My memory may note serve me correctly, but wasn't the Hutch situation at the beginning of last year somewhat similar to Stroman this year? Opening day starter. Great stuff. Could dominate. So they let Hutch have until August to work it out, and then he got sent to the minors to work it out. I guess making the same mistake twice is a good thing? I think at this point Hutch is a better option. Perhaps Stroman needs a bit of a reality check. The cockiness and the tantrums aren't working-perhaps he is missing Buehrle and Price to help with his mental approach. He has good stuff but has to realize that he's in the majors now and lots of people have good stuff. Send him to the minors and make him want to get back to the show.
Blue Jays: 2016 Edition
- Thread starter Perry Mason
- Start date
Hutchinson has never been viewed as been the same type of quality pitcher Stroman is supposed have the potential to be. I don't think bringing up Hutch at THIS TIME, is the right move. If Stroman continues to struggle over his next 3 or 4 starts, than maybe you bring up someone from AAA.My memory may note serve me correctly, but wasn't the Hutch situation at the beginning of last year somewhat similar to Stroman this year? Opening day starter. Great stuff. Could dominate. So they let Hutch have until August to work it out, and then he got sent to the minors to work it out. I guess making the same mistake twice is a good thing? I think at this point Hutch is a better option. Perhaps Stroman needs a bit of a reality check. The cockiness and the tantrums aren't working-perhaps he is missing Buehrle and Price to help with his mental approach. He has good stuff but has to realize that he's in the majors now and lots of people have good stuff. Send him to the minors and make him want to get back to the show.
FYI, after Stroman had his little hissy fit when Cecil couldn't hold his runners, apparently Pete Walker and few guys blasted him and set him straight on how to conduct himself as a pro.
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Not a huge fan of ERA in isolation or win loss for that matter but since you keep arguing the point..this is just out untrue. As I said, his era is his 92 out of 150 starting pitching spots in baseball. His ERA is 5.33. David Price who is at 71'st, has an era of 4.68. It's less than a run per 9 innings.
The NL average ERA for starters is 4.18. As I mentioned before the AL average ERA for starters is 4.51 Blended the MLB average is 4.35.
If you still think that Stroman's 5.33 ERA is middle of the pack amongst these numbers I truly feel bad for your grade school math teachers. Not to be rude or anything but you did call others stupid.
Would love to see a link to your ordinal ranking of pitchers. The problem I may see with that system is that the bottom third or so on a list like that will continually drop off because they are so bad they get replaced regularly. (are you saying there have only been 150 starting pitchers in MLB this year?) If you stick with the overall database, it encapsulates all starts made by pitchers in MLB.
As for any comparisons between Max Sherzer and David Price they are not particularly relevant to this discussion in my opinion. Why? This is about the Blue Jays situation and a pitcher that does not have a long track record, has clearly lost his way, his velocity is on the decline he and may have got his head caught up in the being annointed the "ace."
And as I am sure you are well aware, a Price or a Sherzer cannot be sent to the minors to work out issues, unless on an injury rehab assignment. Stroman can be farmed out to try to pull it together.
As for some games have not been bad....his best starts in the past 10 or so were against Minnesota and Philly, 2 of the worst offenses in baseball.
That explains you thinking that a pitcher's W/L record is important.yes i do.
**Hint, it's not.**
UFA? As opposed to another kind of free agent in baseball?He'll be an UFA so save the salery and spend it on someone else.
Not a huge fan of ERA in isolation or win loss for that matter but since you keep arguing the point..
The NL average ERA for starters is 4.18. As I mentioned before the AL average ERA for starters is 4.51 Blended the MLB average is 4.35.
If you still think that Stroman's 5.33 ERA is middle of the pack amongst these numbers I truly feel bad for your grade school math teachers. Not to be rude or anything but you did call others stupid.
Would love to see a link to your ordinal ranking of pitchers. The problem I may see with that system is that the bottom third or so on a list like that will continually drop off because they are so bad they get replaced regularly. (are you saying there have only been 150 starting pitchers in MLB this year?) If you stick with the overall database, it encapsulates all starts made by pitchers in MLB.
As for any comparisons between Max Sherzer and David Price they are not particularly relevant to this discussion in my opinion. Why? This is about the Blue Jays situation and a pitcher that does not have a long track record, has clearly lost his way, his velocity is on the decline he and may have got his head caught up in the being annointed the "ace."
And as I am sure you are well aware, a Price or a Sherzer cannot be sent to the minors to work out issues, unless on an injury rehab assignment. Stroman can be farmed out to try to pull it together.
As for some games have not been bad....his best starts in the past 10 or so were against Minnesota and Philly, 2 of the worst offenses in baseball.
Dude, your still missing my point, and don't put words in mouth. I didn't say anyone was stupid. I said the idea of moving Stroman to the bullpen or AAA was dumb and idiotic at this point.
Your "blended ERA" is irrelevant to my point, but your comment about the bottom 3rd being so bad they drop off helps illustrate my point.
So this will be the last time I will so say this, and hopefully it will stick with you. There are 150 starting pitching jobs in baseball. Of that 150, Stroman's ERA is 92nd. You still with me??? So to be exactly in the middle of the pack in a league where there is 150 starting pitching jobs, your ERA would have to be ranked 75th? Still with me? The guy is who is in 75th spot, is jon gray for colordo who's ERA is 4.83. So between Stroman and Gray, there is less than 1 run, per 9 innings difference. So that's where I say he's about in the middle of the pack for starting pitching spots in baseball.
