Israel at war
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I said that religious extremists who think they are the chosen people believe that, hammy.
Comments?
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Christopher Hitchens on Islamic Fundamentalism and America #shorts
Christopher Hitchens DESTROYS Islam#shorts #quran #islam #christopherhitchens #muhammad #atheism #hitchslapThank you for watching!Please LIKE & SUBSCRIBE for...
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You can find extremists like buddy talks of in any religion, schlong.Comments?
Christopher Hitchens on Islamic Fundamentalism and America #shorts
Christopher Hitchens DESTROYS Islam#shorts #quran #islam #christopherhitchens #muhammad #atheism #hitchslapThank you for watching!Please LIKE & SUBSCRIBE for...
Tony Blair said god told him to attack Iraq.
I'd be careful as that just looks like Islamaphobia, an attempt to demonize all Muslims based on one person's story about one other person.
Check this thread to see how many times Palestinians have been demonized, usually as 'terrorists' sometimes as 'human animals' or 'vermin' or 'lesser humans' as shack prefers.
Do you know any Palestinians?
They are just people.
First off, yes, one of my very best friends of 20+ years is a Palestinian who came to Canada by way of Jordan. I have been to his mother and father's house for family dinner on countless occasions. But he, and his father, mother and entire family have become antitheist and denounce Islam.
And a really nice couple I met socially a few weeks ago were born of Islam. He is Turkish and she Palestinian. As a matter of fact, I went to dinner with them last night at https://fatpasha.com/. "Funky eatery with country-chic decor serving Middle Eastern & European Jewish dishes" . She herself brought up the subject of Israel and Palestine by saying that I hope I don't think badly of her because of the way "her people" are behaving in Gaza and in Canada!!!
And one of my previous employee's wife is an Israeli citizen, of Palestinian blood and is a Christian 'refugee from the UN-holiset of lands" as she liked to say. About as Heinz 57 as they get!
And every single one of them denounces the terrorist and brainwashing cult tactics of Hamas and Islam in general.
So, ahem,
Religion? All of them are fucking lunatic cults. Including Christians, and especially Papal-enabled Altar Boy sodomizing Catholics. Of which Church I was confirmed in when I was 10 but have forsaken.
Besides, you failed to address the short I asked for comments. you just used it to tee off on your tired schtick like Mitch and the right wingers do at any opportunity.
You don't even have the respect to watch it. There was no "extremists" on any side in the 1778 discussions between Ambassadors. And the only idividuals identified were heads of state.
Did you watch the 60 second video? Did you not comprehend or did you choose to ignore the point? Do you dispute the historical Barbary /Tripoli facts Hitchens pointed out. That America/The West/Jews has not created the terror that is Islam. Paraphrasing because I don't want to transcribe... 'why do you kill us , we have no quarrel with you? Because the Koran says so, that we are to kill Infidels.. It blames Amricans, us, for the violence when in fact it is a feature, if not the CORE feature of Islamic fundamentalism.
Islamic fundamentalists and Palestinians have clearly stated their desire to kill every last jew from the river to the sea.
I'm honestly coming around from not-sure, to Israel's side. If there are millions of people who have clearly stated they wnt to kill every last one of my family, my people.... I'm not going to let them or run away.
Are the Palestinians too fuckiing stupid or brainwashed to understand that they should come to terms with the reality of 2024 and learn to get along instead of carrying forward hatred? THey have NO chance to acheive their goal of "liberating" Palestine. The fundamental problem is that they have been brainwashed to feel that getting killed, sacrificing their own sons and babies and future for the honour of killing jews and the rest of us infidels.
Sad, but it is the reality.
Peace will only come when Palestinians love their children more than they hate jews. And WTF does land have to do with it anyways. By your logic, the native American people have the same rights as Palestinians to kill, rape and terrorize you and me here in Canada and the USA for occupying their native land.
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Terrorism can be religiously OR politically motivated.Comments?
