Modi scolds Trudeau over Sikh protests in Canada against India

[Darts]

but that back in India (even in the Punjab region) it is not a particularly big issue.

It is not a "big" issue back in India because people who advocate Khalistan are killed or worse.

"The movement was suppressed by an Indian government crackdown that saw thousands of people killed, including prominent Sikh leaders."
Murder of B.C. Sikh leader puts Khalistan movement in spotlight. What is it? (msn.com)

 

[oil&gas]

Why Canadians Should be Worried by Trudeau's Claim.

 

[MRBJX]

Do you stand with Modi or Trudeau on this issue, darts?

why would you stand with either of those two at all

 

[MRBJX]

This smells like trudeau doing a favor for his lap dog.

 

[DesRicardo]

Why Canadians Should be Worried by Trudeau's Claim.

Jagmeet is a khalistani leader? Can someone verify this?

I'd want my own separate country too so I can avoid this annoying witch.

 

[Darts]

The majority of Sikhs in India neither care about the Khalistan movement nor support it.
Did they ever have a secret ballot referendum like we did in Quebec? Would it be a free and fair referendum if they had one?

Scotland has had at least one (maybe two) referendum.

BTW you said "killed or worse". What could be worse than killing?
Gallow humour.

 

[Butler1000]

Firstly, we don't know if India did it. We dont have evidence and India has denied responsibility.

Secondly, I would condemn it wholeheartedly if it was infact a political assassination. But it is not.

It is just another dirtbag terrorist. I am not going to feel sorry for him, or consider it a huge violation of Canadian sovereignty even if India did it, the same way I did not care that the US went into Pakistan to kill Bin Laden. These terrorists commit war against the state. There is also the fact that Nijjar was most likely not even Canadian and was living here illegally and conspiring to kill people and attack other countries.

I am also surprised you would consider a guy who claims to be Canadian, and belongs to a terrorist organization that killed Canadians as being more Canadian than me. I dont think you thought that through.

So you would support killing every Iranian working against the regime killed by Iran on Canadian soil if it happened. Because they were terrorists? How about Russians killing Ukrainians? Chinese killing dissidents?

 

[DesRicardo]

I agree with your last statement. With her smugness and her scoffing. She is what we call Godi media in India. God (prounounced Godh), means lap. Godi media means lapdog media and it is also a play on Modi. lol.

But as she says, the majority of Canadian or Indian Sikhs do not care for Khalistan.

As for Jagmeet, I know he has tweeted in favour of Khalistanis before. I would consider him a sympathizer because it is very difficult to tie him directly to the movement. He is careful that way. Remember a lot of the Sikhs in Canada, especially the ones who came here in the 60s, 70s and 80s were all primarily Khalistanis fleeing India.

Why is it ok for you to call Khalistanis terrorist, but not the Indian majority hindu's that abuse, murdered and raped Khalistanis?

 

[Frankfooter]

Firstly, we don't know if India did it. We dont have evidence and India has denied responsibility.

Secondly, I would condemn it wholeheartedly if it was infact a political assassination. But it is not.

It is just another dirtbag terrorist. I am not going to feel sorry for him, or consider it a huge violation of Canadian sovereignty even if India did it, the same way I did not care that the US went into Pakistan to kill Bin Laden. These terrorists commit war against the state. There is also the fact that Nijjar was most likely not even Canadian and was living here illegally and conspiring to kill people and attack other countries.

I am also surprised you would consider a guy who claims to be Canadian, and belongs to a terrorist organization that killed Canadians as being more Canadian than me. I dont think you thought that through.

Its really weird the people on this board who seem to be fairly liberal until it gets personal and tribal. The Israel threads are full of posters who are generally quite liberal and anti racist, until it gets to that one country.
Now you're doing a bit of the same thing, going from someone who argued really clearly and fairly about immigration and immigrant rights to this. Now you seem to be coming down heavy on Sikhs and calling Nijjar, who has been a Canadian citizen longer than you it appears, a 'terrorist'. Sikh independence has a long and fairly violent road, as has the reaction to them in India but I've yet to hear anything suggesting Nijjar was a terrorist or militant. The IRA and Nelson Mandela were called terrorists at one point. Wasn't even Ghandi? But backing Modi, a populist pushing anti Muslim rhetoric and then calling Sikh's terrorists doesn't make your argument very trustworthy.

Canada has had separatists in Quebec for decades, and other than that brief FLQ time, its been peaceful.
You should argue to watch and/or investigate if you're really worried. But then you should also take a stand against Modi or at least note that side of him if you want to be taken seriously as unbiased.

 

[anon1]

 

[Not getting younger]

Few things.
why is it, when it’s fairly apparent or when it’s obvious, someone has knowledge or insight on a particular subject. The default isn’t “hey, they might have knowledge or insight that I could benefit from?” That doesn’t make said person right or wrong, it’s just means they have insight/knowledge. Whether that’s lawyers here, Union members/reps, or in this case, someone with a cultural background.

