Israel at war

squeezer

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And you have been told again and again, that you are wrong. You are not just objectively factually wrong, but your position is also morally bankrupt. According to International Law, turning off power, water and food is a war crime. If Hamas embeds itself within the civilian population, then yes, that is a war crime. But shooting those civilians to get to Hamas is ALSO a war crime. Hamas breaking International Law, does not absolve Israel from its own obligations. That is not my argument. That is international law. So you are wrong.

Israel by committing war crimes such as carpet bombing, attacking hospitals etc is breaking IHL per Article 51. Israel's use of collective punishment measures, such as movement restrictions, shelling of residential areas, mass arrests, and the destruction of public health infrastructure violates Articles 33 and 53 of the Fourth Geneva Convention.



Israel is not defending itself. Israeli self-defense ended on October 7. Self-defense is not done via invasions. That is argument Russia makes for invading Ukraine. It is nonsensical and idiotic.



Speculation. You do not know what Hamas intends.



Their stated reasons were the Al-Aqsa storming by Israelis. The 200+ settler attacks resulting in deaths in 2023 alone, which amounts to domestic terrorism. The unlawful detention of children and other Palestinians, (for which I gave you articles to read), without due process. The continuing occupation and oppression of the Palestinians. Now was the "raid" justified despite these reasons? No. It was terrorism. But, those were their stated reasons.



Because the majority of the population of Gaza are women and kids. Nearly 50% of the population of Gaza are kids. So the majority of the dead are women and kids.



EVEN if this position of yours was true, please explain, how it is justified for Israel to kill innocent civilians and kids and commit war crimes?

Either you are so morally bankrupt that you are arguing, "Oh they were asking for it". Which is the wife beater defence. Or you are saying Israelis are dumbasses who played right into Hamas' strategy. Which is it?
Again, you mention carpet bombing when you know full well it is NOT happening. Once one sees that nonsense, the rest of your post goes under "waste of time to read".
 

mandrill

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And you have been told again and again, that you are wrong. You are not just objectively factually wrong, but your position is also morally bankrupt. According to International Law, turning off power, water and food is a war crime. If Hamas embeds itself within the civilian population, then yes, that is a war crime. But shooting those civilians to get to Hamas is ALSO a war crime. Hamas breaking International Law, does not absolve Israel from its own obligations. That is not my argument. That is international law. So you are wrong.

Israel by committing war crimes such as carpet bombing, attacking hospitals etc is breaking IHL per Article 51. Israel's use of collective punishment measures, such as movement restrictions, shelling of residential areas, mass arrests, and the destruction of public health infrastructure violates Articles 33 and 53 of the Fourth Geneva Convention.
The actual experts are stating that Israel is not breaching international law. I realize that your buddies at the Socialist Collective Discussion Group for Anticolonialism and Trans Inclusionary Protest don't agree. But that's not my problem.

Israel is not defending itself. Israeli self-defense ended on October 7. Self-defense is not done via invasions. That is argument Russia makes for invading Ukraine. It is nonsensical and idiotic.
You're a silly man. A sniper is shooting at your kids from 100 metres across the Gaza border. To kill him, you have to go into Gaza and shoot him from the flank. So you invade Gaza. But it's still self defence.

I realize that your buddies at the Socialist Collective Discussion Group for Anticolonialism and Trans Inclusionary Protest don't agree. But that's not my problem.
Speculation. You do not know what Hamas intends.
They've made official statements that they intend to raid again.

Their stated reasons were the Al-Aqsa storming by Israelis. The 200+ settler attacks resulting in deaths in 2023 alone, which amounts to domestic terrorism. The unlawful detention of children and other Palestinians, (for which I gave you articles to read), without due process. The continuing occupation and oppression of the Palestinians. Now was the "raid" justified despite these reasons? No. It was terrorism. But, those were their stated reasons.
They've said they're going to raid again. "From the River to the See", the jihad continues.... Blablabla.

Because the majority of the population of Gaza are women and kids. Nearly 50% of the population of Gaza are kids. So the majority of the dead are women and kids.
EVEN if this position of yours was true, please explain, how it is justified for Israel to kill innocent civilians and kids and commit war crimes?

