, at least 10x or more, who were displaying COVID symptoms said they were not tested," he said.
Antibody testing, which may identify those that have been exposed to the virus and recovered, also is not widespread, although there are efforts in several states. Antibody testing would give a truer sense as to how widespread the infection was in the U.S.
With all the missing information, Brownstein said it's hard to feel optimistic about the possibility of flattening the curve -- the concept of spreading out the cases that hit the hospital system over time so that resources aren't taxed, better care can be provided, and a second wave of cases is prevented in the future.
"When we don't have the true insight of testing, when testing is uneven and not comprehensive, it creates a fear on the part of public health that we may be relying on imperfect data to make decisions," Brownstein said.
He did note that if the number is in the millions, it offers a promising sign that the majority of people infected have not experienced severe cases.
Even that appears uncertain. Initial data coming out of China, where the pandemic appears to have started, was that 80% of cases were mild. But it's hard to know the true hospitalization rate or death rate without knowing the estimated total number of cases.
Dr. Angela Rasmussen, a virologist and associate research scientist at Columbia University's Center for Infection and Immunity, similarly said that the lack of data leaves the U.S. vulnerable when trying to understand the virus and make decisions going forward.
Unlike Brownstein, Rasmussen said it is too difficult to quantify the amount of data we're missing.
"I'll just say that we're missing a lot both in terms of people who are infected, as well as people who were previously infected," Rasmussen told ABC News.

 

[doggystyle99]

Sweden is rolling the dice but I think testing for the virus is far less critical for a country that is not facing the daunting dilemma of when to risk opening up the economy.
Every country`s death rate was higher when they had only tested 74600.
This is a statistically insufficient sample size in determining infection rate or real death rate.

I would be more interested to see comprehensive anti-body testing in Sweden to see if there is any merit to this herd immunity hypothesis.

You just made this supposed fact up yourself "every country's death rate was higher when they had only tested 74600", it is simply not true.
Canada, USA, Germany, France did not have a this high of a death rate at those early stages of testing. Canada, Germany, and USA have so far been around the 5% death rate and never close to the double digit of Sweden's current death rate of 10.6%.
Even Italy and Spain in early stages of testing were at around 7% death rate well below the current rate of Sweden 10.6%, and once their healthcare system was overburdened with cases and the numbers of dead exponentialy grew the death rate also started increasing drastically.

Yet once again you make false claims about the death rate and then mention there is not enough sampling size to determine the death rate or the infection rate all in an attempt to deem this important fact irrelevant.
The testing, the confirmed cases and the deaths are all very relevant to this virus as they represent how the measurements that countries have taken are having on the spread of the virus.
It's a very simple rule, if there is no social distancing than there is a higher chance of contracting the virus and a higher chance of dying from the virus unless other extreme health measures are taken.
For example in Sweden a person is almost 2X more likely to be contract the Coronavirus than a person in Canada and that person is almost 5X more likely to die from the virus than one in Canada.

 

[Malibuk]

You just made this supposed fact up yourself "every country's death rate was higher when they had only tested 74600", it is simply not true.
Canada, USA, Germany, France did not have a this high of a death rate at those early stages of testing. Canada, Germany, and USA have so far been around the 5% death rate and never close to the double digit of Sweden's current death rate of 10.6%.
Even Italy and Spain in early stages of testing were at around 7% death rate and once their healthcare system was overburdened with cases the and the numbers of dead exponentialy grew the death rate started increasing drastically.

Yet once again you make false claims about the death rate and then mention there is not enough sampling size to determine the death rate or the infection rate all in an attempt to deem this important fact irrelevant.
The testing, the confirmed cases and the deaths are all very relevant to this virus as they represent how the measurements that countries have taken are having on the spread of the virus.
It's a very simple rule, if there is no social distancing than there is a higher chance of contracting the virus and a higher chance of dying from the virus unless other extreme health measures are taken.
For example in Sweden a person is almost 2X more likely to be contract the Coronavirus than a person in Canada and that person is almost 5X more likely to die from the virus than one in Canada.