Christopher Hitchens on Islamic Fundamentalism and America #shorts
Christopher Hitchens DESTROYS Islam#shorts #quran #islam #christopherhitchens #muhammad #atheism #hitchslapThank you for watching!Please LIKE & SUBSCRIBE for...
Similar to his example, there are many, many examples of Christians committing violence in the name of religion via the inquisition, burning people at the stake for heresy, slavery (yes there was a biblical argument they used to justify it) yada, yada. Hindus have committed violence against Muslims in India. Against Sikhs as well. Zionists settlers have and continue to commit violence against Muslims in Palestine, because they are "the chosen people and Israel is their promised land", which is again religious mumbo jumbo and therefore religiously motivated violence. All of that amounts to terrorism.
Similarly there is politically motivated terrorism, which is where I believe Hamas falls. It has nothing to do with Islamic fundamentalism, but has everything to do with the politics of Israel and Palestine. Similarly another example of politically motivated terrorism is that Israel practices state terrorism against the Palestinians. Infact, Israel's minister of National Security, Itamar Ben Gvir, is a convicted terrorist, IN ISRAEL!
It is true that Palestinians have not had good advocates while Israel has had brilliant advocates on the international stage. It is also true that the Palestinians have made lots of political mistakes, in that they should have accepted the 1948 borders and established a state then and in the process squandered numerous opportunities they had. However the fundamental problem is that Israel has left the Palestinians with absolutely no choice. They control everything. Land, air, sea, jobs, currency, food, water, electricity - you name it. One cannot demand that Palestinians simply accept this oppression and kowtow to it. The Palestinians ask - "They have taken everything. What is there to compromise?" - which they are not wrong in asking. Its true that Israel has taken everything from them. The Israelis also as a matter of culture do not have any conception of the Palestinians as humans.
On the issue of genocide - "river to the sea" - that is not genocidal chant. Sorry. The Likud Party Charter, says "between the sea and Jordan, there will only be Israeli sovereignty" - which one can consider genocidal because it attempts to erase the Palestinian identity.
There is a lot more to say, but you'd have to read the history of Israel and Palestine to actually see how things transpired. If you think Palestinians should just accept the reality of 2024 and live as slaves to the Israelis, then you should also not be upset when right wingers argue that Ukrainians should just accept the reality that they have lost 20% of their country to Russia and therefore should not fight back. Would you?
Lastly the native American bit - Native Americans and the settlers in Canada and the US, DID fight. They did kill each other for a long time. Until both countries gave them citizenship, acknowledged past injustices and established a "one state solution". The narratives used were very similar, where the natives were considered savages etc., If we were still killing them and massacring them, they would be completely justified in attacking us. Bassem Youssef recently gave a speech at the India Today conclave in India and he said "You dehumanize people and treat them like animals, then you get the animal back". That is very true and perceptive.
Sorry schlong, but posting that video and saying 'comments' means you get comments.
What purpose did you think posting that video serves?
Hitchens was supposed to have been against all religions so why did you pick this one quote about one religion? Why didn't you pick a quote saying he was Jewish but anti zionist and thought zionism was a mistake? Why did you specifically pick that one quote that suggests you might think all Muslims are genocidal and have been for 150 years?
That's why I ask if you know any Palestinians. Clearly you don't know any well enough that they feel they can talk openly with you. Imagine being a Palestinian and undergoing so much systematic hate that you feel you have to apologize for your people when you meet people for the first time.
I did watch and comment on the video. One person telling a story about one other person. Its third hand testimony of some historic event that has no relevance to today's situation unless you were posting it with the claim that all Muslims still feel the same way. The racism and hate around that time was everywhere, you want to compare with American views towards indigenous? With British views of the 'colonies' and their people?
Sorry, schlong, I quite like your posts here but that post itself is racist. 'the terror that is Isam' is out and out racist Islamaphobia. Same as declaring that every Palestinian has declared a genocidal intent to kill every Jews, that's you expressing the kind of hate that you accuse Palestinians of feeling. No wonder your Palestinian 'friends' can't talk openly with you. And if you did want to compare that with anyone, you also have to tell us why you think this 150 year old story is more relevant than Netanyahu declaring Palestinians are 'Amalek'.