And obviously Kautilya and I aren’t golf buddies. That said, without touching on the politics involved, remember Che Guevara.

One persons terrorist, is another’s freedom fighter. Pretty sure, by most definitions colonialist in 1775 located in North America were terrorist. They won, and are instead called Americans today. And terrorism, well theirs anyways is celebrated.

Terrorism, by definition are acts of violence for political gain. More so, if civilians are involved.

 

[Frankfooter]

I am not coming down heavy on Sikhs. My brother in law is Sikh. Sikhs are not Khalistanis. Khalistanis are Sikhs.

Sikhs in India, do not care for the Khalistan movement. They are the ones living in India. They don't care. My brother in law does not care and infact is against the Khalistani movement.

This movement is only popular amongst the Sikh diaspora in the west. None of the people supporting Khalistan in this diaspora are actually Indian citizens. So even if Khalistan was formed tomorrow, do you think they will immediately pack their bags and move back? So who are they fighting for when the majority of Sikhs that actually matter (the ones living there) do not even support the movement?

Nijjar is a terrorist because he has been implicated in multiple targeted killings in India. Infact, the chief minister of Punjab (Amarinder Singh, who is a Sikh himself) gave Trudeau a list of most wanted persons with this guys name on it. Regardless of all that, it is well known that the Khalistanis (who are Canadian citizens) were responsible for the bombing of Air India Flight 182. 329 people died. 288 of them Canadians. Is that a terrorist attack or no? If that was a terrorist attack, it follows that the Khalistani movement is a terrorist movement and belonging to that group automatically makes you a terrorist. So given all these guys are Canadian citizens that does make them a domestic terror group yet to be designated as one by the Canadian govt.

Now all of that does not justify India acting on Canadian soil. I agree with that. But if it did happen that India was responsible for the death of this guy, I am still not going to feel sorry or outraged.

I am not being tribal here. The Khalistanis are the tribal ones.

Sikhs are INDIANS. They are NOT Khalistanis. Regardless of what religion you belong to, regardless of how Modi and his Hindu Nationalists behave, we are bound by one common identity (among others), that we are Indian. I think that is the right position to take.

I had also thought the Khalistanis were more cartoonish than serious, which is why I'm surprised that India or Modi would take them seriously enough to risk an assassination.
Nijjar was supposedly meeting with CSIS weekly because of threats against him.
But wasn't most of that from the state of India, including India warning JT about 8 Sikh separatists.

The terrorist allegation doesn't seem to fit this case.

 

[lomotil]

I don't think Modi has any influence or control over Indian immigration into Canada.

Tell me about the caste system and how it impacts Canada? IIRC, BC just banned caste-based discrimination in the province.

I think something may be happening.https://globalnews.ca/news/9973179/india-canada-travel-advisory/

 

[mandrill]

I am not coming down heavy on Sikhs. My brother in law is Sikh. Sikhs are not Khalistanis. Khalistanis are Sikhs.

Sikhs in India, do not care for the Khalistan movement. They are the ones living in India. They don't care. My brother in law does not care and infact is against the Khalistani movement.

This movement is only popular amongst the Sikh diaspora in the west. None of the people supporting Khalistan in this diaspora are actually Indian citizens. So even if Khalistan was formed tomorrow, do you think they will immediately pack their bags and move back? So who are they fighting for when the majority of Sikhs that actually matter (the ones living there) do not even support the movement?

Nijjar is a terrorist because he has been implicated in multiple targeted killings in India. Infact, the chief minister of Punjab (Amarinder Singh, who is a Sikh himself) gave Trudeau a list of most wanted persons with this guys name on it. Regardless of all that, it is well known that the Khalistanis (who are Canadian citizens) were responsible for the bombing of Air India Flight 182. 329 people died. 288 of them Canadians. Is that a terrorist attack or no? If that was a terrorist attack, it follows that the Khalistani movement is a terrorist movement and belonging to that group automatically makes you a terrorist. So given all these guys are Canadian citizens that does make them a domestic terror group yet to be designated as one by the Canadian govt.

Now all of that does not justify India acting on Canadian soil. I agree with that. But if it did happen that India was responsible for the death of this guy, I am still not going to feel sorry or outraged.

I am not being tribal here. The Khalistanis are the tribal ones asking for a theocratic ethno-state. Me advocating for a multireligious, multiethnic, multicultural pluralistic India, that is inclusive of Sikhs, is the opposite of tribal.

Sikhs are INDIANS. They are NOT Khalistanis. There is no independence movement nor is any independence required, as they are already independent as Indians. Punjab is a VERY integrated state in India. The idea of Khalistan was born in the 1930s along with the "two nation theory" that led to the formation of Pakistan. So the Sikhs wanted a separate state as well, but their movement never had any widespread support because they were a minority. Infact, Punjab before the partition in 1947, spanned both India and Pakistan and over 52% of that state went to Pakistan during partition. The majority of the Sikhs, left Pakistan and moved to the Indian state of Punjab, where they were STILL the minorities. Their initial fear was that they would become 2nd class citizens and lose their culture, but this is clearly not the case today. Sikhs have their distinct culture that Indians actually appreciate. Sikhs are respected, well liked and successful, which is why they themselves don't care for a separate Khalistan.