Either you are so morally bankrupt that you are arguing, "Oh they were asking for it". Which is the wife beater defence. Or you are saying Israelis are dumbasses who played right into Hamas' strategy. Which is it?
I've explained so many times. But you just give me the speech you learned about "anti colonial struggle and anti racism" - neither of which applies in Palestine.
 

Phil C. McNasty

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Phil C. McNasty

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Again, you mention carpet bombing when you know full well it is NOT happening. Once one sees that nonsense, the rest of your post goes under "waste of time to read"
@Kautilya doesnt understand that you need B-52 bombers to do heavy carpet-bombing.
And Israel doesnt have any B-52's in their Air Force: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_Air_Force

Kautilya is a light-weight debater who needs to do more research before spouting his nonsense

 
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Frankfooter

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You mean the strategy of sacrificing the citizens of Gaza? The strategy of not giving a shit how many Gazan women and children die? The strategy of using them as human shields while they hide like rats in their sewers/tunnels? The strategy of stealing humanitarian aid meant for the people that you worry about because of them not getting food and water?

And you support these Hamas vermin who use such a strategy?
Stop with the wife beater's defence.

Israel is the military occupying power, they have the nukes, tanks, missiles and drones and now 'bunker buster' bombs from Genocide Joe.
Israel is choosing genocide.
You are backing them.

You are supporting the most evil crime humans can do to other humans.

Genocide is now being debated in the MSM, including CBC.
Trudeau and Biden are now liable for aiding genocide.

 

Frankfooter

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And you've already said that you don't really care about that.

The more that die, the more propaganda you have.
Stop with the lying.
Ceasefire.
Stop killing people.

End the occupation.
End apartheid.

Arrest the leaders of both sides and charge to the maximum of the law.
Stop killing children.

Stop the genocide.
 

Knuckle Ball

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Sarandon isnt sorry about her anti-semitism, she's sorry she got dropped by her agency.
Lucky for her she doesnt have much of a career left to lose though

What are you complaining about? That ignorant twat voted for Trump back in 2016.
 
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Phil C. McNasty

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Frankfooter

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Israel is carefully following the Geneva Convention by giving evacuation warnings for the parts of Gaza they're going to strike next.

Warning you are going to hit civilian targets doesn't make it not a war crime to hit civilian targets.
Israel also repeatedly kills Palestinians in the zones they declare safe.

These posts are designed for you to make Israel supporters feel better.
As a lawyer, you should know better.

You also copied and pasted a map with a plan for ethnic cleansing printed on it.
You posted a war crime as if it were totally fine.

Look at your map and look at the zone in the Sinai.
Israel's map includes a zone where they want to push the Palestinians of Gaza.




 
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mandrill

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mandrill

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The experts are actually saying that Israel IS infact breaching international law and infact committing genocide. Your buddies in your Righteous Capitalist Jewish Self-Defence via Carpet Bombing Against Fictional Genocide League may say different, to justify Western support for Israel, but the actual experts say different.

I don't respect that expert. He has his own agenda.

Except there are no snipers shooting at kids from 100 meters across the Gaza border. If there was, you could, for example do two things. a) Evacuate the kids. b) Use an Israeli sniper to take him out. What you don't do however is drop a 2000lb JDAM on the suspected building, and the surrounding block, killing 500 civilians in the process, to get to that 1 guy. That is a war crime. When there are other options, you pursue those other options, instead of mass killing people. I get that your Righteous Capitalist Jewish Self-Defence via Carpet Bombing Against Fictional Genocide League don't agree, but that is exactly why this is a war crime.
No, there are indeed no snipers shooting from across the border. That was a simple example for simple people. There are rockets being fired and raids being planned. Therefore, Israel's self defence involves destroying that capability.