There is nothing to be gained by saying any one race of people is evil and deserve to be killed. There is no future for any country that is built on that much hate towards 50% of the people living under its control.
We are at a point where the ICJ will charge Israel with genocide, the ICC will charge Netanyahu and his team with war crimes and talks for a ceasefire are being held up by Israel demanding that regardless of an agreement they will still attack Rafah, where 1 million refugees live in tents and all 600,000 children have been reported as sick, injured or in famine.
Sure, Hamas committed war crimes on Oct 7 and they should be investigated and charged, as should the leaders of Israel. Not killed. Both sides have committed war crimes and crimes against humanity but the evil you accuse Hamas of doing now looks tiny compared to what Israel is presently doing.
Take them all to the Hague but stop the killing.
Posting 'evidence' that you think justifies what is clearly genocide is not a good look, schlong.
@Kautilya
Points well made generally. And I agree generally with you and those points.
Except for the part where you say "The Israelis also as a matter of culture do not have any conception of the Palestinians as humans. "
I know enough Israeli's and jews with direct experience there who have to various degrees and with various bias' tried to help me understand this perpetual conflict. None express any such inhuman thoughts, nor could I detect any reading between the lines. FFS, Jews don't even "hate" Germans. I generally find jews to be a bit odd in terms of some customs, but both of my ancestral and both of my religious cultures have odd customs too. Don't we all!
But one thing I have never detected from jewish people is hatred towards anyone. Nor any sense of inhumanity. Despite what I understand was their own history of being treated as sub-humans by many, including Palestinians in the past couple thousand tears anf Germans in modern history. And right-wing racists in 2024. Their anger towards Palestinians is certainly there. And IMO, a natural and justified response to the extremist Palestinians who are carrying out the terror du jour menu. Hijacking airliners to suicide bombers to home made missile attacks, and the Oct 6-7 thing. etc etc.
As I understand it, Palestinian people were and are accepted into society in Israel, far more than they are in fellow Arab countries. And for the most part, were happy to live under what some call Israeli "oppression" and others call "effective modern democratic governance". There are buses, water, electricity etc under Israeli governance. Hamas and the PA are pretty effective at making efficient use of foreign (Iranian) aid for creating tunnels, missiles and weapon... not so much with water and sewers.
If I'm a a Palestinian (even muslim), I'd rather live a life governed by (even jewish) Israelis. I hear they're pretty good with managing money too
Bringing the Russians and Ukrainians into this is truly a Red Herring from the Black Sea!
Whole different kettle of Gefilte Fish!
Oy veh
! We goyam and our shiksa-loving-schvantz's kvetching online Kibbutz already!. God forbid we just stick to schtupping?
Points well made generally. And I agree generally with you and those points.
Except for the part where you say "The Israelis also as a matter of culture do not have any conception of the Palestinians as humans. "
I know enough Israeli's and jews with direct experience there who have to various degrees and with various bias' tried to help me understand this perpetual conflict. None express any such inhuman thoughts, nor could I detect any reading between the lines. FFS, Jews don't even "hate" Germans. I generally find jews to be a bit odd in terms of some customs, but both of my ancestral and both of my religious cultures have odd customs too. Don't we all!
But one thing I have never detected from jewish people is hatred towards anyone. Nor any sense of inhumanity. Despite what I understand was their own history of being treated as sub-humans by many, including Palestinians in the past couple thousand tears anf Germans in modern history. And right-wing racists in 2024. Their anger towards Palestinians is certainly there. And IMO, a natural and justified response to the extremist Palestinians who are carrying out the terror du jour menu. Hijacking airliners to suicide bombers to home made missile attacks, and the Oct 6-7 thing. etc etc.
As I understand it, Palestinian people were and are accepted into society in Israel, far more than they are in fellow Arab countries. And for the most part, were happy to live under what some call Israeli "oppression" and others call "effective modern democratic governance". There are buses, water, electricity etc under Israeli governance. Hamas and the PA are pretty effective at making efficient use of foreign (Iranian) aid for creating tunnels, missiles and weapon... not so much with water and sewers.