I'm well aware, that Price and Scherzer can't be sent down for various reasons. My point, was that to this point in the season, these guys have given up about 1 run less per 9 innings, and people are saying things like "what do you with stroman? Put him the pen?"
So I'll say this one last time and then move on as we can only wait and see how he performs to determine which is the right move.
The over all point I was trying to make, when you look how hard to is to find good starting pitchers in MLB, and kid up until his last 8 starts has been pretty good, you don't yank the carpet from him cause he hit a rough patch, especially when you don't have anything that great in the farm system to replace him with. Not to mention, 2 of his last 3 starts weren't that bad. (ya ya, one was against philly, I know I know, cause no other starters face teams like philly and Minnesota right?)
oh and by the way, I got my original rankings from a special site called MLB.com
no your right, it's not really, I probably could have made my argument without using that stat but I just thought I would throw it in there to help...lolThat explains you thinking that a pitcher's W/L record is important.
**Hint, it's not.**
I disagree to a certain extent with you about +/- w though, but this is a baseball thread so we'll have to save that debate for the hockey thread.
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Original and oridinal are not the same words. Look that up on one of your special websites.oh and by the way, I got my original rankings from a special site called MLB.com
Original and oridinal are not the same words. Look that up on one of your special websites.
I looked up"oridinal" on one of my special websites, and nothing came up, "ordinal"...however did....
Your 92nd ERA out of 150 starters is so laughably flawed but you keep harping on it so let's shed some light on your dimness.
If you go to any stats web site, theres only 99 qualified pitchers for the ERA title of which Stro is 92nd.
there's 30 ML teams, 5 starters per so where are the bottom 51 starters? They sucked so they were sent to the minors or the bullpen.
Which is where we're saying Stro should go. Make sense?
(No, I know the answer)
If you go to any stats web site, theres only 99 qualified pitchers for the ERA title of which Stro is 92nd.
there's 30 ML teams, 5 starters per so where are the bottom 51 starters? They sucked so they were sent to the minors or the bullpen.
Which is where we're saying Stro should go. Make sense?
(No, I know the answer)
Ugh, it's you again.[making excuses for Storen]
He had a good string. I'll wait and see if it's a blip.
Edwing hits another 2 HR and 3 RBIs upto 69.
Edit: forgot the 9th inning shot
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and my point is they sucked so bad and were a lot worse than stroman and hadn't come close to showing glimpses of what he has done so far in his career and with nobody replace him, why send him down? Make sense?Your 92nd ERA out of 150 starters is so laughably flawed but you keep harping on it so let's shed some light on your dimness.
If you go to any stats web site, theres only 99 qualified pitchers for the ERA title of which Stro is 92nd.
there's 30 ML teams, 5 starters per so where are the bottom 51 starters? They sucked so they were sent to the minors or the bullpen.
Which is where we're saying Stro should go. Make sense?
(No, I know the answer)
okay so we'll agree to disagree. My opinion is that sending him to the bullpen or AAA accomplishes nothing and he should given more rope. Your opinion is that we should bring up someone in AAA with less potential and see if he does better.
Agree for sure.He has been bad his last 8 games. My point is, his first 8 games were good, to pull the rug out from under him this quick, with nobody better in the farm system doesn't make any sense.
1) No starting staff will go a full season without injuries or a need for days off. Hutch is their 6th man and should be kept ready for these eventualities.
2) The trigger finger happy TERB GM's obviously have not taken into account the job of management of a player's psyche. Stro is a confident upbeat guy who performs best when able to be himself. Last 8 games aside, he has been dominant, a morale booster for the team, and absolutely worked his butt off to make it back next season. Sending him down at this point, after only one poor stretch after all he's done would be a slap in the face. That is not how to maintain the loyalty a player has already shown and how to help him retain his confidence.
It is a stupid thing to do at this point of the season.
So you see absolutely no similarity to Hutch going into day one last year and Stroman at same point this year? Note I didn't say identical or that Hutch is as good a prospect, but they were talking big things for Hutch last year. Talking big things for Stroman this year. Obviously not remotely similar? And Stroman has had more than one "little" hissy fit, and in my opinion they aren't little. You sound like his mother. I've coached kids for years and dealt with mothers like you. Rationalizing. Give him more time. The other kids are not better. He has a cute temper.Hutchinson has never been viewed as been the same type of quality pitcher Stroman is supposed have the potential to be. I don't think bringing up Hutch at THIS TIME, is the right move. If Stroman continues to struggle over his next 3 or 4 starts, than maybe you bring up someone from AAA.
FYI, after Stroman had his little hissy fit when Cecil couldn't hold his runners, apparently Pete Walker and few guys blasted him and set him straight on how to conduct himself as a pro.
Bottom line-you want to give him more time and I think Hutch is the answer for now. We disagree.
2) The trigger finger happy TERB GM's
This is exactly the phrase I was thinking.
What a way to wake up the day with our own lovely BJ!
Cheers to BJ!!! Let's go, BJ!
www.catherinetog.blogspot.ca
XOXOXO
Cheers to BJ!!! Let's go, BJ!
www.catherinetog.blogspot.ca
XOXOXO
Ha! Thanks to lovely Catherine, now we have two things to cheer for!!What a way to wake up the day with our own lovely BJ!
Cheers to BJ!!! Let's go, BJ!
www.catherinetog.blogspot.ca
XOXOXO
Sharpie's ex team coming to town for 4 vs Jays over the long weekend holidays. If the Indians somehow ended up with the WS this season,Sharpie might know of how to build a winner with the jays in the near future.