There were people dying before there was any testing.
So there was a time when the number of known infections passed and then doubled the number of deaths.
This does not mean that the death rate was 50%. Well maybe it does to some people.
And now it is 5%.
You have stated that the death rate will neutralize probably down to around 1%.
This is a consistent downward trend so obviously the rate is higher when calculated at 74600 than it would be when calculated at 1.3 million or several millions.

I did not claim that they were higher than Sweden.
Of course this is not the case as Sweden did not shut down their economy.
My point is that it is not a fair comparison to use a figure from one country with 74600 tests to ones that has tested millions, as those have had more time to neutralize, as you say.

I am surprised that Sweden`s numbers are not far worse.
They are ok with their situation so who are you to judge them?
Plus it is premature to do that in any case.

 

[Malibuk]

But, I am one of the 15% on here who don't have a PHD in epidemiology so what do I know?

I am amazed at all the experts here who seem to know everything.

I agree that we needed to do everything we can to prevent an overwhelming surge but I don`t think it is possible to stay locked down until there is an effective vaccine.
So probably within a couple of months we will need to start taking some chances opening up the economy, and some people will die.
Every life is precious but at some point this cure could end up being far worse than the virus.
Our health care system will not be very effective in an economic depression.

 

[gundam789]

The probelm here is that a family of 4 can't stay on lockdown for more then 30 days without running out of money.
Do you guys see the probelm here with this great economy that you're all so eager to get back to?

 

[Smallcock]

There are now cop roadblocks around the city... stopping people and asking them where they're driving to... why they're outside. This is sick.

 

[bebe]

There are now cop roadblocks around the city... stopping people and asking them where they're driving to... why they're outside. This is sick.

This is just the beginning. It's only going to get worse as the weather improves.

All the more reason to reopen parts of the economy.

WAZE needs to update for Road Blocks... LOL

 

[doggystyle99]

Sweden is rolling the dice but I think testing for the virus is far less critical for a country that is not facing the daunting dilemma of when to risk opening up the economy.
Every country`s death rate was higher when they had only tested 74600.
This is a statistically insufficient sample size in determining infection rate or real death rate.

I would be more interested to see comprehensive anti-body testing in Sweden to see if there is any merit to this herd immunity hypothesis.

There were people dying before there was any testing.
So there was a time when the number of known infections passed and then doubled the number of deaths.
This does not mean that the death rate was 50%. Well maybe is does to some people.
And now it is 5%.
You have stated that the death rate will neutralize probably down to around 1%.
This is a consistent downward trend so obviously the rate is higher when calculated at 74600 than it would be when calculated at 1.3 million or several millions.

I did not claim that they were higher than Sweden.
Of course this is not the case as Sweden did not shut down their economy.
My point is that it is not a fair comparison to use a figure from one country with 74600 tests to ones that has tested millions, as those have had more time to neutralize, as you say.

I am surprised that Sweden`s numbers are not far worse.
They are ok with their situation so who are you to judge them?
Plus it is premature to do that in any case.

All the above posts tate are highlighted are false. Those are made up facts based on your opinion and non factual.
In which countries were people dying from the Coronavirus before they started testing?
I am unaware of any country that this happened in.

In the countries Canada, USA, Germany, France the death rate started off at a significantly lower percentage than what it is currently.
In the early stages of testing between 75K-100K tests administered the death rate for these countries were:

Canada-------Over 1%
USA-----------Over 1%
Germany-----Under 1%
France--------Over 6%

Currently these countires death rate are:
Canada--------Over 4%
USA------------Over 5%
Germany------Over 3%
France---------Under 11%

This notion that once more testing is done the death rate drops is not true, as more positive testing and positive results it puts further pressure on the healthcare system and at the point that the healthcare system is overburdened with cases the death rate sharply increases exactly like what happened in Italy, France and is now happening in New York.
The only way the death rate will start to go down is when the curve gets flattened and in the case of the Coronavirus a flattened curve needs to happen over weeks due to the asymptomatic spread of the virus.

 

[Smallcock]

But, I am one of the 15% on here who don't have a PHD in epidemiology so what do I know?