If I'm a a Palestinian (even muslim), I'd rather live a life governed by (even jewish) Israelis. I hear they're pretty good with managing money too
Bringing the Russians and Ukrainians into this is truly a Red Herring from the Black Sea!
Whole different kettle of Gefilte Fish!
Oy veh
! We goyam and our shiksa-loving-schvantz's kvetching online Kibbutz already!. God forbid we just stick to schtupping?Another sad sack racist diatribe. But said with the confidence of someone completely in the dark.@Kautilya
Points well made generally. And I agree generally with you and those points.
Except for the part where you say "The Israelis also as a matter of culture do not have any conception of the Palestinians as humans. "
I know enough Israeli's and jews with direct experience there who have to various degrees and with various bias' tried to help me understand this perpetual conflict. None express any such inhuman thoughts, nor could I detect any reading between the lines. FFS, Jews don't even "hate" Germans. I generally find jews to be a bit odd in terms of some customs, but both of my ancestral and both of my religious cultures have odd customs too. Don't we all!
But one thing I have never detected from jewish people is hatred towards anyone. Nor any sense of inhumanity. Despite what I understand was their own history of being treated as sub-humans by many, including Palestinians in the past couple thousand tears anf Germans in modern history. And right-wing racists in 2024. Their anger towards Palestinians is certainly there. And IMO, a natural and justified response to the extremist Palestinians who are carrying out the terror du jour menu. Hijacking airliners to suicide bombers to home made missile attacks, and the Oct 6-7 thing. etc etc.
As I understand it, Palestinian people were and are accepted into society in Israel, far more than they are in fellow Arab countries. And for the most part, were happy to live under what some call Israeli "oppression" and others call "effective modern democratic governance". There are buses, water, electricity etc under Israeli governance. Hamas and the PA are pretty effective at making efficient use of foreign (Iranian) aid for creating tunnels, missiles and weapon... not so much with water and sewers.
If I'm a a Palestinian (even muslim), I'd rather live a life governed by (even jewish) Israelis. I hear they're pretty good with managing money too
Bringing the Russians and Ukrainians into this is truly a Red Herring from the Black Sea!
Whole different kettle of Gefilte Fish!
Oy veh
You were actually able to write a “some of my best friends are…..” post without any sense of how idiotic and racist it is? I grew up listening to these kinds of messages about Black and Brown people. They always looked like morons when they did it. Guess what? They were.
You didn't comment on the video I posted. You just used it to tee off on. You still haven't. You still just used it as springboard to go off further on your narrative.
And you make assumptions of me and my motives, bias' etc that I don't even know because I'm still trying to figure the whole thing out.
If you recall the thread about the guy in the BMW charged wtih murder of the police officer, you might recall me at one point saying, no matter how hard I am trying to comprehend the facts and testimony, not only do I still not understand it, I am more confused than when I started. That's because the cops were shading their testimony to obscure and excuse the behaviour and actions that precipitated the entire chain of events.
And once the objective facts of the physical evidence came into play, then I came to my personal conclusion that the driver was legitimately scared and instinctively fleeing, that the three on-scene police officers colluded in their note making and testimony, also likely did not approach nor handle the scene and situation approriately and their conduct was the proximate cause of Officer Northrup's death, and that the Crown et al were complicit in railroading a man and his family with an improper, political, purpose.
I expected comments and even opinion explaining pro and anti positions. ON THAT SPECIFIC POINT.
I can slosh through 800 pages of xitter re-posts myself. I didn't know anything about the Tripoli coast, Barbary pirates, American slaves, least of all it havig anything to do with Islam. Nor being permitted by the Koran under some infidel rule. Guys like @mandrill and @NotADcotor who are history buffs provide some relevant information.
I am still trying to figure out a much more complex situation, that greater minds than all of ours combined have not been able to.