That wasn't the intent you were talking about. You were talking about Hamas' intent to sacrifice civilians. That is your speculation. Civilians dying is a direct result of Israeli actions and decisions. Not Hamas.
What do you realistically expect Israel to do when it is attacked. Any and all countries are going to take out the source of the attacks. HAMAS knew this and provoked the Israeli attack.
The creation of Israel itself is a colonial endeavour, so of course anti-colonialism applies. This is also a sectarian conflict that has raged on for over a 100 years. Race, ethnicity, religion, culture and land are the points of conflict and therefore anti-racism also applies.
How is Israel a "colonial endeavour"?

I realize that the Workers' Action Committee on Support for Trans Indigenous Oppressed Nations and the Liberation of Palestine calls the struggle "anti colonialism", where is the colonial element?

The Ottomans - who actually were an imperial power - are long gone and the Brits left in 1947, having only been there for 40 years.

But that is irrelevant to the questions I asked you.

I asked you two questions and you gave me a non-answer:

a) How is it justified for Israel to kill innocent civilians and children?
b) Do you think Israel was dumb enough to play into your stated Hamas strategy of getting them to kill kids?
I answer you. But you don't process my answers and continually re ask the same questions. That's not my fault.
 

mandrill

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Aug 23, 2001
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Stop with the wife beater's defence.

Israel is the military occupying power, they have the nukes, tanks, missiles and drones and now 'bunker buster' bombs from Genocide Joe.
Israel is choosing genocide.
You are backing them.

You are supporting the most evil crime humans can do to other humans.

Genocide is now being debated in the MSM, including CBC.
Trudeau and Biden are now liable for aiding genocide.

How is it "genocide", Frankie?

The IDF is giving warnings to the Palestinian civilians to vacate and are engaging military targets.
 
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Leimonis

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How is Israel a "colonial endeavour"?
And how is it that all the North American bleeding hearts hamas lovers don’t leave America to the indigenous Americans and fuck off back to Europe or wherever they came from?
 
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y2kmark

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May 19, 2002
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The experts are actually saying that Israel IS infact breaching international law and infact committing genocide. Your buddies in your Righteous Capitalist Jewish Self-Defence via Carpet Bombing Against Fictional Genocide League may say different, to justify Western support for Israel, but the actual experts say different.




Except there are no snipers shooting at kids from 100 meters across the Gaza border. If there was, you could, for example do two things. a) Evacuate the kids. b) Use an Israeli sniper to take him out. What you don't do however is drop a 2000lb JDAM on the suspected building, and the surrounding block, killing 500 civilians in the process, to get to that 1 guy. That is a war crime. When there are other options, you pursue those other options, instead of mass killing people. I get that your Righteous Capitalist Jewish Self-Defence via Carpet Bombing Against Fictional Genocide League don't agree, but that is exactly why this is a war crime.



That wasn't the intent you were talking about. You were talking about Hamas' intent to sacrifice civilians. That is your speculation. Civilians dying is a direct result of Israeli actions and decisions. Not Hamas.



The creation of Israel itself is a colonial endeavour, so of course anti-colonialism applies. This is also a sectarian conflict that has raged on for over a 100 years. Race, ethnicity, religion, culture and land are the points of conflict and therefore anti-racism also applies.

But that is irrelevant to the questions I asked you.

I asked you two questions and you gave me a non-answer:

a) How is it justified for Israel to kill innocent civilians and children?
b) Do you think Israel was dumb enough to play into your stated Hamas strategy of getting them to kill kids?



You are a guy who posts racist vitriol on this thread and gloats on the deaths of children. I go by international law and actual evidence.



Of course it is happening. There are 15,000+ dead people. Over 30,000 wounded. The imagery of carpet bombing from WW 2 movies you have in your head, with B-52s dropping tons of bombs, is not the only way you can carpet bomb a place. How about if it makes you feel better, we call it indiscriminate bombing instead of carpet bombing? Happy?

This is from 3 weeks ago. Watch what the UN envoy has to say.

Well, Turks are supposed to be experts on carpet, but I don't see why the Zionist army wouldn't use good ol' made in the USA precision guided munitions. These have been determined by some to be neither terror weapons nor weapons of mass destruction. Guess that depends on who they're pointed at...
 
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