Even the ones that DO have a PhD, don't all agree on how to handle the current situation. This crisis has less to do with scientific expertise as it does basic rational thinking. You don't substitute a medical pandemic for a medical pandemic PLUS an economic pandemic for a disease that kills so few. Then again, this isn't about merely responding to the virus... there are other seismic shifts underway.

You didn't learn one of the most salient lessons of this crisis... don't blindly follow the experts.

 

[Malibuk]

This notion that once more testing is done the death rate drops is not true, as more positive testing and positive results it puts further pressure on the healthcare system and at the point that the healthcare system is overburdened with cases the death rate sharply increases exactly like what happened in Italy, France and is now happening in New York.
The only way the death rate will start to go down is when the curve gets flattened and in the case of the Coronavirus a flattened curve needs to happen over weeks due to the asymptomatic spread of the virus.

You are the one who claimed that the death rate will "neutralize".
Now I agree with you that a flawed methodology will remain flawed.

The death rate will change as treatments and early detection advance.
All of these other bullshit numbers you are spewing is simply statistics catching up to reality over time.

There is no logical reason to believe that the death rate (dead relative to total infections) will vary greatly between countries with similar demographics and health care systems.

Of course, infection rate and gross number of dead is another matter, a much more relevant matter.

 

[Malibuk]

In which countries were people dying from the Coronavirus before they started testing?
I am unaware of any country that this happened in.

Are you saying that China sequenced the virus, shared this data so that the World could develop testing processes, and these processes were completed and implemented before there were any deaths?

In any case, even if this were so, I was just trying to enlighten you to some basic mathematics.

Right now in Ontario, there have been 136,992 tested, 9525 positive, 478 dead.
So the flawed death rate is 5%.
The only way this would be a real death rate right now would be if the other 99% of the population has 0 infections.
That isn`t to say that the real rate is 99 times lower as the testing is skewed to the most likely to be sick, but it is many times lower for sure.

 

[doggystyle99]

You are the one who claimed that the death rate will "neutralize".
Now I agree with you that a flawed methodology will remain flawed.

The death rate will change as treatments and early detection advance..
All of these other bullshit numbers you are spewing is simply statistics catching up to reality over time.

There is no logical reason to believe that the death rate (dead relative to total infections) will vary greatly between countries with similar demographics and health care systems.

Of course, infection rate and gross number of dead is another matter, a much more relevant matter.

All the above posts tate are highlighted are false. Those are made up facts based on your opinion and non factual.
In which countries were people dying from the Coronavirus before they started testing?
I am unaware of any country that this happened in.

In the countries Canada, USA, Germany, France the death rate started off at a significantly lower percentage than what it is currently.
In the early stages of testing between 75K-100K tests administered the death rate for these countries were:

Canada-------Over 1%
USA-----------Over 1%
Germany-----Under 1%
France--------Over 6%

Currently these countires death rate are:
Canada--------Over 4%
USA------------Over 5%
Germany------Over 3%
France---------Under 11%

This notion that once more testing is done the death rate drops is not true, as more positive testing and positive results it puts further pressure on the healthcare system and at the point that the healthcare system is overburdened with cases the death rate sharply increases exactly like what happened in Italy, France and is now happening in New York.
The only way the death rate will start to go down is when the curve gets flattened and in the case of the Coronavirus a flattened curve needs to happen over weeks due to the asymptomatic spread of the virus.

Yes I said exactly that in my post it will go down when the curve gets flattened.
None of what you posted in your earlier post that I already responded to in my previous post were factual and again what you are now claiming that I am highlighting is non factual.
In your earlier post you claimed "people were dying before there was testing" in which countries did people die before they were tested for the Coronavirus?
I am fully unaware of this ever happening in any country.

Which countries have the exact same demographics and same health care systems, that have taken the exact same measures?

The reason in believing death rates will vary from country to country is that no two countries have the exact same population, demographics nor health care system nor have all countries taken the exact same measure to fight the virus.
As for calling the numbers bullshit they are not and numbers are extremely important to quote as they put into perspective what is happening on a daily basis and usually represent a trend.
It's easy for you to say "Every country's death rate was higher when they had tested 74 600" but it doesn't make it true just because you say it. What makes it true are the statistics that are behind it and the statistics in this case prove otherwise.