Yes, the 1984 anti-Sikh riots were horrible. India has had a few of those religious riots, Muslims suffering the most. That was indeed shameful. India is yet to bring to justice people who committed those crimes. But in my opinion that is a long forgotten chapter. Such things won't happen today.

Regardless of what religion you belong to, regardless of how Modi and his Hindu Nationalists behave, we are bound by one common identity (among others), that we are Indian. And any group that threatens the stability and integrity of that identity and worse, attacks the nation and its peoples, are terrorists.

I think that is the right position to take.

Didn't the Hindu mobs douse Sikh women and children with gasoline and burn them alive in 1984?

Doesn't sound like a happy, well functioning state to me.

 

[silentkisser]

It is, but other G20 countries are treading carefully. Already they let Modi get away with a Russia friendly statement about Ukraine. They don't want it to turn into a North/South thing.
It'll be interesting to see how this plays out, I don't see it as major for Canada yet.

It could be though. I know a lot of investment is turning away from China and were eyeing India as a better option. If things go further off the rails, who knows how this could turn out. Modi is not a great leader, very authoritarian and he's a Hindu-supremacist.

 

[Butler1000]

All of those would be political assassinations. So I wouldn't support it.

OTOH the Khalistan movement is a Sikh separatist, militant terrorist group who have killed 288 Canadians.

They aren't remotely the same.

This is the definition of a political assassination.

 

[silentkisser]

The Sikhs who conducted the worst terror attacks, were Canadian citizens. India does not offer dual citizenship so they renounced their Indian citizenship and became Canadians. So the question is why are a) Canadian citizens asking for India to be balkanized and destabilized? and b) Why is the Canadian government enabling them?

BTW the restrictions on minorities in India are really a myth that western media plays up. I am a minority and almost all of my family lives in India. We have no issues.

Serious question: How is Canada enabling them? They haven't broken any laws here regarding the Khalistan movement. How would we clamp down on this? I respect Sikhs, everyone of them I've met or worked with are fantastic people. Generous and kind. I'm not really in favour of this Khalistan stuff, and I agree, the Air India bombing was a horrific attempt to get back at India over the Golden Temple incident...

As for how minorities are treated: What about how the government is treating muslims? And after that, how will they treat the christians?

 

[lomotil]

Long after Trudeau is gone, peoples with roots from the Indian subcontinent in Canada whether they are Hindu, Sikh, Muslim or Tamil (there is a already a massive and influential presence which is rapidly growing) will have a profound effect on the socioeconomic and political culture of Canada. Expect some of the conflicts from back home to be imported to Canada and expect some of the politicians to exploit them.

 

[Anbarandy]

Its really weird the people on this board who seem to be fairly liberal until it gets personal and tribal. The Israel threads are full of posters who are generally quite liberal and anti racist, until it gets to that one country.
Now you're doing a bit of the same thing, going from someone who argued really clearly and fairly about immigration and immigrant rights to this. Now you seem to be coming down heavy on Sikhs and calling Nijjar, who has been a Canadian citizen longer than you it appears, a 'terrorist'. Sikh independence has a long and fairly violent road, as has the reaction to them in India but I've yet to hear anything suggesting Nijjar was a terrorist or militant. The IRA and Nelson Mandela were called terrorists at one point. Wasn't even Ghandi? But backing Modi, a populist pushing anti Muslim rhetoric and then calling Sikh's terrorists doesn't make your argument very trustworthy.

Canada has had separatists in Quebec for decades, and other than that brief FLQ time, its been peaceful.
You should argue to watch and/or investigate if you're really worried. But then you should also take a stand against Modi or at least note that side of him if you want to be taken seriously as unbiased.

I would describe his defense of anything that impugns the reputation, integrity, credibility and the overarching awesomeness of India as rabid, rabidly nationalistic.

I have noticed this prior to and outside of this thread.

India has the world's 3rd worst air pollution, only surpassed by Bangladesh and Pakistan as measured by estimated PM2.5 particles- micrograms per cubic meter. India is home to 22 of the world's 30 most polluted cities, India's toxic air kills almost 2 million people each year.

Instead on fixating on fanciful trips to the moon, extra-judicial murder on another country's soil and craven financial and economic opportunism disguised under the banner of long-standing non-alignment, India really should allieve the suffering of it's own people such as:

 

[Darts]

I would describe his defense of anything that impugns the reputation, integrity, credibility and the overarching awesomeness of India as rabid, rabidly nationalistic.

I have noticed this prior to and outside of this thread.

And he often yells racism and/or racist too.