Your posts, by and large, have the opposite effect that I think you want them to have. You are almost rabid and seem to be far past being able to have a reasonable discussion with.
Despite your counter-productive narrative, I do feel horribly for the Palestinian people. Even the Hamas terrorists. I can only try to imagine the rage and hatred bred and indoctrinated into me such that I would derive pleasure from killing anyone and genuinely look forward to being killed, as a martyr, myself! What a horrific life to experience. Never mind the reasons behind it.
I feel the same for Russians, and conscripted Russian soldiers.
But if I'm a Ukrainian living in my home and Putin sends them to blow up my house, rape my mother and re-claim this cpuntry as their ancestral homeland... they're going to have a helluva fight on their hands.
Same if my cousin is at a music festival and gets shot in a port-a-potty, raped and kidnapped by a bunch of fanatics directed by Hamas leaders living in luxury in aa safe third country, fucking right I'm going to raze every building to find every last one of them. Even though I know for every one I kill, I'm creating another that will ripen in 15 years. I gotta do what I gotta do, now.
And if Palestinians and Russians want to keep killing themselves at a ratio of 1 to 5 or 10, to win back what they feel is their ancestral rights, then that's their choice for this life. Stupid fucks sacrificing their lives for some ideology that is self-defeating.
And you don't know anywhere near enough about me or my friends or our relationships and what we feel comfortable talking about to say anything that doesn't demonstrate how Trumptard-like you have become when it comes to this issue. You couldn't be more wrong. Any more wrong than how I felt you and I had some kindred spirit. Your thoughts and words you express towards me suggest we don't. And that saddens me. Soory to say but you're acting like the Nottyboi of Palestine!
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Well, these may have been your personal interactions. However, I have personally interacted with many Israeli friends, who have expressed such views, and infact coming from a very pro-Israeli country, I was infact surprised, disappointed and taken aback by such attitudes, especially because these guys are all educated, well off and heck, they are normal family men.
So personal anecdotes in my opinion may be useful in forming some views, but they do not entirely reflect social values as the sample size is far too small and at the end of the day, we need to treat individuals as individuals and not as representatives of states or cultures, after all.
However I think people like Gideon Levy, an award winning Israeli journalist, are qualified, in providing some commentary about how Israeli society is:
I also realized a few days ago just thinking about this that, throughout history, the most uncivilized acts of violence, oppression and injustice have ALWAYS originated, in the most "civilized" places. Be it the holocaust, or colonialism, the inquisition, or whatever else. Wonder how that works (Basically the powerful oppress the weak).
The PA is good. Hamas is bad. PA is the internationally recognized representatives of the Palestinians. Infact, if after all this slaughter, Israel is infact successful in restoring PA's rule in Gaza, that would be a step in the right direction. Will Bibi let it happen? Because he wanted Hamas to be in power in Gaza, so he could delegitimize Palestinian statehood.As I understand it, Palestinian people were and are accepted into society in Israel, far more than they are in fellow Arab countries. And for the most part, were happy to live under what some call Israeli "oppression" and others call "effective modern democratic governance". There are buses, water, electricity etc under Israeli governance. Hamas and the PA are pretty effective at making efficient use of foreign (Iranian) aid for creating tunnels, missiles and weapon... not so much with water and sewers.
If I'm a a Palestinian (even muslim), I'd rather live a life governed by (even jewish) Israelis. I hear they're pretty good with managing money too
I think you are also conflating Israeli Arabs (who are also Palestinian) with the Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza. Isareli Arabs generally are better off by virtue of living in Israel but do face systemic racism in Israel.
But if you were Palestinian in the West Bank or Gaza, you definitely do not want life to be governed by Israelis. Even in the West Bank where things are supposedly peaceful, those Palestinians are subjected to apartheid, unlawful detentions, extreme restrictions on life and movement, evictions, settler terrorism - you name it. Check out Bt'Selem's YouTube page, where they document via video. Bt'Selem is an Israeli activist non-profit established in 1989, by Israeli doctors, lawyers and public intellectuals to document human rights violations in the West Bank.
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